all posts post new thread

Barbell Can Zercher Squats do it all?

Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
wespom9 said:
@Steve Freides great lift, but is that what KB Zercher Squat meant? I thought it meant kettlebells. That's my confusion
Your lift - deadlifting the barbell, then zercher squat - I love! I've got more than one or two weird looks when I've done it
Click to expand...

FWIW, here's the Zercher Lift - note "lift", not called a squat - from the USAWA rule book:

C8. Zercher Lift
The bar starts on the platform and at the lifter’s discretion the bar is deadlifted to a position where it may be supported on the knees or thighs. Feet placement is optional, but the feet must be in line with the torso. The lifter will then bend down, with the bar resting on the legs, to a position in which the lifter is able to secure the bar in the crooks of the elbows. The lifter will then stand erect with the arms bent and the bar fixed at the articulation of the upper and lower arms. The feet must not move during the lift and the bar must not be supported by the lifting belt during the lift. The lifter’s arms may be inside or outside of the legs. The hands may be locked together. Once the bar is motionless, the legs straight, the body erect with shoulders upright, an official will give a command to lower the bar. The bar must be returned to the platform under control for the lift to be complete. It is acceptable to drop the bar once it is below the level of the knees provided that the hands follow the bar to the platform.
Click to expand...

A Zercher starting with the bar in a rack or on squat stands is something else - maybe that's the Zercher "squat" and not "lift." IDK.

I just watched the IG of the kettlebell Zercher. No thanks! The kettlebell handle isn't resting in the crooks of the elbows - not something I am interested in trying.

-S-
 
wespom9 said:
Looks uncomfortable as hell
Click to expand...
Sure, but the barbell Zercher isn't exactly 'comfortable'.

I do feel like sticking your arms through the kb handles is asking for trouble if something goes awry. If I had two kettlebells, I'd do KB front squats instead; no need to make things unnecessarily 'funky'.

I love the barbell Zercher squat though: It was my go-to squat for training at home when all I had was a barbell and hadn't yet learned how to clean it to my shoulders.

It's a humbling movement even at relatively low loads and one that will raise a few eyebrows in the gym while at the same time having actual legitimate utility as a strength building exercise.
 
Chrisdavisjr said:
I do feel like sticking your arms through the kb handles is asking for trouble if something goes awry. If I had two kettlebells, I'd do KB front squats instead; no need to make things unnecessarily 'funky'.
Click to expand...
There is definitely something in common between the barbell Zercher and the kb fs. Good observation.

-S-
 
I really like what @Geoff Neupert wrote.

If we look at the common and easily loadable tools, dumbbells, barbells, kettlebell, the zercher is the most natural way to squat. It's the same position I go to whenever I need to lift something in my everyday life, whether it's a machine or a log or whatever.

I really what the position does for bracing. It's alike with the elbows going inside the knees. It just happens. If there was no stigma on the lift about hurting the elbows or being painful or worse than the back/front squat or whatever, I think it would be the very first lift to use when teaching the squat.
 
Antti said:
If there was no stigma on the lift about hurting the elbows or being painful or worse than the back/front squat or whatever, I think it would be the very first lift to use when teaching the squat.
Click to expand...

It is taught at the SFL on the first day. Front squat, Zercher Squat, Back Squat are the first three lifts in my manual, though according to my notes we did Front, Back, then Zercher.
 
Would it be silly to practice some kettlebell Zercher squats with a single bell, same reps each side, or do you really need doubles?
 
Here's an article i did back in 2007 that might be helpful.
This particular style from the bottom up off pins is a hybrid of a BU squat and a DL/good morning type lockout.
Here's my experience.

"In this article I'm going to explain how one can maintain their strength in the deadlift and even increase it with minimal deadlifting using the Zercher lift.

