Kettlebell Advice on Push Press, please

[Sergi]

Hi everyone. I'd like to hear your opinion. I've been struggling with the Shoulder Press, so I started doing Push Press in an attempt to strengthen the shoulder muscles and, eventually, be able to perform the Military Press exercise. I really can't do more than a few reps without losing good form, then the shoulder tires out and I have to desist! Is lifting a 16 kg kettlebell in Push Press such a hardcore feat or is it just I need time to train my shoulders in order to ease them into this exercise? ( For Swings and other exercises, I don't have any problem using 16 kg, though. )

I don't want to compare myself to others, as all journeys are different, but it still mystifies me how difficult is to do more than 5 reps with good form. Should I stick with 12 kg for some more weeks/months? Maybe trying progressions with a barbell? Thanks a lot!

PS> The attached file is an example of what I'm currently doing. I do about 3-5 rounds of these types of ladder exercises, three times a week, interspersed with some running.

 

[Anna C]

Why do "Shoulder Press" before "Military Press?" Can you do what is shown at 3:03-5:40 in this video with the 12 or 16kg?





You're welcome to post a video of your own for form critique....

 

[barrak]

If your shoulders are not conditioned enough, aggressive push presses can cause damage. I would stick to strict presses, at a weight I can do 5 good reps at least and build volume gradually while learning the technique as suggested above. It doesn't matter if you start with 12K, 8K or even less. Myself, I started at 8K and stopped at 24K. It took several months, though.

 

[Mark Limbaga]

A few questions :

1. Current bodyweight?
2. How many solid pushups can you do?
3. Do you have access to a barbell or multiple dumbells?

Assuming you have no issues in terms of moving well, you may just need to build a wider strength base then revisit your strict press afterwards

 

[Erik Hournou]

@Sergi Welcome to the forum!

 

[coachnathanwhite]

2. How many solid pushups can you do?

@Sergi
I agree with Mark here. Train your bodyweight movements and build up some baseline levels of strength. Safety is a concern as well, and self limiting body weight training will be a safer option than having a ball of iron floating over your head.

In addition to regular tempo pushups I would add negatives as well. From the push up plank, grip the floor with your fingers and lower yourself slowly, "pulling" yourself down to the deck. Reset and repeat for sets of 5 reps.

 

[Sergi]

Why do "Shoulder Press" before "Military Press?"

Thanks for pointing out the difference, Anna. I was under the impression that Shoulder Press and Military Press were both the same exercise! I'll definitely try the guidance in the video, next session, and report back.

 

[Sergi]

@Sergi
I agree with Mark here. Train your bodyweight movements and build up some baseline levels of strength. Safety is a concern as well, and self limiting body weight training will be a safer option than having a ball of iron floating over your head.

In addition to regular tempo pushups I would add negatives as well. From the push up plank, grip the floor with your fingers and lower yourself slowly, "pulling" yourself down to the deck. Reset and repeat for sets of 5 reps.

I can do easily 10 to 15 Push-Ups. Sometimes, if I feel strong at the end of the last round, I'd perform 8-10 diamond P-Ups. I do understand what you mean about safety, some of the first attempts to lift the 16 kg kettlebell ended in a shoulder injury that has taken months to heal. I'm much more careful these days though! Will give a go to the negative Push-Ups, cheers.

 

[ShawnM]

Hi everyone. I'd like to hear your opinion. I've been struggling with the Shoulder Press, so I started doing Push Press in an attempt to strengthen the shoulder muscles and, eventually, be able to perform the Military Press exercise. I really can't do more than a few reps without losing good form, then the shoulder tires out and I have to desist! Is lifting a 16 kg kettlebell in Push Press such a hardcore feat or is it just I need time to train my shoulders in order to ease them into this exercise? ( For Swings and other exercises, I don't have any problem using 16 kg, though. )

I don't want to compare myself to others, as all journeys are different, but it still mystifies me how difficult is to do more than 5 reps with good form. Should I stick with 12 kg for some more weeks/months? Maybe trying progressions with a barbell? Thanks a lot!

