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Programming Improv Need some advice on fitting Kettlebell training into my current routine

jaku

Level 4 Valued Member
Happy New Year!

Since I started my Crohn's disease treatment back in August, I slowly began to build my body back up. It's now the beginning of 2023, and this is what my program looks like.

Global Parameters:
2 sets of 5-7
3 min rest

Day 1:
Trap-Bar Deadlift (Dec 22 1RM 315lbs)!!!
Seated Leg Extension
Incline Press (Setting 3 -- High Angle)
Wide Grip Pulldown

Day 2:
Back Squat
Standing Leg Curl
Incline Press (Setting 5 -- Low angle)
Close Grip Row

I selected these exercises very specifically, and work in a rep range familiar to strength training, but at an intensity that also grants me hypertrophy (2RIR). And I must say, doing the bare minimum in terms of volume and keeping a simple approach to training has yielded some impressive results.

I'll be adding some arm and trap-specific work moving forward to develop those regions more. And on Days 3 and 4, I will train to achieve a back-bridge. I believe training my posterior chain and acquiring this skill is going to be really important for my longevity.

However, while I've gained muscle mass and strength, I've been wondering where can S&S fit in.

My hope is that S&S might help keep me lean as I gain weight, manage shoulder strength asymmetries, and build explosive power and endurance for when I have to deal with violence.

I'm curious to see what y'all think. I only lift two days out of the week (Tues, Sat), and now spend 2 days training specifically for the back bridge (Wed, Sun).

Edit: Feel free to ask any questions about why I've created my program this way, and if you have any specific ideas about fitting Kettlebell training into this I'd love to hear them! This is not a program I'd consider optimal for advanced strength-focused lifters (PlanStrong is better). I personally run this as a foundation hypertrophy/strength program that uses a low volume/linear progression model.

Side Note: I'm loosely following The Ludus as a guideline to keep me focused on what matters.
 
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What's the purpose of the leg extension? Why is a back-bridge important to your longevity?
 
What's the purpose of the leg extension? Why is a back-bridge important to your longevity?

Leg extensions and also leg curls are simply isolations that complement the compound movements. At its core, my program is a full-body hypertrophy program. So on the day that I deadlift, I also do quad-focused isolation on that day of a squat. The primary reason I do it this way is to avoid CNS fatigue.

As for training the back-bridge, there are a ton of benefits you get from being able to do this move well. For me, it's about everything I gain on the journey: hip mobility, spinal mobility (extension, rotation, lateral flexion), shoulder & rotator cuff strength and mobility, and general anterior chain flexibility as well. These are all things I currently lack. I believe that my body will be more resilient with these things than without.
 
How do you recover? How much effort does training the back bridge take?

If you are fresh, I think you could add 2 or 3 days a week of S&S and train the bridges at the end of the workout.

With your deadlift numbers, you could progress very quickly, but I think keeping the weight light and using it as a conditioning tool is where I would stay.
 
I'm aware of what the leg extension is, I just don't know if I understand the value of it in your routine. You would be better off with lunges, bulgarian split squats, cyclist squats, box step ups, goblet squats, etc. There are tons of ways to hit the quads that are better exercises and don't have a ton of load. Leg extensions value is after you have already done other better quad dominant movements and they're a finisher IMO.

I think there are a lot of people who don't do back bridges and have plenty of resiliency and longevity. Back in the day I ran Matt Furey's Combat Conditioning, where bridges are a big focus and it was quite honestly a waste of time.
 
How do you recover? How much effort does training the back bridge take?

If you are fresh, I think you could add 2 or 3 days a week of S&S and train the bridges at the end of the workout.

With your deadlift numbers, you could progress very quickly, but I think keeping the weight light and using it as a conditioning tool is where I would stay.

I recover fine. Progress is non-linear despite doing my best to progress linearly. I break my previous PRs quite often and sometimes hover at a weight for a couple of weeks just to chill out or focus on form and muscle activation. Sometimes I have bad days and then bounce back better than ever the next.

I think using it as a conditioning tool is exactly what I'd like. I'm not interested in doing impressive heavy TGUs or Swings. I just need to be powerful enough to knock the lights out of someone faster than they can say a word to me and have enough endurance to last about 90-120 seconds.

I'm aware of what the leg extension is, I just don't know if I understand the value of it in your routine. You would be better off with lunges, bulgarian split squats, cyclist squats, box step ups, goblet squats, etc. There are tons of ways to hit the quads that are better exercises and don't have a ton of load. Leg extensions value is after you have already done other better quad dominant movements and they're a finisher IMO.

I think there are a lot of people who don't do back bridges and have plenty of resiliency and longevity. Back in the day I ran Matt Furey's Combat Conditioning, where bridges are a big focus and it was quite honestly a waste of time.

You know what, you have a really good point about the lunges and squats. I have to say, that I hate lunges because they make my knees hurt. Goblet squats I love but I can't stimulate them enough since I work in lower rep ranges usually. I don't think I can pick up a kettlebell heavy enough to get me going.

Bulgarian split squats. Man, I miss those. I might have to switch my leg extensions with that. I stopped doing those because I kept getting nasty foot cramps when putting it back on the bench. Any ideas on how to prevent that?

Re: back-bridge. This is an interesting take, and I'd like to know more. Based on what I've read, I'm sold on the benefits but feel free to explain to me more about why you think it's a waste of time. Like I said before, it's not really the actual back-bridge move itself that I care about, it's the journey to be able to do it.

