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Kettlebell another bent press post

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andrewswanson

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I was inspired to post this question after reading the recent thread regarding 'which category of basic human movements the bent press falls into'.

MY QUESTION/QUESTIONS
For those who have practiced the bent press what are the main training effects? and are the training effects similar or different from the turkish get up?
 
For me the primary feeling was a generalised increase in strength, and feeling much more tied together. A bit vague I know, but once I hit the point that it all seemed to move naturally when getting heavy (I can put the 40kg above my head without a second thought now, and will come back to the beast later on in the year) I realised I was just doing a lot of the high tension techniques without thinking. Plus it hugely improved my crushing grip - in fact once the basic movement pattern was down it felt like all I needed to do was get into the start position, crush the handle and move.

I felt that the overall feeling of being well tied together was the same as the TGU. The feeling of being able to bound up off the floor was lost (could totally be replaced by some crawling). The flexibility and stability challenge is far greater. Overall I don't think there is much in it for which might give "more" benefit (as difficult as that might be to define), but the bent press would certainly compliment someone who has already reached a good level of shoulder stability with TGUs.

If I was to pick two exercises that I imagine might promote good movement longevity TGUs and bent press would be at the top of the list.

Also obliques, lats and shoulders - if you want the bodybuilder's response.
 

Um, he clearly referenced that post and is asking a related but different question. He's asking for anecdotes from people who bent press frequently.

DavThew, giving an answer to your first question is tough, but I'll try.

You're second question, I can definitely answer. The training effects are similar, but the bent press (BtP) affects the upper body much more than the TGU. My lats definitely get worked more, and the carry-over between BtPs and MPs is greater than the carry-over between TGUs and MPs is. I'd say the BtP is more lateral focused, while the TGU is more anterior focused, however both affect much more than that.

I didn't feel the loss of "bounding of the floor" ability, but I regularly tumble post-workout to cool down, so it could be that.
 
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I'm going to be the devil's advocate here, so bare with me. I've tried the bent press and just can't see the benefit if one is doing the other basic kettlebell movements; swings, get-ups, clean and presses. Is anyone else with me here? Do what you want but sorry, just don't get the fascination with it.
 
Yesterday on the SF FB groups, Iron Tamer posted a video of his student SFG Alydia Bryant doing a bent press w/ the Beast, 48kg. Ever heard of a woman pressing 48kg? So, there's something!

I haven't got the bent press yet either, but just started working windmills using this tutorial, and I can see that I was lacking in T-spine rotation exercises. I am feeling significantly better throughout the chest and shoulders after 3 weeks of practicing these (mostly unloaded). Exercise Spotlight: Kettlebell Windmill

The BP seems to also be good for lat engagement... always something good to work on.

So I think some bent pressing is in my near future. Yes, I have Tamer's book already :)
 
@banzaiengr

Three reasons personally:
1) Because heavier is better, and the bent press allows one to put up the most weight possible with one hand. (See Anna C's post!)
2) It makes the two most important muscle groups, the lats and the glutes, work hard.
3) It looks really cool.
 
@Anna C & @kodo kb Yep understand, and yes Anna I saw the video and that is something. But couldn't you get the same benefits from heavy waiter carries and get-ups? Maybe not quite the same as being bent sideways with a heavy weight extended above the shoulder that must be rotated to the standing position but safer and less chance of injury. I mean a 48K bent press and some people think heavy get-ups are dangerous?
 
I think you only think (or are willing to be influenced by other's perception) the danger of bent pressing because you have not practised it enough to feel comfortable doing it.

Things are not inherently dangerous, they are dangerous in certain contexts. Driving is much more dangerous than practically any lift, but a lot of people feel comfortable driving because it's familiar and they have experience with it. Remember KB Safety 101: "It's your fault"
 
- you can lift more than with a press, push press or jerk
- you can lift more than with a get-up
- it works your t-spine, builds the antifragility of the shoulder
- lats. Scratch it: LATS!
- a Zen lift - it requires & develops patience and precision
- whenever you are bent pressing, Sandow, Inch, Saxon, Klein, Goerner et al. smile and send you extra strength.
- ...and Iron Tamer smiles as well.

I love bent press and the drills from the similar group (get-up, windmill, military press, side press).
 