PS> The attached file is an example of what I'm currently doing. I do about 3-5 rounds of these types of ladder exercises, three times a week, interspersed with some running.

Not sure what your bell situation is but doing floor presses for a while will greatly assist your pressing strength.

 

[Sergi]

A few questions :

1. Current bodyweight?
2. How many solid pushups can you do?
3. Do you have access to a barbell or multiple dumbells?

Assuming you have no issues in terms of moving well, you may just need to build a wider strength base then revisit your strict press afterwards

Hey Mark. Weight> 67 kg, I do about 10 to 15 Push-Ups with reasonable good form (I'd need a spotter there though!) Soon will get my first barbell, an EZ curl bar + 30 kg plates, with which I plan to keep on building that base. I'm on my fourth month of KB training, with three sessions of about 30 minutes every week. I also run 2-3 times a week.

 

[Sergi]

Not sure what your bell situation is but doing floor presses for a while will greatly assist your pressing strength.

That's something I need to try at some point. Thanks a lot for the suggestion!

 

[Sergi]

@Sergi Welcome to the forum!

Thanks, Erik!

 

[Sergi]

If your shoulders are not conditioned enough, aggressive push presses can cause damage. I would stick to strict presses, at a weight I can do 5 good reps at least and build volume gradually while learning the technique as suggested above. It doesn't matter if you start with 12K, 8K or even less. Myself, I started at 8K and stopped at 24K. It took several months, though.

@barrak Thanks for the advice. To be honest, it was more than anything a problem of damaged ego, especially when seeing what other ppl can lift, but you've got a point there. Right now it looks like my shoulders would benefit training with 12 kg and see where that leads me over time.

 

[Anna C]

Thanks for pointing out the difference, Anna. I was under the impression that Shoulder Press and Military Press were both the same exercise! I'll definitely try the guidance in the video, next session, and report back.

Aha. I am actually not sure what I would call a Shoulder Press myself (probably a press with a dumbbell), but I got the impression you were making a distinction when you said, "I've been struggling with the Shoulder Press, so I started doing Push Press in an attempt to strengthen the shoulder muscles and, eventually, be able to perform the Military Press exercise."

There are lots of sources, tips, and tricks for building a strong press -- in-person instruction from and SFG would be the recommended way to go! The SFG standards video shows the method that is taught and practiced here, but doesn't tell you how to get there.

Here is another idea: StrongFirst: Training Center
Module 8 of the online Kettlebell Fundamentals course is the Military Press.

 

[Sergi]

Aha. I am actually not sure what I would call a Shoulder Press myself (probably a press with a dumbbell), but I got the impression you were making a distinction when you said, "I've been struggling with the Shoulder Press, so I started doing Push Press in an attempt to strengthen the shoulder muscles and, eventually, be able to perform the Military Press exercise."

There are lots of sources, tips, and tricks for building a strong press -- in-person instruction from and SFG would be the recommended way to go! The SFG standards video shows the method that is taught and practiced here, but doesn't tell you how to get there.

Here is another idea: StrongFirst: Training Center
Module 8 of the online Kettlebell Fundamentals course is the Military Press.

@Anna C Tuesday session's over and I have now an idea of my Shoulder Press limits, with a 12 kg kettlebell. I started with 8 reps per arm but had to decrease the number to 6, as my form was degrading over time. For the rest of the exercises, I used 16 kg: Swings (x15) - OA Regular Row (x8) - Push Ups (x10) & EZ bar Shrugs (40 kg x 6 reps). 5 rounds total. Sorry, no video! Also, I had a look at the training section but the video you mentioned is not available unless I buy the whole package. Thanks for all the tips, like the SFG training, I guess the whole thing must be at a standby because of the health crisis. Where could I get the pricing for that kind of certification? If we ever get back to 'normal' it's something I'd be inclined to do. But I guess I still have a long way to go, like building a base of strength that allows me to perform comfortably TGU, Snatches and many others that, for the time being, still belong to the realm of daydreaming.

