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Bodyweight Bodyweight Fitness Program

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Hello and Welcome!

I'm somewhat new to this forum also but not to the community (been on dragondoor also). I'm going to offer advice that does not come from this or the dragondoor website but from a former Navy SEAL. You will do yourself a lot of good by building your base prior to doing any of the fancy moves. I've been going this route for some time and found that my strength and body composition has seen far better results than anything I have done before. This route takes a bit of intestinal fortitude but will yield great results.

The first style is Pyramids. I alternate between Pull-Ups and Handstand Push-Ups as my main movement (more on this later), and perform a pyramid of 1 - 10 - 1 (1 rep to 10 reps and back down to 1 rep). I will go as far as I can by myself and then add some bands for assistance as I start to reach failure. Additionally, I do a pressing or rowing movement for 2 - 20 - 2 (2 rep increments) and an abs/core movement for 3 - 30 - 3 (3 rep increments). You can also add in some form of legs for 4 - 40 - 4 (4 rep increments) if you feel ambitious. After the main movement, I usually alternate two different pressing, core, and leg exercises for variety's sake. If that makes sense, my set-up is somewhat like this.

Pull-Ups OR Handstand Push-Ups 1 - 10 - 1
Push-Up & Dips OR Rowing 2 - 20 -2
Leg Raises & Planks OR Obliques & Lower Back 3 - 30 - 3
Squats, Lunges, Archer Squat, Leg Curls...etc 4 - 40 - 4

*Substitute any movement you wish, this is just an example.*

The second style is Rep Goal. I'm sure most have heard of this, but if not here is an explanation. I pick a movement, say Pull-Ups and choose to do 50 total reps (or any other rep goal) before I end my session. Allow assistance if you are unable to do even 1 pull-up (or other chosen movement). You then rest between pull-up sets by doing a pressing movement for 2 times the previous pull-up set (so pull-ups = 6 pressing reps), a core movement for 3 times the pull-up numbers (so 3 pull-ups = 9 reps for core), and a leg movement for 4 times the pull-up numbers (so 3 pull-ups = 12 leg reps). The set-up all rolled up looks like this...

Pull-Ups OR Handstand Push-Ups x 50
Push-Up & Dips OR Rowing x 2
Leg Raises & Planks OR Obliques & Lower Back x 3
Squats, Lunges, Archer Squat, Leg Curls...etc x 4

Alternate the Pyramid and Rep Goal for a Heavy / Light cycle. It sounds complex but isn't. And the Pyramid workouts have the warm-up and cool-down already built in. If you want more information go to military.com and search "physical progressions".

The goal is to eventually complete the entire pyramid without assisting pull-ups or handstand push-ups (or whatever else you choose). If you do not have bands, they're not too expensive to pick up at your local sports supply store.
 
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Yes thank you Nathan this seems very helpful. I don't want to seem like I'm not following advice but yesterday I tried that program by Karen because she mentioned it would be a good idea. Sorry :/

I tried the Monday routine. It felt strange. Didn't really feel very difficult and did it in only 15 minutes.

Ugh I'm not sure it's a good idea to follow I wish Karen wasn't so busy all the time and could let me know if she thinks it can work.
 
@IcyROM , depending on your level of fitness, you may need to start with a shorter pyramid and a lower rep goal. Here is a link to the Stew Smith article this comes from, I forgot to add it.

About Stew Smith Fitness - PT Club - Former Navy SEAL CSCS

You can also click the "articles" link to get a lot more free information from him. Military.com has more stuff also.

I want to make my own comments concerning strength, muscle mass, and calisthenics. Depending on your level of fitness, calisthenics can begin as a purely strength movement if, for example, you can only do between 1 - 5 pull-ups or some other movement. As you get stronger, the movements can transition into a hypertrophy stage, for example, doing 8 - 12 pull-ups. Then they can culminate into strength-endurance as you go beyond 12 reps (12 reps is just an arbitrary number for use as an example).

The great part about calisthenics is that the tendons and ligaments are allowed to keep up with muscle strength, size, and endurance. With barbell work you can easily out pace your tendons and ligaments with stronger and larger muscles. Eventually you may believe your muscles are strong enough to move a certain weight but your joints aren't. This is a recipe for a disaster and I can say with experience this isn't a fun scenario. Gaining strength and size with calisthenics is absolutely possible, but will not come as quickly versus barbells. This doesn't mean that barbells are "better", just faster, and we all know what happens when we try to rush results.
 
