Bodyweight Who is currently doing Naked Warrior and what do you think?

[Kozushi]

I don't think it's a very good calisthenics program, for many reasons.

It's a really fun read though. It exudes rhetoric. Just don't get carried away by all the absurdity Wade writes 0_o

Could you write, say, one or two reasons why it doesn't strike you as an ideal programme? (Like I said, I'm reading it for entertainment and insight, not for a new programme to follow, since I've already got good stuff going for me from S&S and NW.)

 

[305pelusa]

Could you write, say, one or two reasons why it doesn't strike you as an ideal programme? (Like I said, I'm reading it for entertainment and insight, not for a new programme to follow, since I've already got good stuff going for me from S&S and NW.)

The programming is its biggest downfall. Or lack thereof. You just do 2-3 hard sets of each move weekly, until you reach the OACU, OAPU, etc. I think that's unlikely.

The progressions are rather lackluster. The Leg Raise one is all right though. Not too bad.

This is overly critical, I agree. It's just that there's some excellent calisthenics programs out there by Daniel Vadnal, Tom Merrick, GMB, Steven Low, etc. Some of these are even free! So the bar is already high in that respect.

 

[Kozushi]

The programming is its biggest downfall. Or lack thereof. You just do 2-3 hard sets of each move weekly, until you reach the OACU, OAPU, etc. I think that's unlikely.

The progressions are rather lackluster. The Leg Raise one is all right though. Not too bad.

This is overly critical, I agree. It's just that there's some excellent calisthenics programs out there by Daniel Vadnal, Tom Merrick, GMB, Steven Low, etc. Some of these are even free! So the bar is already high in that respect.

I see. Thank you for sharing that. It's just one guy's experience so there quite likely are indeed other or better ways to achieve the goals faster.

 

[pet']

Hello,

@Kozushi
To echo @305pelusa 's post, for instance the OAC progression is just unrealistic IMO. I stalled about step 7.

The pistol one is not that bad but requires good hip flexibility.

Related to OAP, I did not try because I learnt with a mix of "by myself" and Pavel.

Kind regards,

Pet'

 

[Marc]

Regarding CC: IMHO the progressions outlined don't seem to be too good. Like the one for OAPU: The lever pushup just does not seem to be specific enough for a OAPU. It does not teach you the right groove. I had a lot more success with elevated OAPU like Pavel recommends. I also find Pavel's approach and programming much more goal-orientated.

 

[Marc]

I must admit, I really love NK! I think this is one of those programs one could follow for the rest of his life and keep on making progress.

 

[Kristen Mitchell]

As far as slipping, you'll just have to find something that has more friction. I couldn't, so I didn't work up to the OAPU through elevations. But if you can find something, you should be ok.

As far as the hand is concerned, you might not be able to "twist" the arm in a corkscrew way since most of your palm won't be on the object. However, as long as you keep the shoulder packed ("depressed") and the elbow tucked (brushing against the lat), then it's the same thing. The corkscrew is just as more intuitive way of teaching those things above.

3 cents

Hi- I'm having this exact issue in my OAPU progression now. @305pelusa what was the alernative progression you used? I'm stalled at about the 30" mark right now and while practicing yesterday, I had a thought about how my hand is engaging with the elevated surface.

 

[Kozushi]

I must admit, I really love NK! I think this is one of those programs one could follow for the rest of his life and keep on making progress.

You mean Naked Warrior? Me too. I agree totally.

 

[305pelusa]

Regarding CC: IMHO the progressions outlined don't seem to be too good. Like the one for OAPU: The lever pushup just does not seem to be specific enough for a OAPU. It does not teach you the right groove. I had a lot more success with elevated OAPU like Pavel recommends. I also find Pavel's approach and programming much more goal-orientated.

Really? I actually thought the Lever Pushup is an excellent idea and rather intuitive. To go from two arm to one arm push-ups, it made a lot of sense to me to simply assist less and less with my hand. If I may ask, why is it that you say it does not teach the correct groove?

