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Barbell bench and deadlift

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jody

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hi, would like some input/links on best accessory's for bench (exp. skull crushers) and deadlift (exp. leg curls)
(been doin 5 x 5 once a week each) all input greatly appreciated
 
Accessory exercises are done for one to improve some weaknesses in his lift. If you haven't been training for long you can still make a lot of progress by only doing BP or DL or SQ.
You might also use accessories if you are in a hypertrophy phase or off season.
I hope you find what you need here.
 
Accessory exercises are done for one to improve some weaknesses in his lift. If you haven't been training for long you can still make a lot of progress by only doing BP or DL or SQ.
You might also use accessories if you are in a hypertrophy phase or off season.
I hope you find what you need here.
will check it out, thanks !
 
The guys at Juggernaut Training rock.

I 100% agree with the Zen-like answer of "it depends on your weakness." However, I don't mind giving you a response based on my experience, so here it is.

Deadlift: Romanian deadlift, squat if you have access to a power rack.

Bench Press: Push press.
 
The guys at Juggernaut Training rock.

I 100% agree with the Zen-like answer of "it depends on your weakness.
1. Yes they do. They are one of the few resources I use outside of SF.
2. Sometimes an answer like that helps someone come with a solution for themselves if they know how to approach the problem. If they feel weak in pulling a weight of the floor, add some Front squat. If mid range is the problem add some RDL and bent over rows. If the lockout is the problem add some speed pulls with bands.
And the trick is not the exercise itself. Is when do you use it? what % and no of reps do you use and so on. So you have to do some extra research on that.

For DL: Block pulls, good morning, bent over rows, banded pulls, slow pulls, speed pulls, RDL, pull to the knee and then full pull, front squats, hip thrusters, very heavy swings, chains.
For BP: board bench press, close grip, narrow grip, chains, banded, press from halfway, pause bench, dips.
If in doubt just train your back. As Ed Coan said "I've never seen a strong person with a weak back"!
I hope this helps.
 
The guys at Juggernaut Training rock.

I 100% agree with the Zen-like answer of "it depends on your weakness." However, I don't mind giving you a response based on my experience, so here it is.

Deadlift: Romanian deadlift, squat if you have access to a power rack.

Bench Press: Push press.
thanks
 
The guys at Juggernaut Training rock.

I 100% agree with the Zen-like answer of "it depends on your weakness." However, I don't mind giving you a response based on my experience, so here it is.

Deadlift: Romanian deadlift, squat if you have access to a power rack.

Bench Press: Push press.
thanks for the info!
 
These accessory lifts are all based on your weakness, but for a newbie lifter like me, where I haven't done multiple cycles and don't know what my weaknesses will be, is there any reason to add them other than hypertrophy?
 
These accessory lifts are all based on your weakness, but for a newbie lifter like me, where I haven't done multiple cycles and don't know what my weaknesses will be, is there any reason to add them other than hypertrophy?

I would argue that variation or novelty are factors that drive the demand for adaptation; getting stronger. They also make your strength more well rounded. The different demand may also save you from some overuse problems. Lastly, the variation may be a mental or psychological boost, which also carries into strength development.
 
These accessory lifts are all based on your weakness, but for a newbie lifter like me, where I haven't done multiple cycles and don't know what my weaknesses will be, is there any reason to add them other than hypertrophy?
Not really. You can make really good gains by only sticking to the lift. Your main concern should be technique, finding what works best for you in terms of angles and such. And you can run multiple cycles for a couple of years and still make gains.
For someone new specificity should be what they should aim for. Personally I wouldn't recommend to someone new to do a variation of a deadlift or BP or SQ for quite some time.
For hypertrophy use dips, and good morning and totally different exercises.
At the end of the day if you train with a coach is up to him to decide what's best for you and if not you go through trial and error.
 
Not really. You can make really good gains by only sticking to the lift. Your main concern should be technique, finding what works best for you in terms of angles and such. And you can run multiple cycles for a couple of years and still make gains.
For someone new specificity should be what they should aim for. Personally I wouldn't recommend to someone new to do a variation of a deadlift or BP or SQ for quite some time.
For hypertrophy use dips, and good morning and totally different exercises.
At the end of the day if you train with a coach is up to him to decide what's best for you and if not you go through trial and error.
I ask because I too just started doing PTTP with bench press and deadlift as my two lifts, but I have only been doing it for 2 weeks. I have done the lifts in the past, but I've never run a full program on either of them so I have PLENTY of room to gain here, and so far I feel great with how things are going. I will stick with the basics for quite some time, but I may try sumo on another cycle when I hit my limit.
 
