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Kettlebell is there a road map to progress

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AlexBarnett

AlexBarnett

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hello new here. I have been using kettlebells on and off decided to get back into and do it right. So I read Simple and Sinister getting ready to start it. But I read somewhere I think bret jones said you should do 1000 hip hinges, 100 goblet squats and the book said 100 naked get-ups before you start S&S. Is this right? I understand the goals for S&S. But Do finish the simple goal then go to rite of passage and full fill that goal and then go back the sinster goal after finish ROP or do you keep doing S&S while doing ROP? what is after that certifcation or more training.
 
Hi Alex, +1 to the MTB avatar! There are some older threads here in the forum on how MTB and S&S go very well together.

Here is some advice on getting started from another recent thread: S&S and some beginner advice

So, yes, spending some time on the movement patterns before loading them will do you good. How much time exactly is an individual thing. The S&S book has guidance on progression.

Yes, Simple goal... and many people do ROP after that, for presses and snatching... Sinister, if you wish to pursue... but this can literally take years, so no need to plan out that far. SFG certification is also a great goal; after meeting the Simple goal you will likely be ready for additional work that can help you prepare.

Are you able to attend any of the 1-day StrongFirst courses, particularly the kettlebell course? Highly recommended.

And stick around here -- you'll learn a lot!
 
Personal assessment, then goal; then S&S or ROP or ETK or PTTP or Simply Strong or anything of Al Ciampa's or Pavel Tsatsouline's ...etc., etc.
There are simply too many tools in the toolbox to choose one without knowing what you're using it for. I'm in the midst of trying to sort out my own confusion presently.
 
I am currently doing some 5X5 training 3 days week( squat, bench, overhead press, deadlift, and barbell rows) and I mountain bike at least minimum 2 days usually more. I was looking into a class thats happening in modesto in october but its over 100 miles away. I did look up SFG coach in my area. Hes about 40 miles away. I will have to email find out if he does any teaching.
 
Did my first S&S workout last night 5x10 2 hand swings 24kg and 5x 1L, 1R 16kg. Swings felt good little breathy by 4th round. Turkish get-ups were shaky for the first 1 left and 1 right set. By the time I got to fifth round I felt I got a handle on it with breathing and loading the shoulder which seems to be the key for me. All in all it felt pretty good. It took about 20 minutes. I took longer breaks between each arm when I was doing the getups. No sure if this was suppose to happen but when I was done i felt refreshed and my body felt aligned if that makes sense. So I will be at it again tonight. Let the long narrow journey begin.
 
Sounds just right, Alex.

If you ever want a form check, just upload a video somewhere and post a link here. You'll get good feedback.
 
AlexBarnett said:
... But I read somewhere I think bret jones said you should do 1000 hip hinges, 100 goblet squats and the book said 100 naked get-ups before you start S&S....
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Don't mean to hijack the thread, but does anyone know if @Brett Jones means: (1) to just do that many perfect reps in any number of days for pattern training; (2) to do that many perfect reps in one day/training-session; or (3) to do that many perfect reps in one set?

From the article MattM posted, it seems like he means either (2) or (3), but I really can't tell.

Sorry for being pedantic, but when people like Brett Jones make recommendations, I like to be sure I really get what they're saying.
 
kodo kb said:
Don't mean to hijack the thread, but does anyone know if @Brett Jones means: (1) to just do that many perfect reps in any number of days for pattern training; (2) to do that many perfect reps in one day/training-session; or (3) to do that many perfect reps in one set?

From the article MattM posted, it seems like he means either (2) or (3), but I really can't tell.

Sorry for being pedantic, but when people like Brett Jones make recommendations, I like to be sure I really get what they're saying.
Click to expand...

Right after that quote: "This may take a few weeks or a few months."
 
AlexBarnett said:
I read somewhere I think bret jones said you should do 1000 hip hinges, 100 goblet squats and the book said 100 naked get-ups before you start S&S. Is this right?
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Yes. Before Starting any program you need to develop competence in the movements you will be training.
While the numbers you mentioned are excellent guidelines I would focus less on actual numbers such as 1000 reps of this or 100 reps of that and focus more on spending about 2-weeks of practicing the hip hinges (deadlift & swing), squats and unloaded getups (bodyweight, shoe, dixie cup or water bottle variations as well). The goal is to not simply practice them until you get them right on occasion, but aim for practicing until you can’t get them wrong. Perfection is not the goal, just techniques that are consistently safe and competent, THEN you’re ready to begin Simple & Sinister.
 
QUESTION:
AlexBarnett said:
I understand the goals for S&S. But Do finish the simple goal then go to rite of passage and full fill that goal and then go back the sinster goal after finish ROP or do you keep doing S&S while doing ROP?
Click to expand...