@Kristen Mitchell : I simply did assisted OAPUs on the floor, helping with my unloaded hand as needed. At some point I got pretty close to the OAPU, at which point I switched to negatives and holds. And then one day I got one. I don't think the OAPU progressions need to be very complex. Out of laziness and my feet slipping, I never cared to figure out box heights and so on 0_o

 

[305pelusa]

You mean Naked Warrior? Me too. I agree totally.

It's interesting that people swear by the OAPU at SF. But when you look at the calisthenics community, hardly anybody does them.

I don't know if it's because everyone spends more time with Planche work, or working on the HSPU progressions. But it is nowhere near as popular as it is in SF.

It's interesting how the Bodyweight community has shifted towards more gymnastics oriented training.

 

[Kozushi]

It's interesting that people swear by the OAPU at SF. But when you look at the calisthenics community, hardly anybody does them.

I don't know if it's because everyone spends more time with Planche work, or working on the HSPU progressions. But it is nowhere near as popular as it is in SF.

It's interesting how the Bodyweight community has shifted towards more gymnastics oriented training.

I'm not a mere blind follower of Pavel and SF, of course. From my understanding,

• (1) the one arm pushup loads an awful lot of weight onto the arm, 70% approximately of my bodyweight, giving me a great strength building exercise through it, and

• (2) it is a forward push, like the benchpress, which simply develops the upper body amazingly well - more than an overhead press does (including handstand pushups).

What are the key strength building gymnastics exercises used today by the callisthenics community?

By the way I was surprised today when a weightlifter friend of mine who deadlifts over 600lbs told me the one hand pushup is way beyond him.

The more I think about it and do it the more I'm impressed with the Naked Warrior theory and practice.

 

[305pelusa]

I'm not a mere blind follower of Pavel and SF, of course. From my understanding,

• (1) the one arm pushup loads an awful lot of weight onto the arm, 70% approximately of my bodyweight, giving me a great strength building exercise through it, and

• (2) it is a forward push, like the benchpress, which simply develops the upper body amazingly well - more than an overhead press does (including handstand pushups).

I mean the OAPU is good for strength training. I think a lot of people who work with calisthenics are just more interested in Handbalancing and mobility feats. In that respect, the OAPU quickly loses value.

Don't get me wrong. Like I said, it's an excellent exercise. Anyone serious about Bodyweight training should pay their dues with the OAPU at some point!

What are the key strength building gymnastics exercises used today by the callisthenics community?

It varies, but most people seem to make the Planche and Front Lever their bread and butter. You also see plenty of vertical pull (OACU and weighted Pull-ups) and lots of HSPU work to balance that out

By the way I was surprised today when a weightlifter friend of mine who deadlifts over 600lbs told me the one hand pushup is way beyond him.

Haha, don't let this get to your head Kozushi. I don't know about you, but I'm farther from a 600 lb DL than your friend probably is from a OAPU. We all get good at our own disciplines.

 

[pet']

Hello,

OAOL PU and pistols are very effective moves. In my current bodyweight routine, I incorporated these two moves in mobility and strength very easily. They are extremely functional.

Kind regards,

Pet'

 

[Marc]

You mean Naked Warrior? Me too. I agree totally.

Yes, I mean Naked Warrior (=NW). Great program! If I was forced to choose one program to follow for the rest of my life I would go for NW!

 

[Marc]

Really? I actually thought the Lever Pushup is an excellent idea and rather intuitive. To go from two arm to one arm push-ups, it made a lot of sense to me to simply assist less and less with my hand. If I may ask, why is it that you say it does not teach the correct groove?

@Kristen Mitchell : I simply did assisted OAPUs on the floor, helping with my unloaded hand as needed. At some point I got pretty close to the OAPU, at which point I switched to negatives and holds. And then one day I got one. I don't think the OAPU progressions need to be very complex. Out of laziness and my feet slipping, I never cared to figure out box heights and so on 0_o

Actually OAPU and regular push ups are pretty different in their groove. That being said, a OAPU is not simply a regular pushup minus one arm. In a OAPU you rotate your shoulder towards the deck in the descent and then rotate it back as you come up. Doing lever pushups eliminates this crucial part. For me this is especially true since I am pretty tall with long arms (1.94m). However there are a lot of folks who get around great with that method. It simply does not work for me. One assisted version that works much better is placing your non working hand near to your tigh rather than straight out to your side. This keeps the rotational aspect. The nearer to your tigh, the more difficult the move becomes. You can even increase the difficulty by using only your fingertips on the assisting hand and then grafually use fewer fingers (i.e. 5 fingers, 3 fingers, ...)
Check out the OAPU part of the breacher strong dvd to see that in action.