The great part about calisthenics is that the tendons and ligaments are allowed to keep up with muscle strength, size, and endurance. With barbell work you can easily out pace your tendons and ligaments with stronger and larger muscles. Eventually you may believe your muscles are strong enough to move a certain weight but your joints aren't. This is a recipe for a disaster and I can say with experience this isn't a fun scenario. Gaining strength and size with calisthenics is absolutely possible, but will not come as quickly versus barbells. This doesn't mean that barbells are "better", just faster, and we all know what happens when we try to rush results.
Man,,,, this just seems to make so much sense, I like the way you put that.
 
Hello,
I have updates from the past months of training and looking for advice to dk next.

I did the routine i menyioned i made from speaking with Karen above for 6 weeks. It didnt feel veru difficult but i stuck to it to make sure i did properly but i did not really improve muscle size. Strength was the same too still stuck on tuck planche. Maybe I was under training? It did not feel like any work.

I then decided maybe a cookie cutter routine is best instead of something i made so i followed this found on this website:
Surprise Yourself With Strength on This Bodyweight Training Plan | StrongFirst

I improved repetitions a bit in OAPU but also no particular muscle changes. It didn't feel like good improvement after 14 weeks of work.

I was frustrated from lack of progress so I haven't followed anything very structured since then.

I want to update to see if anyone has any other advice about programs for muscle and strength that are reliable and work well. I just want something that works. It feels I have trained for years now but no real improvement and still stuck. It is a really sad feeling and I think I'm coming to terms that maybe i cannot improve more.

Thanks and sorry for spelling and English
 
If all the above programs haven't worked or don't meet your needs, consider "Overcoming Gravity" by Steven Low. It is a great book which teaches you how to construct a bodyweight program for various goals (including hypertrophy and strength). Apologies if it has already been recommended to you.

You might also like a YouTube channel called the Red Delta Project. He has some good stuff on body weight bodybuilding, though his principles are somewhat non-strongfirst.

If you have got a 50kg chin, you probably are already very strong I imagine - can't you keep doing what you are doing / what got you there?! That's strong stuff :)
 
If all the above programs haven't worked or don't meet your needs, consider "Overcoming Gravity" by Steven Low. It is a great book which teaches you how to construct a bodyweight program for various goals (including hypertrophy and strength). Apologies if it has already been recommended to you.

You might also like a YouTube channel called the Red Delta Project. He has some good stuff on body weight bodybuilding, though his principles are somewhat non-strongfirst.

If you have got a 50kg chin, you probably are already very strong I imagine - can't you keep doing what you are doing / what got you there?! That's strong stuff :)
Hello thank you for the reply.

I have heard about Overcoming Gravity. It is a little expensive but I will buy if you think this is the good option. What results do you think I can achieve on this program? I am hoping to add maybe 5 kilos of muscular mass. Also improve strength

I cannot do Pullup with 50 kilograms. I could about three years ago but I have lost strength. Today I could do with 30 kilograms I think. I think this is good strength but I am hoping to build more strength and muscle and also not just in pullups and back but all over body.

I hope this makes sense
 
Hello thank you for the reply.

I have heard about Overcoming Gravity. It is a little expensive but I will buy if you think this is the good option. What results do you think I can achieve on this program? I am hoping to add maybe 5 kilos of muscular mass. Also improve strength

I cannot do Pullup with 50 kilograms. I could about three years ago but I have lost strength. Today I could do with 30 kilograms I think. I think this is good strength but I am hoping to build more strength and muscle and also not just in pullups and back but all over body.

I hope this makes sense

Makes perfect sense!

Overcoming Gravity won't be the best option if you want a ready made program - it doesn't have a program, but instead teaches you about the science of programming and teaches the progressions for bodyweight exercises so that you can construct your own program. It also contains a great deal about exercise science in general, which I guess is partly why it is so expensive, and which may be of no interest to you.

With a 30kg pull up you and I are in a similar boat I think - I don't know what my max pull up is but I can do sets of 4 with 24kg. I'm currently training calisthenics more for muscular endurance rather than max strength as you are doing, but have trained for hypertrophy/strength in the past.

Are you able to train with weighted calisthenics? If so, for upper body needs this article might interest you: How to Train for Mass With Chins and Dips | StrongFirst

Weighted dips + weighted chins + food + sleep + patience will get you where you need to be I'm sure!

