Other/Mixed NEAT Non-exercise activity thermogenesis: underestimated role in weight loss and health.

[guardian7]

It seems like most people in the general population overestimate the importance of exercise in weight loss, but many may also be overestimating the role of diet in weight loss as well. NEAT or non-exercise activity thermogenesis plays a greater role than commonly understood. I am trying to add more incidental movement to my day. The numbers are pretty interesting.​

Non-Exercise Activity Thermogenesis: A NEAT Approach to Weight Loss

Let’s examine how we can successfully use Non-Activity Exercise Thermogenis (NEAT) for weight loss without exercise, and to burn calories and lose fat.

blog.nasm.org

FOR EXAMPLE:​

A 145 lb. person burns approximately 102 calories an hour while performing their office job in a seated position (1.7 kcal / minute), but burns 174 calories an hour if performing those same office duties while standing.

174 calories may not seem like much, but it translates to 18,000 calories or a little over 5 lbs. over a 50-week work year (250 work days). By comparison, that same person would need to squeeze in 60, 30-minute runs at 5 mph to achieve that same caloric burn (2).

One reason the carnivore diet may work is that the thermogenic calories burned for digesting meat is much greater than many other foods!

One reason Americans in particular and countries adopting similar eating patterns are gaining weight is that ultra-processed food characteristic of much of the food industry in the US in particular produces food that is particularly low in thermogenesis, mush you don't have to chew. This factor is likely generally underestimated as well.

NEAT is a factor worth looking into. Can we move more or adopt more challenging postures during everyday activities? Worth a try.

 

[watchnerd]

I thought this was already known?

Even intense exercise is dwarfed by your daily activities, and even more so if you're "active".

And you can't out exercise a bad diet, and thus the perils of processed foods are that they're hyper palatable, and calorically dense, so easy to over consume.

 

[oab]

And you can't out exercise a bad diet, and thus the perils of processed foods are that they're hyper palatable, and calorically dense, so easy to over consume.

This is key.

Sure NEAT effect exists but get the foods you are consuming right and the outcomes will look after themselves.

 

[guardian7]

This is key.

Sure NEAT effect exists but get the foods you are consuming right and the outcomes will look after themselves

Never said it wasn't important. Just saying that sufficient daily movement and other NEAT factors could mean that it is less important than thought.

 

[guardian7]

I thought this was already known?

Even intense exercise is dwarfed by your daily activities, and even more so if you're "active".

And you can't out exercise a bad diet, and thus the perils of processed foods are that they're hyper palatable, and calorically dense, so easy to over consume.

Known by people like yourself but among the general population and news media. Not so much. Even on this forum you can infer this in some posts.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

I thought this was already known?

Even intense exercise is dwarfed by your daily activities, and even more so if you're "active".

Yeah, I mean, you'd think commonsense would tell you that just moving a lot, eating right (and not too much), and wait for it - having muscle would = more calories burned overall. BUT, commonsense is not so common.

And you can't out exercise a bad diet, and thus the perils of processed foods are that they're hyper palatable, and calorically dense, so easy to over consume.

Not to be a dick about it, but you can get away with a lot if you're a young athlete with a lot of muscle and your training is intense. Michael Phelps is the overly touted example of this, but it serves the purpose here. I get tired of the "you can't out exercise a donut" rhetoric - I mean, yeah, it's worth noting that your half hour of intense aerobics maybe burned off the caloric equivalent of one big bite of that Snickers bar, but that's not insignificant compounded with other lifestyle changes.

 

[pet']

Hello,

That's why even a simple walk (for instance the [in]famous 10k a day or a little bit more) can be a very effective way to manage weight. Even Mike Dolce who is a great nutritionist / trainer for top MMA althlete is a firm believer of this, paired with "proper" nutrition (whole food...). He often advises to perform it in a fasted state and also to strength train to increase muscle mass and calorie consumption while resting.