ANSWER:
It is not necessary to complete a goal outlined in a program such as the “Simple” or “Sinister” standard from S&S or the SSST & 1/2 bodyweight press from ROP before starting another program, just stick with a program for 6 weeks or more and make progress. If you made progress, it was a success. If you didn’t, try to learn why… then that too becomes a success because it lays the groundwork for succeeding in the future. At that point either continue the program or shift to another.

Training and programming are as much an art-form as a science so there are at least as many road maps to success through kettlebell training as there are SFGs on this forum. It all depends on your goal and where you are relative to your ultimate destination. Pick a program that suits you, take it as far you can or desire. Then re-assess. At that point continue along your current path (stay on the same program) or make adjustments and re-route (a.k.a. Choose a different program), continually getting closer to your ultimate goal. That being said... S&S lays an excellent foundation for the ROP.


Here’s one of many possible paths
S&S for 4 to 6 Weeks, PTTP, [ during both of these just practice the other fundamental KB techniques]
then ROP for a few months, Easy Strength for 40 days, choose another.

There’s no right or wrong, only what you will follow and what works for your goals.


Note: If you’re goal is SFG certification, then you will need a program that specifically prepares you for the tests involved.

QUESTION:
AlexBarnett said:
what is after that certifcation or more training.
Click to expand...

After you achieve the Sinister Standard you are one bad mamma-jamma.
There is no definitive prescribed or recommend path as everyone's goals are unique.
There are many SFGs who've yet to complete Sinister standard, so SFG certification does not necessarily precede or follow the Sinister standard, but completing the Simple Standard would go a long ways to preparing you for the SFG cert.

After the certification, is a personal choice; there is no definitive prescribed or recommended path. Some go on to conquer one or more of the other certs and re-certifying the Level I skills with greater finesse and strength.

After S&S I would personally recommend Taking a User Course, put what you've learned into practice for some time, then either take another user course, Cert or train with a SFG.

One of the most under appreciated certs and user course in my opinion is the SFB (bodyweight). Understanding how to generate tension with Bodyweight alone is the core (pun intended) of hardstyle. Something that is often missed by those who have only experienced generating tension with the external load of bells. The SFB will upgrade your software and hardware improving all manner of lifts you choose to tackle in the future.
 
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Well tomorrow will be one week of doing simple protocol. last night I thought I would give myself a test and see how I would do at the level I am currently at (9X10 2 handed swings and 5x 1L,1R Turkish get-ups). To see if i could get it done in the time frame in the protocol 5 min. swings, 1 min. rest, and 10 min. Turkish get-ups. I really thought I would have been able to do it since I was doing alot less than the required. Well that was not the case. I did 9X10 2 handed swings in 5 min. 48 secs and Turkish Get-ups 5X 1L,1R in 11 minutes 22 seconds. At least now I know what I am up against. From what I learned from this test I gave myself is that I could give myself a little less rest time between swing sets which is very doable. Also on the get-ups I need to be alot faster and its going to take awhile to feel like I own these moves before I move up to the next KB. Today I will be moving up another set from 9x10 to 10x10 set of 2 handed swings and staying at the same sets 5x 1L, 1R for get ups. If I feel good tonight maybe tomorrow move up to 5X 1L, 1R.
 
Alex, I know exactly where you are at as far as wanting to see where this may take you, what is the right course, and what can I expect. Don't get caught up on those numbers. Although I believe the 5 min swing number is a good gauge as to when to possibly advance in weight, there are other things to consider such as your form. As you get heavier a small flaw can cause problems down the line. Particularly in the TGU, it is better to move slowly and smoothly. So when you can do this with a weight, even if it takes12 min., you may be ready to add the next size bell for a couple reps in following sessions. Take the advice to post some video and hopefully you'll receive some helpful feedback from one of the SFG's, which I am not. Be patient, I'm not saying you aren't. But, take your time and enjoy.
 
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Well I have been doing S&C getting close to a month now. Been working my way up too doing all single arm swings and all sets for swings 24kg and getups 16kg. I have read a couple of books Kettlebell muscle, enter the kettlebell, getting ready to read Return of the kettlebell. Trying to come up with money so I can go to modesto,ca for kettlebell course but it does look its going happen since some stuff came up. But in positive note getting pretty excited about kettlebell practice. I am like kid that wants to do all right now. But I a m not even close to where I need to be with strength and don't want to rush it. I did find kettlebell gym thats about 45 minutes from me that I am trying to make some time to go check it out. The instructors there are RKC so I should be able to get checked out depending how much it costs. So I invested in two more Kettlebells a 28kg and a 32kg. Planning for the future. Just giving you a up date. i also started a training log here in the forum.
 
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