I should probably explain why I'm even doing these in the first place. I had a small incident when doing some broad jumps at the gym and my feet slipped out from under me. Back hyperextended a bit, but I was fine. No pain after but sometimes if I bent or twist I feel it ever so slightly. I guess that means I'm still healing. This was 4-6 weeks ago now. So it prompted me to look at things to protect my spinal health. I also dread being taken down to the ground by guys bigger than me, it sucks and it's annoying. I wish I could have turtle shell.
 
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@jaku
Personally I would add another set to your schedule or use Cluster Set strategy. Run it ABA, BAB with aerobic and mobility on the between days and don’t bother with the kettlebells for this block. Do the current routine for 8-12 weeks and reassess.

The use of accessory such as leg extensions and curls on opposite days from the compound lift is an approach I still use with all my programming. The upper body flip of that is bench and row with shoulder push or pull exercises as the accessory. This has worked VERY well for me using everything from KB to sandbag to isometrics.
 
For lunges and BSS, spending more time with the exercises will probably fix your problems. Box step ups (weighted) are very low skill and low impact, so you could always start with that and then transition over.

I don't quite understand your reasoning. You didn't really get injured because there is no pain and feeling it slightly just seems normal. Figuring out why your knee hurts doing lunges should be a larger focus to improve the longevity of your training then preventing something that didn't occur. Back bridges also don't prevent takedowns? Their only value in wrestling is to improve neck strength or for Greco takedowns.

I just didn't see any improvement in athleticism from running the program, my neck if anything ended up worse off (most likely from progressing too quickly). I would have been better off running a different program than the six months or so I sank into it.
 
@jaku
Personally I would add another set to your schedule or use Cluster Set strategy. Run it ABA, BAB with aerobic and mobility on the between days and don’t bother with the kettlebells for this block. Do the current routine for 8-12 weeks and reassess.

The use of accessory such as leg extensions and curls on opposite days from the compound lift is an approach I still use with all my programming. The upper body flip of that is bench and row with shoulder push or pull exercises as the accessory. This has worked VERY well for me using everything from KB to sandbag to isometrics.

Yes, I was considering adding another day bringing my monthly NL between 120-168. Currently, it's around 80-112. I was honestly trying to milk out that NL range for as long as possible :p

What do you think about the recommendations for ditching leg extensions for BSS, Goblets, or step-ups?
 
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For lunges and BSS, spending more time with the exercises will probably fix your problems. Box step ups (weighted) are very low skill and low impact, so you could always start with that and then transition over.

I don't quite understand your reasoning. You didn't really get injured because there is no pain and feeling it slightly just seems normal. Figuring out why your knee hurts doing lunges should be a larger focus to improve the longevity of your training then preventing something that didn't occur. Back bridges also don't prevent takedowns? Their only value in wrestling is to improve neck strength or for Greco takedowns.

I just didn't see any improvement in athleticism from running the program, my neck if anything ended up worse off (most likely from progressing too quickly). I would have been better off running a different program than the six months or so I sank into it.

I'll take your advice on both points and let you know how things go. I haven't done box step-ups since I was an athlete, but I liked them.

I know that back bridges don't prevent takedowns, my legs do. But I was hoping that back bridges would make me more supple in general. I don't do wrestling, my fights tend to happen on the street or in clubs. You're right about the knees though, I need to rethink this a little more.
 
@North Coast Miller

You also mentioned not to bother with Kettlebells, but mentioned Aerobic and mobility training. My hope was that Kettlebell Swings were a good middle ground between aerobic and anaerobic. I'm a former 100M sprinter, so I'm not really a big fan of running long distances. It's also winter here, so running is off the table. I suppose jump roping is an alternative?
 
I would do bearhug carries instead of back bridges, and work on sprawl to counter. In fact you could combine the two - carry, drop the bag and sprawl immediately, pick it up and repeat. The bag would have to be pretty big.
 
@North Coast Miller

You also mentioned not to bother with Kettlebells, but mentioned Aerobic and mobility training. My hope was that Kettlebell Swings were a good middle ground between aerobic and anaerobic. I'm a former 100M sprinter, so I'm not really a big fan of running long distances. It's also winter here, so running is off the table. I suppose jump roping is an alternative?
HIIT with a jumprope or running in place with or without a resistance band. I am unconvinced that swings can compete with either of these for a true aerobic response.
 
Millers advice >>> Mine. Disregard my opinion lol
LOL yea he's really dropping some gems right now. I do appreciate your take though!

@North Coast Miller I've never done any HIIT before. What would my off-day workout look like if you were to write it out?

Also, I don't have any sandbags at the gym but this exercise looks really cool. The sprawl-to-counter move looks hard to practice without a buddy, and maybe this is a sign I need to find time and money to do some BJJ or something.
 
If you wanna lean out, just simply eat less :)

Yea. Since I started my treatment I went from 127 to 135. I guess it's natural to have gained some fat with the muscle. I'll run a body composition check today. My profile has always been extremely athletic though, this isn't really something that is an issue. I'm so used to being skinny these days because of Crohns.
 
Yea. Since I started my treatment I went from 127 to 135. I guess it's natural to have gained some fat with the muscle. I'll run a body composition check today. My profile has always been extremely athletic though, this isn't really something that is an issue. I'm so used to being skinny these days because of Crohns.
Thanks for opening up about this..

Apart from keeping your condition in check, what are your other goals? It may actually be a wise idea to work with an instructor even if it's for a few sessions or periodic check-ins
 
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