Kind regards,

Pet'

 

[watchnerd]

Not to be a dick about it, but you can get away with a lot if you're a young athlete with a lot of muscle and your training is intense. Michael Phelps is the overly touted example of this, but it serves the purpose here. I get tired of the "you can't out exercise a donut" rhetoric - I mean, yeah, it's worth noting that your half hour of intense aerobics maybe burned off the caloric equivalent of one big bite of that Snickers bar, but that's not insignificant compounded with other lifestyle changes.

I've always liked this (granted, extreme) example:

 

[Boris Bachmann]

I say this every time it comes up - a half hour of walking is a half hour of NOT sitting on the couch eating chips. The time committed to even the lightest exercise is (often) replacing a less constructive use of time.

 

[Boris Bachmann]

I've always liked this (granted, extreme) example:

That's insane. Of course, I get their point, but I don't know anyone who would even try to burn 10000 calories by exercise in a day anyway. I mean, you'd/I'd burn 2000 doing very little as is.

 

[Hrungnir]

​

One reason the carnivore diet may work is that the thermogenic calories burned for digesting meat is much greater than many other foods!

One reason Americans in particular and countries adopting similar eating patterns are gaining weight is that ultra-processed food characteristic of much of the food industry in the US in particular produces food that is particularly low in thermogenesis, mush you don't have to chew. This factor is likely generally underestimated as well.

There is a lot of inference here that isn’t supported by the studies that drew the original conclusions on thermogenesis of protein and the correlation with satiety hormones. To start with, they used whey, casein and pea protein isolates which are about the most processed foods you can find. The next being that pea protein was found to have an AA profile that created more satiety than dairy proteins (sorry carnivore) and the third being that the thermogenic impact of protein is already built into its kcal count, the measured unit of 4 kcals is the net energy after full conversion into energy. The study more focused on the thermogenic effect of processing proteins has an impact on satiety hormones, if you eat 100 kcals of protein or carbs you net the same energy to your body.

 

[3letterslong]

Has anyone read Burn by Pontzer? We might need to reconsider a lot of what we know about caloric burn. Here's a good summary from Joel Jamieson.

All Pain, No Gain: Why the High-Intensity Training Obsession Has Failed Us All - 8 Weeks Out

Why training hard doesn't guarantee you'll see results and why recovery is the game-changing component that will supercharge any training program.

www.8weeksout.com

 

[wespom9]

@3letterslong really good book. To me it started to demonstrate why there is an initial fat loss followed by a plateau. The body will react with increased total expenditure in the short term but then stabilize.
I see it as veyr similar to why you can't just add 5 lbs a week. At some point the adaptation will subside

 

[3letterslong]

@3letterslong really good book. To me it started to demonstrate why there is an initial fat loss followed by a plateau. The body will react with increased total expenditure in the short term but then stabilize.
I see it as veyr similar to why you can't just add 5 lbs a week. At some point the adaptation will subside

Has anyone done any studies on cycling caloric deficits like we cycle training volume?

 

[silveraw]

I say this every time it comes up - a half hour of walking is a half hour of NOT sitting on the couch eating chips. The time committed to even the lightest exercise is (often) replacing a less constructive use of time.

Beneficial opportunity costs!

 

[silveraw]

Has anyone done any studies on cycling caloric deficits like we cycle training volume?

The MATDOR study did this.

 

[3letterslong]

The MATDOR study did this.

That was an interesting read. Thanks for the tip!

 

[LukeV]

the third being that the thermogenic impact of protein is already built into its kcal count, the measured unit of 4 kcals is the net energy after full conversion into energy.

is that right? bugger! I thought you deducted the TEF from the 4, 4 and 9 of carbs, protein and fat. No wonder I’m fat!

 

[Gypsyplumber]

One thing I miss about moving from the field (underground construction) to the office as a supervisory role is all the calories I burned “gettin it” every day at work. Always on my feet outside moving. I miss it but my body doesn’t hurt like it used to and it’s tough to shovel and run a jack hammer forever. I never worried about the gym (I’d go but not religiously) I got my workouts at work and I always felt strong.

 

[watchnerd]

Has anyone done any studies on cycling caloric deficits like we cycle training volume?

Yes, there have been several.

TLDR -- you should periodize your dieting with diet breaks.