Barbell Working on Overhead Press in my busy life

[Toby]

Overhead press is one of my favourite lift even I am not good at it.

Now, as I am advised by my neurosurgeon to stop doing martial arts/contact sports, my "goal" is to be able to be "strong enough" and "look good". I do Overhead Press for fun.

Since reading the Press chapter on PTTP Professional, I have been doing the press as written in the book (which is now on the SF blog post as well: Build a Barbell Military Press on a Kettlebell Foundation)

I do the "front delt raise (lead with elbow) until my upper arms are parallel to the ground, like the photo in the blog post:

I keep bar close to me when i do the "front delt raise" and bend my upper back backward and keep my lower back vertical
.
Question:
when the upper arms are closed to parallel to the ground, my lower back would bend back a bit.
Is it normal? If I have to keep it vertical, I won't able to keep the path of the bar strictly a strict line.

Part 2 of the lift:
"when the upper arms are parallel to the deck. Triceps time. Instead of pushing the bar up, push yourself away from it...Press as close to your forehead as possible. When the bar is somewhat above your head, flare the elbows, push your head and shoulders under the bar and finish the press pushing slightly back.
"
Question:
Sometimes I get stuck when the bar is just above my head. I found that the lift would be much easier if I "threw the bar backward" when it is just above my head. I am not too sure if I should do that. The bar would feel weightless all in a sudden and I feel like I am cheating.

I can only lift twice a week and 20-30mins per workout (I train at home) and I am currently doing this:

Day 1: Press 5x5 (same weight) and Front Squat (3x5)
Day 2: Bench 5x5 (same weight) and yates row (3x8)

I recently have done 36 x 5 for press but for 5x5, I am still stuck at 33.5.

I understand that I need 50 reps of press to make progress.

Maybe I should drop the 5x5 (same weight for all sets) to 100% working weight x 5, 90% working weight x 5 and back off sets like "Russian Bear"? Or should I do the 5x5 twice a week do bench as a accessory lift?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Pavel Macek]

@Toby

Ad Q1: Slight extension is OK, but - slight. If you bend too much, you will loose your abs and potentially hurt your lower back. Work on your T-spine mobility and extension.

Ad Q2: Don't throw the bar back, but lean slightly forward under it.

As for programming, I would follow the blueprint outlined in PTTP Pro.

 

[Steve Freides]

I understand that I need 50 reps of press to make progress.

That's a bit oversimplified. You need to gradually increase volume but must always manage the triumvirate of volume, intensity, and recovery. Please consider attending a future PlanStrong to learn more about these programming principles.

I will have to go reread PTTP Pro - can you give a page number where you're looking?

Thanks and good lifting to you.

-S-

 

[JeffC]

Stretch your front rack position first, the Bergner Rack Stretch works great.

Think push the hips forward, not arch the lower back.

Move your head around the bar, not the bar around your head. Think getting your body under the bar the instant it clears your head. I like the cue, push your head through.

Overhead press and front squats are one of my favourite pairings. I do not like Yates rows, I do close grip bench, or incline bench and strict Pendelay rows, seal rows, or bent over rows.

A great overhead assistance exercise is the overhead dicks press. It works for flat bench as bench press assistance. I add 2-3 sets of 8-12 reps after my work sets of pressing.

Allen Thrall is a great light weight strongman.

 

[Toby]

@Toby

Ad Q1: Slight extension is OK, but - slight. If you bend too much, you will loose your abs and potentially hurt your lower back. Work on your T-spine mobility and extension.

Ad Q2: Don't throw the bar back, but lean slightly forward under it.

As for programming, I would follow the blueprint outlined in PTTP Pro.

Thanks! I just re-read the outline. It seems that the "Sets and reps by Roman" would be very productive but would take more time than I have.
If I do the 2 sets of 4 (~67%) and 4 sets of 3 (~83%) , do two sets of Front Squat and go back to 1 set of 5 (~58%), 4 sets of 4 (~75%), I might able to finish it in 30mins.

Or make Bench Press my accessory lift on workout day 2 and do overhead press twice a week.

That's a bit oversimplified. You need to gradually increase volume but must always manage the triumvirate of volume, intensity, and recovery. Please consider attending a future PlanStrong to learn more about these programming principles.

I will have to go reread PTTP Pro - can you give a page number where you're looking?

Thanks and good lifting to you.

-S-

Thanks! The plan and loading is from pp125-129. There are also Press+Push Press plan on pp134-135

Stretch your front rack position first, the Bergner Rack Stretch works great.

Think push the hips forward, not arch the lower back.

Move your head around the bar, not the bar around your head. Think getting your body under the bar the instant it clears your head. I like the cue, push your head through.

Overhead press and front squats are one of my favourite pairings. I do not like Yates rows, I do close grip bench, or incline bench and strict Pendelay rows, seal rows, or bent over rows.

A great overhead assistance exercise is the overhead dicks press. I works good on a flat bench as bench press assistance. I add 2-3 sets of 8-12 reps after my work sets of pressing.

Allen Thrall is a great light weight strongman.

Flat bench as assistance sounds good! And thanks for the link of Allen Thrall

 

[Rif]

That's a bit oversimplified. You need to gradually increase volume but must always manage the triumvirate of volume, intensity, and recovery. Please consider attending a future PlanStrong to learn more about these programming principles.

I will have to go reread PTTP Pro - can you give a page number where you're looking?

Thanks and good lifting to you.

