Bodyweight Body weight & Hip Hinge ?

[Andrej SK]

Hi guys, I just wonder what's your view on doing just body-weight workout as a long term stand alone approach. I'm especially interested in whether BW is able to comprise all the basic movements of the body, in particular hip-hinge. I see options for lower push (squat), upper push (push ups), upper pull (pull ups) but I'm struggling a bit with lower pull (hip hinge) I hope you know what I mean. I'm asking because for few years my lower back has been bothering me here and there...I think that hip hinge movement (deadlift, swings) is something that might help me strengthen that...but I'm curious if BW can do the same or is there a need to implement Swings for example....

Thank you !

 

[Maine-ah KB]

yes and no. let me explain Single Leg Deadlifts bw is a great mobility/balance drill. thats the only pure hip hinge that I can think of. bodyweight people train simular muscles with bridges, lever progressions or airborne lunge but there not hinge motions.

 

[IcyROM]

Nordic curls and handstand presses are the best posterior chain and hip hinge exercises. They are very hard. That's bad because it will take long to master but good because there are strength benefits gained for many years.

Many people build up to 2 and a half times BW Deadlifts purely doing calisthenics. Coach Sommers mentioned that in multiple occasions his gymnasts will pull 3 times Bodyweight with zero barbell experience (first try).

The bad news is if you just do DL or swings you will get there faster and less complex. Calisthenics will take longer and more effort. But the nice thing is that doing it the calisthenics way, you get to master very cool, do-anywhere, posterior chain exercises (the Nordic Curl and HS press) while if you simply just did DLs, you might not be any closer to being able to do those. I think the carry-over is mostly one way. So there's advantages and disadvantages of course

Just some thoughts from me bye bye

 

[Kozushi]

Al Kavadlo recommends back bridges. Pavel mentions them in Naked Warrior for handling the back chain of muscles.

Really, if you refuse to pick up a weight, you're just being stubborn. Even primitive people carried things around. This is why we have hands.

Pavel recommends deadlifts or kettlebell swings as a necessary adjunct to bodyweight training. You can get away with just those, but otherwise, like I said, you're just being stubborn for no good reason. There is nothing at all "natural" about refusing to pick up anything from the ground - in fact it's just being lazy.

Travelling in Korea, I lifted a heavy backpack and pails full of water and sometimes large rocks to make sure my back muscles didn't atrophy.

 

[Andrej SK]

Yeah, I agree, bodyweight cant replace holding and carrying objects, thats a good point, but at least Im wondering whats the minimun requirement... so based on what Kozushi wrote, it's swings or deadlifts... right ? So 1 KB exercise should be sufficient to complement bodyweight training...

IcyRom, Nordic curls are a great idea, I have never seen them before but how on earth do hand stand push ups work out posteriot chain ?

 

[IcyROM]

IcyRom, Nordic curls are a great idea, I have never seen them before but how on earth do hand stand push ups work out posteriot chain ?

Not handstand push-ups. Handstand presses.


Scroll to minute 0:36 to see one.

They can be done with the back to the wall if you only care about building up the posterior chain. But even those will most likely be too difficult for many months so you can regress with negatives, bent arm presses, headstand presses and others.

It is the opposite of a hanging leg raise except much much harder.

A great thing is that the leverage is so poor that you only need to add a little weight (ankle weights) to make it twice as hard. Exercises with poor leverage are exactly how gymnasts build world class strength with little or no weights (Pavel Tsatsouline mentions this in a book The Naked Warrior). The muscle doesn't see weight only resistance and tension.

 

[Kettlebelephant]

@Andrej SK
He talks about handstand presses not handstand pushups.
Handstand presses are like the opposite of hanging leg raises - see the pic below. You can make it easier (compared to the pic) by doing them with the back against a wall.


Edit: Weird, but when I posted @IcyROM 'S response wasn't there So yeah, what he said

 

[JonS]

Pavel recommends deadlifts or kettlebell swings as a necessary adjunct to bodyweight training.

