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Kettlebell Kettlebells StrongFirst

Provx said:
Thank you for the detailed review. Sounds great, its hard to decide this program vs the giant, I suspect pavels is better for my body type as i do best with lower reps and very small amounts of lactic acid. The giant is getting rave reviews though.

when you say more variability to the getups, do you mean they wave in volume, or, that a different exercise is allowed such as push press’s? Ive come to the conclusion over the years the tgu isn’t for me.
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No, it is only TGU pactice (incl. partials), but with different bell sizes.

However, the program includes ideas for learning the skills of Push Press and C&J, and I guess you could replace your TGUs with that kind of practice.

Personally, I guess it could be a great long term approach to alternate between A+A style training (with C&J, Snatch or Swing) and density style training à la the Giant.
 
I just re-read the manual, and I'm still excited to get going on it in a couple months when my S&S wraps up (for a while anyway). However, I don't think I realized how much "easier" the standards are than S&S for when it's time to progress to advanced or LCCJ. Of course, it's not easy, but the standard for "intermediate" has me doing the same 100 swings with 32kg as the simple standard, but with 400% more rest as it is completed in 20 minutes, not 5 minutes. I guess one of the biggest differences would be that it is based on bodyweight, so it HAPPENS to be 32kg for me and wouldn't necessarily be that amount for everyone. It just has me excited because I feel like by the time I complete timeless simple, I should be able to jump right into the LCCJ progressions rather than starting with swings and TGU.

Edit: Sorry, I noticed that the 100 swings in 20 minutes is while passing the talk test the whole time, and timed simple is a matter of doing it, not necessarily while still passing the talk test (is is even possible to still pass the talk test?) so that definitely puts them at more even standards.
 
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KIWI5 said:
Where can this program be purchased?
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bjjfanatics.com

Kettlebell StrongFirst by Pavel Tsatsouline

The Russian kettlebell is the answer to all your strength and conditioning questions—when wielded skillfully and with expert programming by #1 authority Pavel Tsatsouline!-PRODUCT INCLUDES VIDEO & E-BOOK The Swing—for “hips and grips” The Get-Up—“No-one could hold me down” plus bullet-proof...
bjjfanatics.com bjjfanatics.com

ST. PATRICK’S DAY SALE - 38% Off All Videos Site-Wide With Code: PATRICK2021
 
BJJ Shawn said:
I just re-read the manual, and I'm still excited to get going on it in a couple months when my S&S wraps up (for a while anyway). However, I don't think I realized how much "easier" the standards are than S&S for when it's time to progress to advanced or LCCJ. Of course, it's not easy, but the standard for "intermediate" has me doing the same 100 swings with 32kg as the simple standard, but with 400% more rest as it is completed in 20 minutes, not 5 minutes. I guess one of the biggest differences would be that it is based on bodyweight, so it HAPPENS to be 32kg for me and wouldn't necessarily be that amount for everyone. It just has me excited because I feel like by the time I complete timeless simple, I should be able to jump right into the LCCJ progressions rather than starting with swings and TGU.
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I am currently close to owning the 24 kg on my S&S journey. Right now I like the idea of switching to the BJJ "Simple + Alactic" plan, if I may call it like that, late spring/early summer -- because the plan allows to use the 32 kg exclusively much earlier and it would be easier for me to carry a single bell outside into the sun (rather than farmer carrying my 32 +24 down a narrow staircase...). I am not sure about tweaking this plan, but I would like to have at least one day with sets of 10 - but let's see.
 
I'm keen to hear feedback from those who have been doing it for a while around how it impacts their actual BJJ training. Eg do you do it on your off/non-rolling days? Same day? Does it make you sore? Do you feel it takes away from your rolling if done same day? Does it add value etc?
I'm liking it myself and try to do it on non-rolling days but curious how others are balancing the two.
 
Bauer said:
I am currently close to owning the 24 kg on my S&S journey. Right now I like the idea of switching to the BJJ "Simple + Alactic" plan, if I may call it like that, late spring/early summer -- because the plan allows to use the 32 kg exclusively much earlier and it would be easier for me to carry a single bell outside into the sun (rather than farmer carrying my 32 +24 down a narrow staircase...). I am not sure about tweaking this plan, but I would like to have at least one day with sets of 10 - but let's see.
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Neupert’s “Swing Hard 1.1” is very similar to how Megan Kelly has outlined the A+A approach in the past - EMOM with a varied volume, working up to sets of 10 (depending how long you run it).
 
In the FAQ pavel says, that you can built in some barbell training how would you do that? Some easy strength or DDD or Pttp on rest days?

I love the program. I did one cycle and the did some pttp. Yesterday i started again and want to do this ptogram forvat least one year. I paired it with roadwork and pull ups. But i want to add some barbell lifts....
 
Mmabjj said:
In the FAQ pavel says, that you can built in some barbell training how would you do that? Some easy strength or DDD or Pttp on rest days?

I love the program. I did one cycle and the did some pttp. Yesterday i started again and want to do this ptogram forvat least one year. I paired it with roadwork and pull ups. But i want to add some barbell lifts....
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I think Megan Kelly, who trains StrongEndurance style, does TGUs and Goblet Squats daily and some barbell lifts once per week.