Regarding safety there is a difference in terms of danger between exercises. A swing is safer than a snatch. A front squat is much safer than a low bar barbell back squat.
And during the bent press you are in a pretty vulnerable position for the shoulder. If an accident hapens and the kb goes backwards you are trapped in arm lock and the shoulder would be destroyed. So it is a fair question whether the benefits outweigh the risk. Personally if I want the most amount of weight overhead I'd jerk a barbell. It would be interesting, however, if some people noticed a measurable carryover to other movements or exercises.
 
Hey, hey now, I'm just being the devil's advocate here. If you want to bent press go for it. I believe lat engagement is a fair assessment. That's a tough one, and I have a problem "feeling" it in the get-up. And I'm not trolling or being disagreeable here, nor dissing Mr. Whitley, I have the upmost respect for that strongman. Perry Rader told me enough about Sandow and the boys.
 
Sorry if it came off as strong or offended, I just think "danger" is a bad concept to apply to a lift in general. People are different and have different weaknesses, mobility issues, injury histories, etc.; so I think saying any move in particular is dangerous is the wrong way to think about it.

There is always a risk::reward relationship for a lift, but that relationship tends to be more personal than the investment::reward relationship.
 
Sorry if it came off as strong or offended, I just think "danger" is a bad concept to apply to a lift in general. People are different and have different weaknesses, mobility issues, injury histories, etc.; so I think saying any move in particular is dangerous is the wrong way to think about it.

There is always a risk::reward relationship for a lift, but that relationship tends to be more personal than the investment::reward relationship.


Oh no, not offended at all, just offering up some discussion. I've done the bent press so I'm just wanting to find out what I'm missing. So far I'm only finding that if I want to work on lat engagement then it "may" be something to look into. Other than that, in regard to my goals, I'm not seeing a reason to add it to my practice other than following the herd. : )
 
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OK kids. I am gonna give my perspective, point by point. Please do not mistake my directness as being harsh.

"for those who have practiced the bent press what are the main training effects?"
-Getting strong as hell at all things overhead.
-Improved mobility and coordination.
-Strange looks from people.
-27,000 views on a Facebook video in 4 days for Alydia Bryant for becoming the first woman that I know of to put 48kg over her head with one hand and inspiring countless people to examine their own definition of "impossible". (for my $$ she is the strongest female in the world at this lift)
My challenge to you- go practice the bent press consistently for 6 months, then come back and tell me what it's effect are for YOU.

"If I was to pick two exercises that I imagine might promote good movement longevity TGUs and bent press would be at the top of the list."
Fortunately, you don't have to choose. Move your body in many ways.

"I've tried the bent press and just can't see the benefit if one is doing the other basic kettlebell movements; swings, get-ups, clean and presses."
That's not a very committed "try" then....which is fine if you don't want to do the bent press. I don't want to play basketball, but that doesn't mean that a lot of people who do don't get benefit from it. Something about a bathwater and a very small child.......

"I haven't got the bent press yet either, but just started working windmills....."
Windmills are awesome. There is a misconception that windmill is to bent press what being is to snatch. Windmill is related to bent press, but less than most folks think. There was a time when I used the windmill as a part of the teaching progression for the bent press. I rarely ever do that anymore because the progressions I use now make it unnecessary for most folks.
What I do like for the windmill is to load it up very heavy to build strength for the recover to standing.

Anna C......that beast would look good over your head, just sayin'.

"couldn't you get the same benefits from heavy waiter carries and get-ups?"
No.

"during the bent press you are in a pretty vulnerable position for the shoulder."
All the more reason to train it. Consistently avoiding positions that seem vulnerable does nothing to strengthen them and makes them even more vulnerable.

"If an accident hapens and the kb goes backwards you are trapped in arm lock and the shoulder would be destroyed."
you mean like this?


I have been doing/studying the bent press for almost 15 years, I have dropped more reps gone bad than a lot of folks have ever attempted and I have literally never heard getting trapped and having the shoulder destroyed happening to anyone, ever.

"Personally if I want the most amount of weight overhead I'd jerk a barbell."
With one hand?

" ....in regard to my goals, I'm not seeing a reason to add it to my practice other than following the herd."
I am filled with gratitude that in 2016 bent press practice has been called "following the herd". If it suits your goals (which is the most important thing) then do it. If not, don't. It's just lifting......

"A swing is safer than a snatch. A front squat is much safer than a low bar barbell back squat."
No lift is inherently safer than another lift. It is all in the execution.

kodo and Pavel- I agree with your posts completely.

