all posts post new thread

Barbell Appearance Changes from Abbreviated Routines

Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)

StuKE

Level 4 Valued Member
First of all, sorry about the lengthy title!
I would love to hear from those of you who train / have trained with routines based around using only say up to 3 to 4 exercises. I'd like to know how this kind of training affected your physique, for example, did you see noticeable improvements in certain areas? Did some muscles atrophy? Do you have a physique that looks bodybuilder -ish or is it more functional or athletic looking? Did you gain weight, lose fat etc?
Thanks in advance.
 
I think that the answers to your questions are much more complicated than the result of the exercise variety of a training program. For example, gaining weight or losing fat is primarily a matter of diet. Also, a training program has far more variables other than the exercise selection, such as volume, intensity, set and rep scheme, rest periods, etc.

If you want to know if S&S has brought forth a more favourable body composition in people, then yes, many claim so.

If you want to know if a basic powerlifting regime of squats, deadlifts and bench presses can do it, absolutely.
 
I'm a big fan of abbreviated routines - usually five or six exercises, two to three sets, eight to twelve reps - but, to be honest, could never really handle the higher volume programs recommended in bodybuilding magazines by your typical former Mr Olympia. I think I am what they call a 'hardgainer'. I put on muscle, lost fat and looked like I lifted heavy weights while hardly ever being in the gym more than 30 minutes, two or sometimes three times per week. But there were other guys, bigger than me, who looked like competition bodybuilders, and who spent hours in the gym. They seemed to be rewarded for their effort
 
Yes, obviously diet will play a huge part in how a physique responds, but assuming that there were no major diet changes, I am interested in how people have changed appearance wise according to the type of routine I mentioned. From being into weights and so on for 30 years, I have true a lot, read a lot and seen others train and so on. Nit suggesting I am an expert of course - I'm not but I have come to certain conclusions but I should point out they are not set in stone.
From a basic routine based around few exercises, but worked hard and intelligently, often a person will put on size and obviously get stronger but will not necessarily have the shapely, separated muscle look. Training with higher volume and more exercises is more likely to produce this look but at a cost of having to spend much longer at the gym. Calisthenics routines will often result in great abs and a wiry, lean physique but rarely produce much int he way of mass assuming chemical assistance is nit used!:
As I say, just my thought but I'm always open to other views.
 
I agree entirely. Adequate (for the goal) is different to optimal. And once you inject competition into the mix (as in competitive bodybuilding) then it's no longer just what works for you but what's required to beat the competition.
 
Genetics also plays a huge role. In fact there's a good chance that's mostly what it is. If I trained like Arnold Schwarzenegger I wouldn't win Mr Olympia seven times - I'd just end up in hospital
 
Many have seen results with a simple program of a press (generally the bench), the row or pull ups, the squat, and the stiff legged deadlift which I believe is out of favor now days. If the goal was to add body weight then a high calorie diet was added.

I've used such a program, but generally when time constraints were the issue. So my diet didn't change and I didn't see a problem with such a program. My problem was believing that I needed to do more.
 
The variety of lifts will play a huge role, and how they are trained. If the 4 exercises were bench, bent row, DL, and back squat, you could wind up with a pretty cut physique if that's what you wanted. All depends on your diet and the set/rep/load ranges and pacing. If you do the basics with heavy weight and low reps, lots of rest you will put on size but don't expect to get shredded.

It won't be the same as a more comprehensive routine, but if you train for it you will certainly get cuts and size. If anything you will be a bit more balanced than many other strategies but you will not have bulging biceps, melon-sized tris, huge calves etc.

When I got back into cast iron after a year of bodyweight, I was limited in equipment, so pretty much just like the above routine except I had to do front squats as I had no squat rack. Also did military presses, so that makes 5 lifts. Honestly I got big very quickly, but was also training with a very good partner, eating a ton of protein, and was much much younger. Really just looked athletic but no mistaking I was lifting weights.
 
I was stuck for time but not effort a few years back and spent time loving/hating 20 rep squats.

I would alternate two different sessions

A
Squat 1 x 20
Pullover 1 x 20
A bench variation
A row variation

B
Some practice with an Olympic lift for technique more than anything
A vertical press
A vertical pull
Maybe some arms

So I squatted for 20 reps twice one week and once the next. It wasn't the nicest thing once it got heavy, but it worked. To be honest, everything AFTER the squats/pullovers was just extra.

I should say that there were a few busy week were I just went in for the squat workouts. So the above 'A' workout was done once the first week and twice the next week and that's all I did. Still worked.

Richard
 
Right now I'm trying this routine
The Best Damn Workout Plan For Natural Lifters | T Nation
I changed several things because it;s uncommon hitting the gym six times per week on my current work schedule.

The key point is the special third set of each exercise. Four exercises per day (I added loaded carries and core work now and then).

Training philosophy-wise this program is very similar to how I most often set up my program. I don't get 6 times a week though!
 
Six day push/pull absolutely hammers the elbows and often the shoulders. I'm envious of those that can handle it - maybe they really drop the intensity. Even four days kills me!
 
