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Barbell Can Zercher Squats do it all?

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Here’s this question -

What are everyone’s thoughts on the full Zercher vs starting from the rack?

I gotta believe that 80%+ of the benefits gained from the movement come from the actual squat.

Considering spending 1-month without the rack to see what happens so I’m curious to see what everyone feedback looks like.
 
Chase Hines said:
Here’s this question -

What are everyone’s thoughts on the full Zercher vs starting from the rack?

I gotta believe that 80%+ of the benefits gained from the movement come from the actual squat.

Considering spending 1-month without the rack to see what happens so I’m curious to see what everyone feedback looks like.
Click to expand...
Thinking it will be a good experiment. You might not always be around a rack.
 
Chase Hines said:
Here’s this question -

What are everyone’s thoughts on the full Zercher vs starting from the rack?

I gotta believe that 80%+ of the benefits gained from the movement come from the actual squat.

Considering spending 1-month without the rack to see what happens so I’m curious to see what everyone feedback looks like.
Click to expand...

I don't think there's a huge difference. The maxes I've tried have been pretty close regardless of the exact variation. Close enough that daily fluctuations may account for it.

I agree that the squat is the main thing.

You could do a long pause for a dead stop even if you start from a rack. And with a rack, you could do pin zerchers, which I would argue are the hardest of the lot, if set at real height.

I have done enough of all of them to know I love them all pretty much equally. I think it's a great idea to do different variations regularly.
 
Antti said:
I don't think there's a huge difference. The maxes I've tried have been pretty close regardless of the exact variation. Close enough that daily fluctuations may account for it.

I agree that the squat is the main thing.

You could do a long pause for a dead stop even if you start from a rack. And with a rack, you could do pin zerchers, which I would argue are the hardest of the lot, if set at real height.

I have done enough of all of them to know I love them all pretty much equally. I think it's a great idea to do different variations regularly.
Click to expand...
Yea I agree. I’ve became pretty efficient with the squat portion so it’s time to add some new flavor.

Here’s a trial run from my first full cycle 225 5x2 -



I’d agree that it doesn’t “feel” very different. I’ve always mixed in full cycle reps here and there but it’s refreshing change of pace to go no rack for the full session.
 
Hardartery said:
Yes. The 100's are a PITA so I leave them on the bar right now, as I'm only unsing it for DL's and DL variations. One day I will get to use a rack and actually do squats again. It will be interesting to see where I am after not squatting for over a year.
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Crikey. Are you even able to load 100lb plates onto the bar while it's in the squat rack?
 
Chrisdavisjr said:
Crikey. Are you even able to load 100lb plates onto the bar while it's in the squat rack?
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Yes, But it's tricky. It's easier to load a 45 first because it won't catapult that way but most guys aren't into making a 200lb jump. If it's a really wide rack it works. I am over the idea of 100's, one of these days I will be replacing all of my steel plates with calibrated and then there won't be 100's to deal with. Calibrated are prettier anyway.
 
I'm wondering if the Zercher has any potential applications for Oly-lifting (mainly as an excuse to include them in my program).

I fear that the front squat has pretty much got things covered from that angle, still I'm wondering if there's anything the Zercher does that the front squat doesn't (not counting the additional abdominal training effect, 'breathing behind the shield' and elbow-crease conditioning).
 
Chase Hines said:
Here’s this question -

What are everyone’s thoughts on the full Zercher vs starting from the rack?

I gotta believe that 80%+ of the benefits gained from the movement come from the actual squat.

Considering spending 1-month without the rack to see what happens so I’m curious to see what everyone feedback looks like.
Click to expand...
I’ve only been working on Zercher Squats for about 4 months, but I really like doing them from the floor. I like the extra time and concentration required. I don’t have a rack, but not sure I’d use it anyway for Zercher.
 
I did my first Zercher squats today. What a great movement. I decided to finally order a barbell and some weights, but don't want to invest in a rack just yet. Planning to do Faleev 80/20 but substituting Zerchers for back squats and floor press for bench press.

Edit: A few hours later, man I'm feeling it. This is great haha.
 
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q.Hung said:
Increase your deadlift number is very different to getting the benefit of the deadlift.
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Not Necessarily

If the movement pattern engages the same muscles involved in the Deadlift, most of the beneifts will be essentially the same.

Based on Chase Hines results, his Zercher Method works for increasing Maximum Strength and will work for increasing musle mass.

q.Hung said:
Let take an example besides the deadlift: some people increase the number of chin/pull up with snatch or swing. But the muscle mass gains in the lats from swing or snatch is inferior compared to from chin up or pull up.
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Different Type of Strength Training

The example provided amounts to comparing Apples are Oranges; they are not the same.

1) Power Training

Swings and Snatches are Power Training Movements.

2) Maximum Strength/Hypertrophy Training

Chins/Pull Ups increase Maximum Strength or Hypertrophy, dependent on how the Training Program is written and performed.

Swings/Snatches and Chin/Pull Ups are different tool for different jobs.

The key is to use the right tool for the right job, for optimal results.

Conjugate Training

Anecdotal data (Westside Powerlifting Method) and Dr Michael Zourdos's Conjugate Training Research has demonstrated that one type of Strength Training enhance the others.

q.Hung said:
let say someone lacks leg strength, and this person hits the leg press hard. A few months later his deadlift when up. Will you conclude that the leg press can replace the deadlift?
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The Leg Press

The Leg Press is more benefical for the Deadlift than the Squat.

1) Conventional Deadlift

Research show that in this movement, the muscle firing sequence is Back > Legs > Back.

The back breaks the weight off the floor with most Conventional Deadlifters, with strong backs.

Then Leg Drive kick in. It is a "Bang-Bang" sequence that occurs so quick that most individual don't see it.

Thus, if a Lack of Leg Strength is the issue, the Leg Press, as well as other Quad Exercise are effective; such as Front Squats and High Bar Quarter Squat in a Power Rack.

2) Sumo Deadlift

Research show the muscle firing sequence is Legs > Back.

The legs initiate breaking the weight off the floor, with some assistance from the back.

Leg Pressing, if possible with a wide stance platform or Wide Quarter Squat in a Power Rack, are vital Auxiliary Exercises for Sumo Deadlifters.

Summary

Deadlift Auxiliary Exercise that involve the same muscles as the Deadlift and have a similar Strength Curve will increase Maimum Strength as well as provide a simiar benefit/training effect.

That means similar muscle gains will occur, providing a well written Hypertrophy Training Program is written and performed.
 
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