Are you doing the C&J or the Swings & Getups plan?

Maybe this template is of help to you. 2 days of grinds and 2 days of Conditioning (Strength Aerobics etc.). Just know your priorities and recovery abilites:
www.strongfirst.com

Total Package Weekly Kettlebell Training Template | StrongFirst

If strength and conditioning are equally important to you, this weekly kettlebell training template will serve you well. Includes 3 sample weeks.
www.strongfirst.com

Also, this article could help you finding the right parameters:
www.strongfirst.com

Q&D + Minimalist Deadlifts | StrongFirst

Ultralow deadlift volume can be enough to maintain, and likely improve, your pull. Here is how to add minimalist deadlifts to Q&D training.
www.strongfirst.com
 
I do the swing and get up protocol. I try to do two days a week of one light and one heavy bench and one light and one Heavy Squat, think of 3x5 reps.
 
With the swing and TGU protocol I did pttp style dead lifts 3x per week on the days I trained.

I avoid pull ups but at any giving time I can get 8-10, and any additional "arm" work never ends well for me. " manual laborer, bjj, and kettlebell training is enough on these elbows.

I tried doing easy stregnth along with it. Was more of a why am I doing so many lift in one day feeling over; a over training feeling, but maybe that was just a sign.

Moving onto the C+J next week and plan on TGUs w/ GS for a warm up. And 1x per week heavier TGU's and deadlifts on none C+J days. Haven't landed on a format yet 5x5, wendler, but will adjust until I land on something that fits.
 
Hi everybody, first time posting here :)
First of all, I've been using the program for two months now(using 2x24kg long cycle clean and jerks, switching to 2B recently) and definitely see good results on the mat!
Endurance is up, I recover faster between rounds and also move more explosively during sparring.

I have a question regarding the talk test and how it correlates to heart rate: during my 3 rep 30 min L&C session my heart rate(see attachment below) crept up to 90% of max during the last few sets. I still could recover my breath 10 sec before each set and talk in short sentences.
Question is: is there a heart rate which should not be exceeded that overrides the talk test? I know it's not supposed to be pure A&A as it is on the minute but do I loose the aerobic benefit if my sessions look like that?
Thanks in advance!
 

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I don't have a "technical" answer but I do 1 more set after HR doesn't recover below 150 prior to my set. I use 180-my age for this number. And/or I can no longer breath nasally. I use to use the HR monitor alot and have a fairly good feeling where I am, so it is not on ever session but used occasionally to make sure I am not way off of how 150 HR feels.
 
Jabulon said:
Hi everybody, first time posting here :)
First of all, I've been using the program for two months now(using 2x24kg long cycle clean and jerks, switching to 2B recently) and definitely see good results on the mat!
Endurance is up, I recover faster between rounds and also move more explosively during sparring.

I have a question regarding the talk test and how it correlates to heart rate: during my 3 rep 30 min L&C session my heart rate(see attachment below) crept up to 90% of max during the last few sets. I still could recover my breath 10 sec before each set and talk in short sentences.
Question is: is there a heart rate which should not be exceeded that overrides the talk test? I know it's not supposed to be pure A&A as it is on the minute but do I loose the aerobic benefit if my sessions look like that?
Thanks in advance!
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Yes, actually, it is explained in this article by Al Ciampa:

www.strongfirst.com

Simple & Sinister + Heart Rate Training | StrongFirst

This article will explain how to incorporate heart rate training into the Simple & Sinister program, and how to progress over time.
www.strongfirst.com
 
Jabulon said:
Question is: is there a heart rate which should not be exceeded that overrides the talk test? I know it's not supposed to be pure A&A as it is on the minute but do I loose the aerobic benefit if my sessions look like that?
Click to expand...
Hard to say, but I would guess that it should be ok. As far as I know the Al Ciampa article is not up to date.
I would guess that this pattern might be part of the plan. But I would be interested in a definitive answer, too!
 
Dann said:
I don't have a "technical" answer but I do 1 more set after HR doesn't recover below 150 prior to my set. I use 180-my age for this number. And/or I can no longer breath nasally. I use to use the HR monitor alot and have a fairly good feeling where I am, so it is not on ever session but used occasionally to make sure I am not way off of how 150 HR feels.
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Hm, makes sense! Essentially max MAF rate and stop when you hit it.

BJJ Shawn said:
Yes, actually, it is explained in this article by Al Ciampa:

www.strongfirst.com

Simple & Sinister + Heart Rate Training | StrongFirst

This article will explain how to incorporate heart rate training into the Simple & Sinister program, and how to progress over time.
www.strongfirst.com
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In that case it would be MAF rate plus 5!
In any case much lower than where I was at.
Bauer said:
Hard to say, but I would guess that it should be ok. As far as I know the Al Ciampa article is not up to date.
I would guess that this pattern might be part of the plan. But I would be interested in a definitive answer, too!
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Yeah, some confirmation from the authors of the program would be much appreciated for sure :)
 
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