Other/Mixed Combat Sport Strong

[Pavel Macek]

I train quite a lot of MMA fighters and other combat athletes. This is what we do:

-Foundation first - S&S > S&C Training for MMA With Simple & Sinister | StrongFirst (the article also features a way how to add push press - IMHO a great drill for combat athletes)
-After that, we usually switch to Easy Strength: deadlift, bench press, full contact twist, or kettlebell snatch.
-Another great option: KETTLEBELLS STRONGFIRST: Get Into Your Best Fighting Shape by Pavel Tsatsouline

I sincerely recommend attending StrongEndurance - a game-changer for all combat athletes.

 

[Justin_M]

The only that stopped me from trying Novocaine is I couldn't find any information on how to do threshold tempo work without running and didn't find much info on the HIRT repeats.

Live sparring at a high intensity for 5 min rounds with 1 min rest is good non-running threshold work.

Some HIRT work I like is run 200 walk 200. Another is start a 400 every 6 min.

 

[3letterslong]

Live sparring at a high intensity for 5 min rounds with 1 min rest is good non-running threshold work.

Some HIRT work I like is run 200 walk 200. Another is start a 400 every 6 min.

I don't get a chance to run much. Are there ways to do these with calisthenics, kettlebells, dumbbells and a skipping rope?

 

[Justin_M]

I don't get a chance to run much. Are there ways to do these with calisthenics, kettlebells, dumbbells and a skipping rope?

You could do anything that gets you a 5:1 ish ratio or 20 min constant in that HR zone. A HR monitor would help identify if an exercise/circuit works for it.

I only use running because of the need to run. I don't really think more conditioning is necessary beyond base sessions if you're not trying to specifically improve an endurance motion.

 

[Luis T. Gonzalez]

Has anyone found a good knee brace for martial arts? Not sleeves, but something with a little more support. My knee is acting up bad at the moment and my current braces all fail. I have several, but they generally have two problems:

1. They can’t have any hard plastic or metal in order to be used in competition. Finding a heavy duty brace that doesn’t have any has been hard to find.

2. There’s a lot of material at the back of the knee, so when I bend my knee it all bunches up and is really uncomfortable.

What have any of you found that you like?

I got knee barred in a tournament back in 2017 and had to wear a knee brace for a while. I think I found the one I have at Walgreens. It had some gel stuff around the knee with velcro straps that stayed on very well. Another thing to consider is drilling from position that dont put your knee at risk for a little while.

 

[BJJ Shawn]

I got knee barred in a tournament back in 2017 and had to wear a knee brace for a while. I think I found the one I have at Walgreens. It had some gel stuff around the knee with velcro straps that stayed on very well. Another thing to consider is drilling from position that dont put your knee at risk for a little while.

I have a couple that work OK, but the problem I have with the Velcro ones is that at tournaments I have had to remove them because of the plastic clip the Velcro goes through. It seems like the tiniest piece and has never caused a problem in practice, but for whatever reason I had to take it off at the tournament.

On another note, the one I bought that was recommended is FANTASTIC and worth the money.

 

[3letterslong]

You could do anything that gets you a 5:1 ish ratio or 20 min constant in that HR zone. A HR monitor would help identify if an exercise/circuit works for it.

I only use running because of the need to run. I don't really think more conditioning is necessary beyond base sessions if you're not trying to specifically improve an endurance motion.

Okay, yes! This is perfect! I couldn't find anyone explaining these things for exercises other than running. Thank you.

 

[RemyR]

Nice to see this thread, as a grappler this is the primary reason why I signed up for this forum, I tried Simple but Sinister and found it to have a high carry over to BJJ/wrestling.

 

[LoneRider]

Nice to see this thread, as a grappler this is the primary reason why I signed up for this forum, I tried Simple but Sinister and found it to have a high carry over to BJJ/wrestling.

I especially like the Kettlebell StrongFirst program as a sort of V 3.0 Simple and Sinister. I'm eager to get after it again after I knock through a Quick and Dead cycle to finish out this year after over 9 months of mostly barbell training (with some A&A and LISS work thrown in) during some Army stuff.

 

[LoneRider]

I'm actually developing my own take on the 'Novocaine' for the combat athlete (well for the forty-year-old male version, sample size of one) over the next year.

The influences of same listed below:

1. Novocaine Program (link)
2. Mountain Tactical Institute BJJ/Tactical Athlete Advice (link)

 

[Justin_M]

I'm actually developing my own take on the 'Novocaine' for the combat athlete (well for the forty-year-old male version, sample size of one) over the next year.

At forty, the OG program works but this is what I've been working on lately for BJJ. All extra conditioning is on the mat.

1. Double C&J, 1x [20"]
2. C&J, 3x [30"]
3. Snatch + SkiErg, 5x [60-75"]
4. VPP, 10x [90"]
5. Jump Squat + Pushup, Q&D 5/4
6. 2H Swing + SkiErg, Q&D 10/2

I do 2-4 sessions per week, never consecutive days. Session 1 is S- bells, sessions 2-4 are S bell, and session 6 is S+ bell.

 

[LoneRider]

At forty, the OG program works but this is what I've been working on lately for BJJ. All extra conditioning is on the mat.

1. Double C&J, 1x [20"]
2. C&J, 3x [30"]
3. Snatch + SkiErg, 5x [60-75"]
4. VPP, 10x [90"]
5. Jump Squat + Pushup, Q&D 033 5/4
6. 2H Swing + SkiErg, Q&D 033 10/2

I do 2-4 sessions per week, never consecutive days. Session 1 is S- bells, sessions 2-4 are S bell, and session 6 is S+ bell.

Very cool! Mostly I’m using Iron Cardio (with pull-ups) and KBSF (what I feel is S&S 3.0) together with LISS work.