"And I'm not trolling or being disagreeable here, nor dissing Mr. Whitley, I have the upmost respect for that strongman."
Thank you sir.
 
Hi! Im Alydia Bryant.
Im going to kill 2 birds with one stone here:
"For those who have practiced the bent press what are the main training effects?"Oh no, not offended at all, just offering up some discussion. I've done the bent press so I'm just wanting to find out what I'm missing. So far I'm only finding that if I want to work on lat engagement then it "may" be something to look into.

I seriously wish I had made a list of everything that improved when I began doing the Bent Press, but sense i didnt I guess Ill just have to go off of memory.
1. I finally got my 24kg strict military press, 28kg TGU, I got my first Chin up in my life, my overall posture improved, My hip mobility and stability was so great. All of those achievements happened with training the Bent press 2x a week and other basic Kettlebell training (TGU was not in my programing, nor were chin-ups, I hadn't even touched a pull up bar in months when I one day was able to randomly do one).

I can now squat deeper and maintain a Neutral spine with ease. The squat position use to be a struggle for me. When I first started Training the bent press (Last April 2015) I was in a lot of shoulder pain from high reps of strict military pressing. LIKE serious pain to the point i was about to see a doctor. Turns out it was just over use. The stability that was required for the bent press would not allow for compensations the way strict MP would. I Also had dull low back pain. Yep, thats gone now too. Hmm lets talk about Aesthetics for a min too... My LATS are Huge and awesome now.. Yes Im a women and not ashamed Why? because I don't have that bra strap back fat anymore!

Core Stability. I remember messaging David Whitley after Bent Pressing the 24kg for the first time. I had never ever felt my abdominal muscles fire as much as they did that day. It was awesome.

"are the training effects similar or different from the turkish get up?"
At the Level 2 we talked about how the BtP finishes what the TGU started. So YES

"I've tried the bent press and just can't see the benefit if one is doing the other basic kettlebell movements; swings, get-ups, clean and presses." perhaps you haven't tried heavy enough or practiced enough. No Drill will fire the lats to the degree the bent press does. When I first tried the Bent press i was using a 12 and 16... with in two weeks I bent pressed the 24 for the first time.. and 4 weeks later the 40kg. Ok so it took me 8 more months to get the Beast but still thats a huge huge gain over all!

" ....in regard to my goals, I'm not seeing a reason to add it to my practice other than following the herd."
What are your goals then? do any of them involve stronger shoulders and legs? hip mobility? core stability? and what herd? ha well I guess I just started something because i didnt know that many people Bent Pressed regularly and thats a shame because its BEAUTIFUL.


I found this yesterday... 24 kg Bent press first time
Alydia Bryant on Instagram: “Today was a monumental day as I doubled my Bent press in just 2 weeks! Hello 24kg... My coach tells my I should be at the 32kg in the next…”

40 kg bent press first time

Dave Whitley on Instagram: “@alydiabryant 40kg bent press PR. #dome2015 #strongfirst”


yes those are a mere 4 weeks apart! and as you can see the 24kg was not easy!

Every single client of mine that I have taught the bent press has come back with gratitude because of how great they feel. It opens up the Thoracic rib cage and greatly improves posture.

Ive had a tone of Failed Bent presses... and I never once felt in danger.... you just get out of the way. 48kg failed attempt


Successful 48kg beast a few weeks later


The Bent press requires patience. Something i needed a great deal of in my life! Its truly a grind movement. I know from the moment I begin to stand If ill be able to complete the rep.

I hope you give it some time and practice. It has truly been a beautiful thing to master. I have Drastically seen Massive improvements in all of my lifts. I think its a shame if you didn't at least practice it 1x a month... shoot thats all i did from October -Feb.
 
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Regarding safety there is a difference in terms of danger between exercises. A swing is safer than a snatch. A front squat is much safer than a low bar barbell back squat.
And during the bent press you are in a pretty vulnerable position for the shoulder. If an accident hapens and the kb goes backwards you are trapped in arm lock and the shoulder would be destroyed. So it is a fair question whether the benefits outweigh the risk. Personally if I want the most amount of weight overhead I'd jerk a barbell. It would be interesting, however, if some people noticed a measurable carryover to other movements or exercises.


See my video of my fail... no trapped arm.
 
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