I ask because I too just started doing PTTP with bench press and deadlift as my two lifts, but I have only been doing it for 2 weeks.

PTTP is meant to be a minimalist program that drives your lifts up using high-frequency training, similar to grease the groove. Milk those gains for all they are worth and then move on to something more complicated.
 
In my view people can get freakishly strong concentrating on two lifts (usually a press + squat or DL) but they look a lot better concentrating on three. Push + Pull + Squat (if you must!) or DL or Leg Press achieves a more balanced physique. The upper body, particularly the arms, really benefit from a Pull and developed triceps next to weedy biceps are a deadset give-away that the Pull is needed
 
For Bench: Close Grip Pushups or Floor Press are some of the best accessories. Floor press is great if you are getting it off your chest a bit and stalling before half way. If you lay flat you have to use your main muscles to move it rather than leverage like off a bench.
For Deadlift: Training with a thick bar then switching back a couple weeks before a meet is quite good. This is going to sound really weird and you may not find this anywhere else, but any kind of squatting seems to help my deadlift.
 
I would argue that variation or novelty are factors that drive the demand for adaptation; getting stronger. They also make your strength more well rounded. The different demand may also save you from some overuse problems. Lastly, the variation may be a mental or psychological boost, which also carries into strength development.
Some variations will "force" the trainees to re-adjust their technique, which can be a good thing. There are stories about squatters who have their squat become good-morning squat when the load goes to a certain load, and they use front squat/front squat variation to help them increase quads strength and reinforce the habit of pushing their knee forward during the lift.

hi, would like some input/links on best accessory's for bench (exp. skull crushers) and deadlift (exp. leg curls)
The only thing that I think will benefit mostly everyone is pause lift, especially at their sticking point.
 
I’ve changed gears a bit on my stance on accessory movements, in fact, hardly ever straying from mutations of the main lifts.

It takes a lot of self analysis and intuition, something that requires experience in the iron game.

Furstly, ask yourself these things:

1) Is my bench press and deadlift technique on point? Are you optimizing your body’s leverage, joint position, movement quality to the max to express the strength you possess in your chosen lift? If not, that is your “accessory work”. Practicing and polishing your lift to perfection.

2). Is my programming on point to the fullest degree? In my personal experience, when one gets obsessed with improvement, patience is lost. I’m guilty of this myself, hitting random maxes, then returning the next day to repeat them, chasing that with cable movements, dumbbell flies, Dan John’s 10,000 Kettlebell swing workout….

Good programming, which must be tailored to your lifestyle to account for recovery, priorities and time available, allows consistent, yet gradual progression to reach an end goal. You’re always teeter tottering between work and rest, and falling too far too either will lead to stagnation.

Now, if these two things are in check, one may want to consider variations or assistance work. People have made incredible progress with basic linear programs of just the basics such as 5 x 5, 5/3/1 or Starting Strength…the basics.

When is Assistance Work needed?

We are all built differently and we excel at different tasks. Lifting a barbell is no different. What are your personal issues with each lift?? Maybe you’re explosive off the floor on the pull but at knee level your before your back rounds like a camel or maybe on bench you’re bouncing your reps because the bar is too heavy to control downwards….

Once again, it goes back to technique..

Your assistance work is meant MUST be tuned to your technique on the lift. Would dumbbell incline presses make a guy who can’t lower the bar too his chest with control a better bencher?….maybe. Or maybe lowering the weights on his bench and learning to lower the weights on his bench would actually just make more sense.

Likewise, a deadlifter who tries to yank his pull by “squatting the bar” and throwing his back into flexion after his hips fly over his head might realize…he has no idea how to hinge and his hamstrings are tight. Mr. Joe Puller might do some light RDL’s, or Goodmornings, just learning how to sit back into his hammies, may go and deadlift the bar, now knowing the hinge, and it all just suddenly clicks…

To review, so far

1) Practiced the basic lifts for long periods of time, perfecting technique and developing a good base level of strength.
2) Program correctly, cycling when needed and make sure your life outside the gym is in order.

So, if I assume you’ve covered all these other bases and you’ve stagnated then assistance work might just be what you need.