Legs is always a problem for calisthenics. After pistols there isn't much to do other than add weight. But you can build some solid legs with pistols and sprints and plyometrics. Or you can concentrate more on endurance for the lower body. I'm sure there's a reason the lower body has a greater proportion of slow twitch fibers than the upper body.

I also understand if you want a "pure" bodyweight program - the simplicity and convenience of calisthenics is kind of ruined when you have to mess around with weight belts.

Hope that is of some help!
 
I'm no expert but I've thought about trying edt push-ups and pull-ups. Anyone experiment with this

I've also thought about this for hypertrophy / strength endurance and would be interested in hearing about results.

I may experiment with it for a while. If I do, I'll let you know how it goes.
 
Makes perfect sense!

Overcoming Gravity won't be the best option if you want a ready made program - it doesn't have a program, but instead teaches you about the science of programming and teaches the progressions for bodyweight exercises so that you can construct your own program. It also contains a great deal about exercise science in general, which I guess is partly why it is so expensive, and which may be of no interest to you.

With a 30kg pull up you and I are in a similar boat I think - I don't know what my max pull up is but I can do sets of 4 with 24kg. I'm currently training calisthenics more for muscular endurance rather than max strength as you are doing, but have trained for hypertrophy/strength in the past.

Are you able to train with weighted calisthenics? If so, for upper body needs this article might interest you: How to Train for Mass With Chins and Dips | StrongFirst

Weighted dips + weighted chins + food + sleep + patience will get you where you need to be I'm sure!

Legs is always a problem for calisthenics. After pistols there isn't much to do other than add weight. But you can build some solid legs with pistols and sprints and plyometrics. Or you can concentrate more on endurance for the lower body. I'm sure there's a reason the lower body has a greater proportion of slow twitch fibers than the upper body.

I also understand if you want a "pure" bodyweight program - the simplicity and convenience of calisthenics is kind of ruined when you have to mess around with weight belts.

Hope that is of some help!
Yes I can get weights but no weights would be easier for me since I would not need purchase the weights.

I will order Overcoming Gravity because of your advice and try it for 8 weeks to give it a good test. Thank you very much for your experience and knowledge
 
Yes I can get weights but no weights would be easier for me since I would not need purchase the weights.

I will order Overcoming Gravity because of your advice and try it for 8 weeks to give it a good test. Thank you very much for your experience and knowledge
Just remember what @Augustus F-N said...
Overcoming Gravity is not a programme.
It will have plenty of good information, modalities, and science of programming; but you will need to build your own programme to follow
 
Just remember what @Augustus F-N said...
Overcoming Gravity is not a programme.
It will have plenty of good information, modalities, and science of programming; but you will need to build your own programme to follow
Ok well I think it's my only choice left at this point then. I guess it is worth a try.
 
Naked Warrior is excellent. It can be supplemented with pullups.

For a book on pullups, Al Kavaldo's "Raise the Bar" has inspired me.
 
Naked Warrior is excellent. It can be supplemented with pullups.

For a book on pullups, Al Kavaldo's "Raise the Bar" has inspired me.
I answered to this earlier in this thread here :

Hello Carl thank you for the response.

I have done Naked Warrior and used Al Kavadlo's books because they were recommendations in another forum. I think I can say that they were not very good for growing muscle in my experience. So I am now looking for something else that does work for goals of strength and muscle.

But this thread is very long now and I have read some of Overcoming Gravity to build a program so I think it is better maybe to start a new thread asking for opinions since it is hard to know what was discussed in a longer thread.

Thanks
 
I answered to this earlier in this thread here :

But this thread is very long now and I have read some of Overcoming Gravity to build a program so I think it is better maybe to start a new thread asking for opinions since it is hard to know what was discussed in a longer thread.
Thanks
Hi IcyROM and forum users,
I have read Al Kavadlo's books as well, and found a lot of insights there, which I continue to follow.
And for beginners or amateurs, I would recommend to try fitness apps, there are plenty of them on the Appstore or Google play.
I have used "Sweat it", it is focused on the bodyweight exercises only and the workouts there are prepared by certified coach. Also it has quite good planning and tracking what suits my needs. I will leave a reference to it here: Sweat it - Fitness at Home

You may try this app or another app, however I would recommend this one, since it is free. Hope my advice will help
 
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