Normally I do hinges (swings) and some form of squat or lunge with overhead lifting or pressing as a compound movement, every session.

Then I either target pushing or pulling and alternate these. Four days is max. I'd have to cut my workouts by at least a third to train everyday, and I'm down to about 35 minutes per as it is.
 
5x5 Dino style was the best I managed as far a as being abbreviated and providing some decent results in strength and muscle mass. Anything less and my physical appearance suffered.

That being said, I used to do 3 to 6 exercises per body part and regularly got compliments on my appearance and many asked when my next competition was.

I can't even come close to those results from an abbreviated program.
 
I find the frequency, intensity and volume of exercises make a big contribution to body composition in addition to diet - mostly from a hormone perspective. Too much, too often raises cortisol and ruins the physique just as bad, if not worse than a poor diet. The abbreviation should probably come from individual session volume if I had to pick one thing.

I think one needs 2 of 3 to factors be high - less or more than 2 of the 3 and I cannot sustain for long periods. High intensity, high frequency, low volume works a little better for me than high intensity, high volume, low frequency though. Walking is a good example of high volume, high frequency, low intensity that works well for general health benefits.

All that said, I've done and experienced the following.
  1. Deadlift + TGU 2-3x/wk= Durability Gains (felt unbreakable and mobile)
  2. Bench Press + Squat 2-4x/wk = Mass Gain
  3. Barbell Cleans & Press everyday = Superhero type physique (bigger traps & shoulders, leaner torso, athletic.)
  4. Deadlift + Pull-Up, Bench-Press + Dip, Squat + Sit-Ups, Cleans + Curls, Military Press + Triceps Extension, one of the 5 groups M-F followed by a few sprints = Overall monster (leaner, bigger, faster)
 
From a basic routine based around few exercises, but worked hard and intelligently, often a person will put on size and obviously get stronger but will not necessarily have the shapely, separated muscle look. Training with higher volume and more exercises is more likely to produce this look...

Diet Is The Key

As Antti noted, the key to increasing muscle mass and having "shapely, separated muscle" is you diet.

Heavyweight Powerlifters, Olympic Weightlifter and Strong Men all have "shapely, separated muscle"; however, it all buried under a few layers of body fat.

but at a cost of having to spend much longer at the gym. Calisthenics routines will often result in great abs and a wiry, lean physique but rarely produce much int he way of mass assuming chemical assistance is nit used!:

Exercise Is A Poor Method of Burning Fat

Spending longer in the gym, calisthenics, etc will NOT make you give you a wiry, lean physique.

Metabolic Training via High Intensity Interval Training minutely increases caloric expenditure. Exercise slightly increase you metabolic rate (burning more calories post workout) and preserving muscle mass when you on a caloric restricted diet.

Exercise also increase muscle mass. However, if you were to increase you muscle mass by one pound (which is a lot), you daily caloric expenditure would ONLY go up about 80 Calories A Day!

Theoretically, if nothing else changed that would mean you'd burn 2400 additional calories of body fat in a month, losing .68 lbs a month and 8.22 lb of a year.

Research shows the "Net" increase in caloric expenditure of adding a pound of muscle (which is a lot and hard to do) is approximately 4 calories per hour at rest.

Mathematically, that equates to 96 calories per day (24 X 4 = 96) of body fat burned.

However, it doesn't work that way.

All of the weight loss/fat loss program promoted on TV (P90X, Insanity, etc) as well as the Bowflex TV Commercials on their Max Trainer and HVT (High Velocity Training Gym) come with a Diet Plan.

The foundation of all of the above method and all other Metabolic Training Program for achieving fat loss and obtaining the "wiry, lean physique" you referred to are ONLY produce with diet, calorie restriction.

The reason for that is foundation for the following adages...

1) "You CAN'T out train a bad diet."

2) "Abs are made at the table."

Training with higher volume and more exercises is more likely to produce this (wiry, lean physique) look.

NO!!! Training ALONE without ANY diet modification/decrease in calorie intake will NOT "Produce this look."

Kenny Croxdale
 
So much is genetic. Some people don't have to give a passing thought to diet and will be thin with defined muscles. Some will be strong and defined without either exercise or diet. Best not to compare to others or worry about appearance. Maximize your genetics.
This relates to your question because, yeah, some people will have appearance changes from just the powerlifts, others may use a lot of assistance exercises for similar change.
 
If your diet is only a little out of whack, training hard will definitely bring about the changes you want. A slow accumulation of fat is not going to be enough extra calories for very long - yes a pound of muscle does not burn a ton of calories just sitting there, but more muscle burns more calories during exercise, and for over 12 hours after it will continue to burn higher than resting baseline.

Just reconfiguring your diet to provide enough energy for higher intensity workouts will push it in a better direction. It also makes any changes to your diet more apparent in less time - easier to see how diet needs to match output. Realistically if your diet sucks you literally won't have the energy to train with a lot of intensity.

True enough if you want to get shredded you will have to eat for it. You can go a long way without doing anything too radical beyond some common sense eating.
 
Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
Back
Top Bottom