For me, each lift poses its own issues.

The Squat
The squat is a technically frightening lift for me with my long legs. It all starts before unrack the bar, something I take a lot of time with.

My practice of the squat has led me to find, the more often I squat, the better. I’ve squatted six days in the last week at weights between 6-8 RPE with an occasional 8.5 or 5.5 if needed. In fact, I really only do the exact competition lift on Monday…

My accessory work includes only other squat variations such as:

1) Tempo Squat (to grove proper descent)
2) Pause Squat (at various points including descent, bottom or on the way back up at sticking point).
3) High Bar Squats (for speed)

As you can see, these are all mutations of the basic squat.

Bench Press
If you’re not controlling your descent, like I said, lower the weight and doing tempo bench press would be the best thing to build your strength, lowering the weights, upping the quality volume or reps may be better then throwing load on top of dysfunction.

However, bench press I feel can handle a bit more accessory work, namely because the main muscles of the upper body (and there are many involved in the bench press) are smaller and weaker than in the lower body. Many more things can come out of balance with the wobbly shoulder joint and generally poor upper body motor control in displaying strength as compared to the lower body. (The lower body is stronger yet the upper body more coordinated for interacting with the world or intricate but lighter tasks.)

I find the pressing workouts are enough….most of the time. That is, doing many bench presses. However, throughout my sessions, my warmups will include pausing, slow descents, or the likes.) After my Monday workout, assessing my technique, I found I hit a wall right at halfway. So what would help me with this?


Lowering the bar just below my sticking point, pausing there, feeling the position, finishing the lift. As you can see, this is tough. In fact, it requires me to use a lower weight because it exposes a weakness. While Supra max lifts such as partial ROM lifts will help to an extent, they are easily abused for ego satisfaction. So, Will this work?

I believe when we do something with intention, that is with a focus to deliver an outcome, the response is enhanced. Yet sometimes this involves trial and error, such as fixing an engine, you meddle with this and with that until you find the right tweak.

It is when you get impatient, throwing the kitchen sink at the issue instead of focusing your efforts on that one thing that may make the difference.

If you’re weak on the bottom, dumbbell presses where you open your chest in the same position as the bottom of your bench and practicing just the start, long pause bench presses, soft touch benches, bench starts…you only need to meddle a little and find that tweak. It must be done with the focus of increasing your bench, otherwise it’s not intention it’s just distraction. The bench takes more patience than the other two lifts and when rushed, it will bully you into submission.

Deadlift

I use to rush this lift, and sometimes still do. That means because 315 flew off the ground, I thought 405 would do the same…remember that humpback guy who spits water in the desert? That was me. It wasn’t until I found although I want to drive the weight off the floor, I still have to apply steady pressure and sit into my hamstrings. This, this became my assistance lift.


The platform makes the start lower and the lift longer (like a dumbbell press makes the bench press longer). The pause allows me just to work on the start three times, pausing at the sticking point to check if that’s on point, then doing a full rep to assimilate my assistance work into the competition lift.

Real Assistance
There are some things I definitely found helpful with in keeping me fresh and strengthening EVERY lift.

Rows and Lat Work (for bench, deadlift and squat)
Grip work
Power Breathing
Strength Stretches (RDL’s, Good Mornings, Flies, Hanging Freon pull-up bar for long periods, Kono Deadlift)
Pumpworkfor back or muscles neglected in power lifts - (This, in conjunction with strength stretching, builds up the neglected supporting muscles such as the upper back or knee flexors while stretching the muscle groups that are probably tight from strength practice and everyday life).

So there you have it. Call Assistance when needed but until then, try looking back at the bigger picture and seeing what’s really missing.

One Final Thing…
Sometimes, we need a change or distraction. We can get easily obsessed with chasing a number that the more we pursue it, the more it evades us…like the person recovering from a bad breakup has a buddy to distract them and rejuvenate their spirit, after endless months of bench and deadlifting with no progress, a stint of just fun lifts can be just what the doctor ordered. An iron vacation, where you practice lifts you’ve never tried, get pumps and maybe even set PRs in incline presses or RDL’s.

Sometimes, space is what an issue we’ve arduously pursued needs so it has the time to settle in to itself. These stages can lead you to new places and discoveries you hadn’t considered, along with rejuvenated the joie de vivre of training.

Good luck to you on your iron odyssey. ??
 
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