 

[Anna C]

@Anna C Tuesday session's over and I have now an idea of my Shoulder Press limits, with a 12 kg kettlebell. I started with 8 reps per arm but had to decrease the number to 6, as my form was degrading over time. For the rest of the exercises, I used 16 kg: Swings (x15) - OA Regular Row (x8) - Push Ups (x10) & EZ bar Shrugs (40 kg x 6 reps). 5 rounds total. Sorry, no video! Also, I had a look at the training section but the video you mentioned is not available unless I buy the whole package. Thanks for all the tips, like the SFG training, I guess the whole thing must be at a standby because of the health crisis. Where could I get the pricing for that kind of certification? If we ever get back to 'normal' it's something I'd be inclined to do. But I guess I still have a long way to go, like building a base of strength that allows me to perform comfortably TGU, Snatches and many others that, for the time being, still belong to the realm of daydreaming.

Very good... I'd recommend do sets of 5 for your presses.

Yes, the StrongFirst Kettlebell Fundamentals course will teach you the Press along with other great kettlebell exercises -- Deadlift, 2-arm swing, 1-arm swing, get-up, goblet squat, high pull! There is a one-day in-person course that is similar, but yes they have slowed down due to COVID. Here are the ones on the schedule currently: StrongFirst Kettlebell Course Schedule | StrongFirst That is the first StrongFirst course I attended in 2015 and have then gone on to do all the courses and certs... so of course I highly recommend them. But if they are not anywhere near you, the online course is the next best thing, or meeting with an SFG near you for a one-on-one session, or a few.

Anyway, you're on the right path, and in the right place!

 

[Sergi]

Not sure what your bell situation is but doing floor presses for a while will greatly assist your pressing strength.

@ShawnM Thanks!

 

[Sergi]

Very good... I'd recommend do sets of 5 for your presses.

Yes, the StrongFirst Kettlebell Fundamentals course will teach you the Press along with other great kettlebell exercises -- Deadlift, 2-arm swing, 1-arm swing, get-up, goblet squat, high pull! There is a one-day in-person course that is similar, but yes they have slowed down due to COVID. Here are the ones on the schedule currently: StrongFirst Kettlebell Course Schedule | StrongFirst That is the first StrongFirst course I attended in 2015 and have then gone on to do all the courses and certs... so of course I highly recommend them. But if they are not anywhere near you, the online course is the next best thing, or meeting with an SFG near you for a one-on-one session, or a few.

Anyway, you're on the right path, and in the right place!

@Anna C These are tons of great advice and should get me started! I've been reading SF articles for months, which along with a couple of books from Pavel have been my main source of trustworthy knowledge. There's only so much stuff (and lots of disinformation) you can get from YouTube I'll definitely look forward to obtaining that one-day tuition whenever it's possible. Thanks a lot for the warm welcome and for taking the time to read my post, for a wannabe girevik it means a lot!

 

[watchnerd]

Hey Mark. Weight> 67 kg, I do about 10 to 15 Push-Ups with reasonable good form (I'd need a spotter there though!)

I'm curious why you would need a spotter during push ups?

The injury potential of failing a push up is pretty low.

 

[Starlord]

Hey Mark. Weight> 67 kg, I do about 10 to 15 Push-Ups with reasonable good form (I'd need a spotter there though!) Soon will get my first barbell, an EZ curl bar + 30 kg plates, with which I plan to keep on building that base. I'm on my fourth month of KB training, with three sessions of about 30 minutes every week. I also run 2-3 times a week.

Increasing your push ups and military Press volume will yield increases in strength.

You are not at a strength level where your training needs to be specialised in anyway, shape or form.