First of all what is the zercher lift? The original way to do the lift was created by a man named Ed Zercher Sr. back in the 30's.He did these by deadlifting to an upright position. Then squatting down to parallel with the bar balanced on his mid thighs he then hooked his arms up to the elbows under the barbell. From there standing to an upright position while the bar still cradled in the crooks of his elbows. Then the lift is reversed in the same manner back to the floor to the thighs and back up for the desired number of reps and then set back down to the floor. It is said he started doing these because his basement gym lacked squat stands. These days most everyone just does the top part of the lift taking the bar off hooks in a power rack squatting down and back up. I call this style zercher squats. The next style is off different pin heights in a power rack to a standing position then back down. I call this style Zercher lifts. I will be talking about the "the off the pins" version since it is closer to the deadlift and could be called the dead Zercher.

I will now give you a little back ground to how I ended up using this lift in my workouts. About five years ago while working out in my martial arts class I was thrown to the floor landing directly on my elbow breaking it. Not knowing at the time it was broken I did the usual ice and Advil therapy. The elbow eventually felt better but my arm healed in a permanent at a 30 degree angle because it hurt to extend it out when it was healing I kept in a bent position most of the time. After it healed I was able to do most of the average things I could do before the break even with my slightly bent arm.

Enter the deadlift. When I got back to deadlifting, I noticed pain in the elbow forearm area of the previously broken elbow when getting into lifts at 400+lbs. At first it wasn't too bad but over a period of time the pain became more intense to the point I could not even pull a 400lb deadlift. I easily had the strength to do it but had to set the bar down after only lifting one foot off the floor because of the severe pain. Not being even able to pull 80% off my DL max this lift was taking a nose dive fast. A little depressing since the deadlift is my favorite of the three powerlifts. Speaking one day with Pavel about my dilemma he made a suggestion I give Zercher lifts a try. An idea he picked up from Bud Jeffries. I felt the deadlift volume I was doing was probably irritating scar tissue or tendons or both and the Zercher lift seemed like a logical choice to cut down on my DL volume, give my elbow a break and keep my deadlifting muscles strong. So begins the Zercher experiment. Pavel recommended twice a week with one day being a heavy day and one day a light day and minimal deadlifting to be done on both days. I do my Zerchers as I described above, in a power rack off pins.

I feel doing them this way somewhat simulates the deadlift better as there is not a stretch reflex as in the squat variety Zercher and posterior chain muscle groups are hit hard. On my heavy day I set the pins so the bar is about 4-5 inches above my knees. On light days the pin level is set so the bar is set at the lower part of the knee. There is roughly a six inch difference between the high and low pins. Deadlifts are done after a few warm up sets of Zerchers for no more than five singles and as few as three singles with a weight of 50% to 70% of a max single DL in my case, basically to keep in touch with my technique. After that it's back to the meat of the workout on the Zerchers. Here I work up in percentages from 70% to 100 % of my best single Zercher with reps ranging from 1 to 5 with 3's being the most commonly used. I also established PR's on the 1, 3, and 5 reps at both the high and low pins for variety and to keep me motivated. I use six week cycles .That would be six workouts on the heavy day/high pins and six workouts on the light day/lower pins, twelve workouts total for the cycle. I follow a percentage format using Prilipins table as guide line for sets and reps. After six weeks I change the pin height either up or down one hole in the rack to slightly change the stimulus. I also establish PR's at these levels. Lately I have been using even more variety with the Zerchers attaching kettlebells on bands to the bar which hits the obliques and intercostals hard due to the unstableness of the bar or putting a jump stretch band around my neck and standing on the other end and standing up with it while cradling the in my arms which really hits the lumbar's and glutes. As you can see I like to keep it interesting which helps keep me from getting stale on the lift."
 
It did occur to me that, in lieu of a barbell, if your KB is too awkward or heavy to goblet squat you could use a length of sturdy pipe either through the handle or fastened wth a strap of some kind (a loop of webbing would do) and perform Zercher squats that way.

That should satisfy any masochist who's desperate to get some iron into the creases of their elbows.
 
Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
Back
Top Bottom