 

[pet']

Hello,

I enjoy practicing them slowly. Doing them with steps (holding a few seconds at 1/2 ROM for instance) make them more intense. It obliges to breathe beyond the shield.

Kind regards,

Pet'

 

[Kozushi]

Yes, I mean Naked Warrior (=NW). Great program! If I was forced to choose one program to follow for the rest of my life I would go for NW!

At this point I agree. The muscular development in the visible upper body muscles I'm experiencing is past anything I've experienced. It only takes a few minutes a day if even that. What an AMAZING secret of strength!
I'm never stopping S&S though. NW interferes with it not at all, only adds to it and makes it work better.

 

[Kozushi]

I mean the OAPU is good for strength training. I think a lot of people who work with calisthenics are just more interested in Handbalancing and mobility feats. In that respect, the OAPU quickly loses value.

Don't get me wrong. Like I said, it's an excellent exercise. Anyone serious about Bodyweight training should pay their dues with the OAPU at some point!



It varies, but most people seem to make the Planche and Front Lever their bread and butter. You also see plenty of vertical pull (OACU and weighted Pull-ups) and lots of HSPU work to balance that out



Haha, don't let this get to your head Kozushi. I don't know about you, but I'm farther from a 600 lb DL than your friend probably is from a OAPU. We all get good at our own disciplines.

Interesting. I guess I have different overall goals from them. I used to do LOTS of chinups - actually they and their variations were my only workout for years. They're very good, but I'm finding the one hand pushup to simply build more strength and to build more practical strength too.

 

[305pelusa]

Actually OAPU and regular push ups are pretty different in their groove. That being said, a OAPU is not simply a regular pushup minus one arm. In a OAPU you rotate your shoulder towards the deck in the descent and then rotate it back as you come up. Doing lever pushups eliminates this crucial part. For me this is especially true since I am pretty tall with long arms (1.94m). However there are a lot of folks who get around great with that method. It simply does not work for me. One assisted version that works much better is placing your non working hand near to your tigh rather than straight out to your side. This keeps the rotational aspect. The nearer to your tigh, the more difficult the move becomes. You can even increase the difficulty by using only your fingertips on the assisting hand and then grafually use fewer fingers (i.e. 5 fingers, 3 fingers, ...)
Check out the OAPU part of the breacher strong dvd to see that in action.

I see. You're referring to the rotational challenge. That is missing, I agree. And there's no need to have the hand so extended out. Other than that, the grooves are pretty similar for there to be carry-over just fine. Some people supplement this training with some OAOL Planks, but it's not necessary.

In weight training, as you get stronger, you simply add weight to the exact same groove and get stronger. However, in calisthenics, it's very common to go through a variety of different progressions, some of which can be rather different in grooves a lot of times!

In general, working up to unilateral exercises through limb assist works just fine. Even at the very advanced levels (One-arm Chin-up), there are some who will craft pulleys to assist with a weight... the rest (and vast) majority of us simply use the unloaded arm for some help, and minimize that as time goes on. Doesn't train the rotational part as exactly but that's OK.

 

[305pelusa]

Interesting. I guess I have different overall goals from them. I used to do LOTS of chinups - actually they and their variations were my only workout for years. They're very good, but I'm finding the one hand pushup to simply build more strength and to build more practical strength too.

Yes, it's definitely about goals!

It's hard to compare the Chin up to the OAPU in terms of which one builds more practical strength. They're different exercises, with different purposes.
You seem to really enjoy the OAPU, which is absolutely awesome! I know that feeling of discovering an exercise that develops body tension and strength like nothing you've done before. I have a couple of pet exercises that do that like nothing else and it's an excellent experience!