 

[LoneRider]

The tale of a former East German Judoka and his discussion of a mountain bike trip thru the Alps provoked some thinking from me given how Rob Shaul’s Mountain Athlete program was one of my earliest influences.

The book was written by British journalist Mark Law (who took up judo at age fifty) and is titled Falling Hard .

 

[LoneRider]

Started my Q&D cycle this week, will be running it with IC and the occassional TLU progression from Mountain Tactical Institute till the end of this year before I start KB AXE/IC as my main S&C program.

 

[YourArsenal23]

Lot's of great info in this thread. I started training in Muay Thai a few months ago. I spent a good half of this year snatching via Geoff Neupert's King-Sized Killer and noticed that snatching has a huge benefit for cardio. I'm looking into adding some light running maybe 1 or 2 times a week to add in some extra cardio work. Currently, I'm running Swing Season by Geoff Nuepert, and seems to be a good balance of S&C work along with training 2 times a week.

Can anyone recommend a good mobility program that might be good for combat sports?

 

[LoneRider]

I'm looking at things to integrate into this myself. I get some decent mobility whenever I do Turkish getups and I've looked into Three Pillars of Healthy Aging (link) as ways to get most bang for buck for S&C (mobility/strength/conditioning).

 

[bencrush]

Inspired by @offwidth and his thread Mountain Strong, and via discussion with @BJJ Shawn I elected to start a strength and conditioning thread for those of us involved in combat sports of all kinds. Part of me wondered why something like this didn't exist before given Hardstyle KB methods were meant for the training hard living sorts from the outset.

Below is a Juggernaut Training Systems video for BJJ athletes. It's more barbell oriented (I'm a fan of the KBSF program myself) but it is a neat look at the strength component of BJJ:


Welcome aboard all MMA types, Jiujiteiro, Nak Muay, Sambists, Karatekas and martial artists of all stripes...

@LoneRider Great topic! I worked in a jail for 18 years. And over that time "wrestled" many people. A few were actively trying to kill me and had a weapon. Most were not super skilled and didn't have a weapon. Quite a few were actively trying to hurt me and other officers. I was a defensive tactics trainer from 2000 to 2006. Had a judo/jujitsu/karate background with some law enforcement combatives training over the years as well.

I can tell you that without a doubt, my above average grip strength was one of the biggest assets I had. Like I mentioned, I had adequate technique training, but you add a lot of grip strength to that and it definitely created word of mouth "advertising" that eventually, situations that might be about to turn physical could be avoided by basically inmates telling other inmates that it wasn't physically worth the trouble.

Being able to grab someone's clothing (and/or limbs) and control them and move them wherever I needed them to go was priceless. It also had the interesting side effect of reducing injuries to both inmates and officers. If an inmate was throwing bombs (big punches), it required a higher level of force - possibly Taser or OC spray. But if they were controlled by grips, they were not able to escalate the force level effectively much higher than arm punches (not using the entire body in a coordinated symphony to produce a lot more force in their punches).

I will say again that gripper strength - especially the strength where the handles of the gripper are fully closed - has excellent carryover to holding on to clothing.

Thickbar strength training has excellent carryover to holding on to wrists and hands.

 

[3letterslong]

@LoneRider Great topic! I worked in a jail for 18 years. And over that time "wrestled" many people. A few were actively trying to kill me and had a weapon. Most were not super skilled and didn't have a weapon. Quite a few were actively trying to hurt me and other officers. I was a defensive tactics trainer from 2000 to 2006. Had a judo/jujitsu/karate background with some law enforcement combatives training over the years as well.

I can tell you that without a doubt, my above average grip strength was one of the biggest assets I had. Like I mentioned, I had adequate technique training, but you add a lot of grip strength to that and it definitely created word of mouth "advertising" that eventually, situations that might be about to turn physical could be avoided by basically inmates telling other inmates that it wasn't physically worth the trouble.

Being able to grab someone's clothing (and/or limbs) and control them and move them wherever I needed them to go was priceless. It also had the interesting side effect of reducing injuries to both inmates and officers. If an inmate was throwing bombs (big punches), it required a higher level of force - possibly Taser or OC spray. But if they were controlled by grips, they were not able to escalate the force level effectively much higher than arm punches (not using the entire body in a coordinated symphony to produce a lot more force in their punches).

I will say again that gripper strength - especially the strength where the handles of the gripper are fully closed - has excellent carryover to holding on to clothing.

Thickbar strength training has excellent carryover to holding on to wrists and hands.

Having the skill to remove grips is also invaluable. When I was bouncing, people were completely flummoxed when I used basic Judo or BJJ to strip their grips off my clothing and take grips of my own, with them wildly out of position and unable to face me head on. The look on an aggressive person's face when they don't have a say over their own posture or orientation is hilarious.

 

[LoneRider]

Having the skill to remove grips is also invaluable. When I was bouncing, people were completely flummoxed when I used basic Judo or BJJ to strip their grips off my clothing and take grips of my own, with them wildly out of position and unable to face me head on. The look on an aggressive person's face when they don't have a say over their own posture or orientation is hilarious.

I find that in Judo (at least the month or so I've been crosstraining in it) that judokas take a different stance on grips. I find in BJJ my teammates tend to try to break grips versus judokas achieve some kind of grip, even inferior ones and then advance from there versus attempt to break grips.

In any case, hand/finger strength as developed by hardstyle kettlebell training, pullups, heavy deadlifts et cetera helps a lot. And I'll probably mix bouldering sessions in to work my grips as the Atlantic gets too cold to surf in sans wetsuit.

 

[LoneRider]

This is a recent find from the fine folks at Rob Shaul's Mountain Tactical Institute (link). This is some good thinking for three sessions/week for base programming.