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Barbell 5x5 cycles 3 times a week for overhead press? Thoughts?

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NonStop

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I'm starting to really want to focus on the overhead press as my press of choice, mainly because the more I read about building the overhead press the more I come across the quote of 'to press a lot you must press a lot'.

I currently only have access to the gym 3 times a week, and indeed as I train in the mornings before work the length of time in the gym is somewhat limited so I have to be economical with my training. I've tried ROP style ladders 3x a week (heavy/light/med) in the past for overhead press and it worked really well, but the sessions ended up very lengthy so it wouldn't suit right now.

Conversely, I've tried PTTP russian style of 5,3, 2 for overhead press, 5 days a week seems to work great, but only 3 days a week doesn't seem to have enough volume (which makes sense as Pavel says you generally need 50-100reps a week to keep progressing).

So what are you people's thoughts on cycles of overhead press for 5x5 3 times a week? I understand many 5x5/3x5 programs alternate horizontal and vertical presses, but many people who have actually built up the strength to press their bodyweight overhead repeat the need for lots of pressing volume, and for it to be trained at least twice a week. So 5x5 cycles of just overhead press should fit the bill well, being trained 3 times a week and with a total of 75reps a week.
 
Unless hypertrophy is undesirable based on your goals/activities, you might be able to try ROP with a lighter bell and shorter rests to get the ladders in the required time. Pavel talks about how the rest time can really be adjusted based on your goals. I don't remember if he mentions that in ETK or Return of the Kettlebell.
 
I currently only have access to the gym 3 times a week, and indeed as I train in the mornings before work the length of time in the gym is somewhat limited so I have to be economical with my training. I've tried ROP style ladders 3x a week (heavy/light/med) in the past for overhead press and it worked really well, but the sessions ended up very lengthy so it wouldn't suit right now.

Conversely, I've tried PTTP russian style of 5,3, 2 for overhead press, 5 days a week seems to work great, but only 3 days a week doesn't seem to have enough volume (which makes sense as Pavel says you generally need 50-100reps a week to keep progressing).

If technique is in place and time is limited, go Bulgarian. Aka heavy singles, go doubles on light days. Just dont go beyond that point where fatigue breaks your lifting form and technique.
 
I think there's a pretty good chance this will work. What sort of approach to loading are you using? I have been running one 5x5 day and one 5x3 (reps/sets) day per week for the last two months. The 5x3 day is where I add weight each week, the 5x5 day is about 10% lighter. That said, I have yet to get back to the 5x3 PRs I set at the end of my linear progression. At that time I was adding 2.5lb per session every session and alternating press styles with the bench. They seem to drive each other to a significant degree, but I'm not entirely convinced the bench is perfectly "ok" with my right shoulder. Nothing serious, but I'm trying to progress the press without benching currently.

Here are some tips from a pretty good presser named Bill Starr:


http://startingstrength.com/articles/stronger_press_starr.pdf
 
Unless hypertrophy is undesirable based on your goals/activities, you might be able to try ROP with a lighter bell and shorter rests to get the ladders in the required time. Pavel talks about how the rest time can really be adjusted based on your goals. I don't remember if he mentions that in ETK or Return of the Kettlebell.

Cheers, I would still need to move up a bell size for starters, plus ladders for even a moderate amount of time makes it hard to squeeze in lower body work - hence why rograms like Pavels No Distractions are 4 days a week with upper/lower days. Plus even with little rest, ladders take up way more time than just 5 sets.

If technique is in place and time is limited, go Bulgarian. Aka heavy singles, go doubles on light days. Just dont go beyond that point where fatigue breaks your lifting form and technique.

I'll look into bulgrian style, thank you, out of interest, how come you recommend that and not cycles?

I think there's a pretty good chance this will work. What sort of approach to loading are you using? I have been running one 5x5 day and one 5x3 (reps/sets) day per week for the last two months. The 5x3 day is where I add weight each week, the 5x5 day is about 10% lighter. That said, I have yet to get back to the 5x3 PRs I set at the end of my linear progression. At that time I was adding 2.5lb per session every session and alternating press styles with the bench. They seem to drive each other to a significant degree, but I'm not entirely convinced the bench is perfectly "ok" with my right shoulder. Nothing serious, but I'm trying to progress the press without benching currently.

Here are some tips from a pretty good presser named Bill Starr:


http://startingstrength.com/articles/stronger_press_starr.pdf

I'm using simple linear cycling at the moment, obviously with much lighter poundages than those used in PTTP. Starting the cycle with around 60% IRM.

Thats a darn good article, I've read itbefore, indeed it helped persuade me to seriously concentrate on overhead pressing almost exclusively, and at least 2 days a week. Currently adding some tricep assistance work on the fridays at the end of the workout before the weekend off (dips or press-ups). If I find 3 days a week of overhead pressing at 5x5 too much volume I'll lower it to twice a week most definitely with wednesdays set at focusing on dips.
 
I'll look into bulgrian style, thank you, out of interest, how come you recommend that and not cycles?

With limited time, you propaply aint got time for 5x5/25 reps after warm up. More likely, you have only time for a total of 15-20 reps, including your warm up, in your pressing session. What you gotta do is make those 15-20 reps count, therefore go heavy.
 
I like to add 2-3 back off sets at a lighter weight and higher reps 8-15. Increase volume and time under tension to build muscle. Another option is to finish with overhead "Dicks press", same protocol. A favorite strongman exercise, the masters of the overhead press.
 
you can do 5x5 , texas method etc. how much do you press right now ? Pavel was talking about kettle bells i believe. Easiest way to get stronger is to add more muscle, i would do hypertrophy block for overhead press( 12 - 8 ) , then went with general strength block (6 - 5 reps) and then to the peaking ( 1- 3 ) and test..
 
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