To clarify, the recommendation from the naked warrior text is DL or KB snatches, not swings. As one who briefly followed the NW/snatches recommendation, there is a world of difference.

 

[somanaut]

To clarify, the recommendation from the naked warrior text is DL or KB snatches, not swings. As one who briefly followed the NW/snatches recommendation, there is a world of difference.

How so? And did you think snatches was enough to keep your posterior chain (which I assume is what we are referring to) in good shape to do what you want to do?

 

[ali]

Broad jump?
It is a swing , rather than storing elastic energy you use it to fly. And then land with grace. Always with grace.

 

[offwidth]

Broad jump?
It is a swing , rather than storing elastic energy you use it to fly. And then land with grace. Always with grace.

Excellent suggestion....

 

[Kozushi]

Yeah, I agree, bodyweight cant replace holding and carrying objects, thats a good point, but at least Im wondering whats the minimun requirement... so based on what Kozushi wrote, it's swings or deadlifts... right ? So 1 KB exercise should be sufficient to complement bodyweight training...

IcyRom, Nordic curls are a great idea, I have never seen them before but how on earth do hand stand push ups work out posteriot chain ?

The idea is to activate the entire chain of pulling muscles through your upper and lower bodies, so deadlifts, swings and snatches fit the bill.

 

[JonS]

How so? And did you think snatches was enough to keep your posterior chain (which I assume is what we are referring to) in good shape to do what you want to do?

It hits the areas that the NW doesn't to a much greater degree than the swing. I used the NW as the strength component while following an A+A snatch program by Al Ciampa. It worked very well. I believe that heavy deadlifts will do the same. The swing is appropriate for those who don't have good snatch form yet and don't have access or want to use a barbell.

 

[User 7569]

I found practicing with a fixed weight barbell to be particularly useful when practicing the Naked Warrior.

The weight is "fixed" to your body weight. I'll load mine up to 165 and just keep it there for weeks. Practicing picking it up 2-3 times a week helped out with the 2 main strength moves, believe it or not (pistol and OAPU)

but then again I've ran it without a hinge and it worked fine as well

 

[Karen Smith]

Single Leg Deadlift even done BW (slow and controlled) can build strength. They have kept my barbell deadlift strength pretty high with minimal volume.

 

[Steve Freides]

I GTG w single leg, bw-only deadlifts. Take the dishes out of the dishwasher this way.

-S-

 

[Zack]

I'm asking because for few years my lower back has been bothering me here and there...I think that hip hinge movement (deadlift, swings) is something that might help me strengthen that

Maybe or maybe not, but that's best addressed by a professional.

Orthopedic issues aside, BW SLDLs are probably more challenging and valuable than most people realize as Karen stated.

Take all of the above into account plus glute bridge & hip thrust variations and of course hill sprints.

 

[elli]

Jump without jumping.

 

[North Coast Miller]

Single Leg Deadlift, broad jump.

When I am doing BW I'll execute SLDL and slowly drop as deep into the hinge as possible. Bring up the extended leg while keeping my hips at that level to touch my knee to the back of the working heel, transitioning to a skater squat.
Stand up from there or reverse the move.

 

[Bryant W]

I'm asking because for few years my lower back has been bothering me here and there...I think that hip hinge movement (deadlift, swings) is something that might help me strengthen that

I agree with Zach. Working the hinge will get the hinge stronger if you are able to do it without worsening your back, but doesn't necessarily equate with improving your back pain.

I experimented with focusing on the hinge to improve similar issues. I got better at the hinge, but was still always working around the pain. For me, skilled PT/manual therapy, diaphragmatic breathing behind the shield, some weighted mobility (KB windmill was very useful for me), and various isometric holds were the answer. Of course your issues may have different answers.

As far as hinge options, there are plenty of great options already listed above. As long as they aren't worsening your back pain, no harm in trying them. But if they don't improve your problem, keep looking for different means.

Best of luck!