-S-

I have made consistent progress for the last two years on my press with between 15 and 25 reps per session once a week. I should have an article coming out on my triple progression
protocol very soon

 

[Steve Freides]

I have made consistent progress for the last two years on my press with between 15 and 25 reps per session once a week. I should have an article coming out on my triple progression
protocol very soon

I look forward to reading that, @Rif.

-S-

 

[Steve Freides]

I will add that I'm taking the Easy Strength approach to my pressing right now. About 10 total reps each of bench press and barbell overhead press, done most days of the week. It's been a _long_ time since I pressed a barbell and this is feeling good to me.

-S-

 

[Rif]

I look forward to reading that, @Rif.

-S-

thanks Steve, it should be out sooner than later, just getting edited now.

 

[Toby]

I have made consistent progress for the last two years on my press with between 15 and 25 reps per session once a week. I should have an article coming out on my triple progression
protocol very soon

Thanks a lot, Rif! Looking forward to read your blog post.
Currently I am still not able to lift yet but I am planning to do (different plan than my opening post) two days per week and Bench/Press/Squat/Rackpull plus something.

Either two days 5/3/1 with the four main lifts or runing 1this (reverse pyramid)
Day 1) Back Squat 2 sets of 6-8, bench 3 working sets of 3-5 reps and some row (and other stuff like Swings)
Day 2) Widegrip Rackpull - 2 working sets of 3-5 reps, overhead press - 3 working sets of 6-8 rep and some chin up (other stuff like Get Up)

I will add that I'm taking the Easy Strength approach to my pressing right now. About 10 total reps each of bench press and barbell overhead press, done most days of the week. It's been a _long_ time since I pressed a barbell and this is feeling good to me.

-S-

Nice!

 

[Rif]

Thanks a lot, Rif! Looking forward to read your blog post.
Currently I am still not able to lift yet but I am planning to do (different plan than my opening post) two days per week and Bench/Press/Squat/Rackpull plus something.

Either two days 5/3/1 with the four main lifts or runing 1this (reverse pyramid)
Day 1) Back Squat 2 sets of 6-8, bench 3 working sets of 3-5 reps and some row (and other stuff like Swings)
Day 2) Widegrip Rackpull - 2 working sets of 3-5 reps, overhead press - 3 working sets of 6-8 rep and some chin up (other stuff like Get Up)





Nice!

Should be available soon. Final edits being done.Are you thinking of bench/ mil press/squat and rack pull all on one day and twice a week? that's a lot of load once it started getting heavy

 

[Toby]

Should be available soon. Final edits being done.Are you thinking of bench/ mil press/squat and rack pull all on one day and twice a week? that's a lot of load once it started getting heavy

Thanks for your reply.
I am doing Bench/squat on one day and rackpull/press on the other day.

 

[Rif]

Ok good, that makes more sense.

 

[Toby]

From 19/12 to now, i I have increased my Barbell Overhead Press ( 6-8rep range) from using RPT/double progression (6 reps minimum, add weight if I can do 8 or more) oncce a week. From 35KG X 7 to 37.5KG x 7

Just found Rif's blog post:
http://www.strongfirst.com/triple-progression-system-explained/

I just did a bench session early this week with the scheme. I was going to test my 5 sets of 8 poundage but ended up i can only do 5 x 5.

For press, I will do 5x5.

I log my workout on a different site at the moment but I will start logging my triple progression journey on strong first.

Peace.

 

[Rif]

Excellent and glad you are trying the program. Although I default to 5 x 5 a lot the triple progression protocol can be used with a variety of sets, reps and weight. the important part is the rise and fall of the workloads as one increases sets and reps then decreases them( temporarily) as weight rises.
5 x 3 3 x 3, 5 x 10 etc can all be used depending on the desired outcome

 

[Dave0317]

While you are looking into programming, don't overlook a basic 3-5 sets of 5 reps maybe 3 times a week. I was doing the "operator template" from tactical Barbell and got a bodyweight overhead press after a couple months, I was previously always stuck with a max 10-15 pounds less than my bodyweight. Finally got to where it was more like a heavy single or sorta max that I could pull off easily on any day of the week.

Keep in mind, I'm a very lean guy. About 5'6" and 145. I started that program after owning TGUs with a 70 and being pretty comfortable with one arm 1-5 press ladders at 53lbs.

 

[Rif]

agree! never overlook the simplest approach if possible

 

[Toby]

Thanks Dave! I would totally do that if I could train 3 times a week.
I can only do two 30-40mins sessions a week.

My progress so far (start from 15/02/2017 )
Toby's Finding Time To Train -

I think few more warm up sets help getting me into the groove. I need to do that, especially for the overhead press!

It is nice to have more value with bench press. I have never been a bench press guy since I train at home without a bench :-D. Now i have a power rack ;-)

 

[ShawnM]

@Toby- A way to work on your overhead press without going to the gym might be to do GTG wall walks to hand stand presses. If not readable maybe doing push ups in the pike position. You can still press overhead, sort of, without having to hit the gym.

 

[Tarzan]

@Toby- A way to work on your overhead press without going to the gym might be to do GTG wall walks to hand stand presses. If not readable maybe doing push ups in the pike position. You can still press overhead, sort of, without having to hit the gym.

Be careful doing that though, you may find yourself doing HeSPU's by accident in a few weeks.

A pike push up with one leg elevated is not too far from a full HeSPU in difficulty.