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Kettlebell Condensing the ETK program minimum

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Tall guy Andrew

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I have started the Program Minimum from Enter the Kettlebell a few weeks ago. Since then, job priorities have gotten in the way of some my practice days. Is it advisable to condense the program minimum workouts into one day if I miss a practice?
For example, if My usual schedule is:
Mon, swings; Tues, get ups; Thurs, swings; Fri, getups.

Can that be adjusted to:
Mon, swings; Tues, [miss]; Thurs, swings and getups?

Thanks
 
Shouldn't be too problematic. Just like S&S it is a fairly flexible sort of program. I ran the latter for nearly two years before achieving Simple and at times I had to cut back sessions due to time constraints.
 
As long as you feel recovered during the day and are able to sleep normally, I'm sure it's fine. When time is really at a premium, I feel like it becomes a balance between training and sleep. I can sleep less in order to train more, but if I don't sleep enough I can't recover well enough from the training for it to do me any good.

Keep in mind, the program minimum is has the word "minimum" in the name for a reason. Most people should have no problem doubling up on sessions or adding all sorts of stuff to it, assuming they can eat and sleep properly. Of course, that's not always an assumption that one can make.
 
One option is to place two ETK sessions in a single day but separate them by several hours.
 
@JSStevens, I recall reading somewhere that the guidance on multiple lifting sessions in a single day was to separate them by six hours or more if possible.

-S-
 
Yes, go for it. If your body tells you it is too much then back off. The program minimum is a minimum effective dose program. Most people can and should be doing more.
 
Well, S&S is swings and getups everyday. So, I'd be inclined to say, not only can you put them together, you should!

Maybe you have to reduce the weight or volume vs. What you do now, but I'd say that a diet of mildly low-intensity swings and getups every day is excellent for hardening the body to work.

Only thing then you might be missing from the program minimum is the light jogging - and I'd suggest that doing a session or do of unbroken LSD (on your swing/getup off day) would serve most people better than breaking it up with the swings.
 
Not many people seem to follow ETK Program minimum... ? Obviously because S&S is an updated version that has kind of replaced it. Why would someone still follow ETK PM? Im not saying no one shouldn’t, but I wonder what are the possible benefits compared to S&S? Is it better for conditioning for example because of the way swings are trained? Does ETK PM style get ups lead to more hypertrophy than S&S style with more rest?
 
Why would someone still follow ETK PM?

Id' say "Why not?" or simply "because I can"
I'd use it for variety when in between programs or as a simpler more flexible version of S&S for beginners.

I'm not saying no one shouldn’t, but I wonder what are the possible benefits compared to
S&S?

The PM has less structure, and more focus on practice. It's also great and active recovery and it's great for beginners.


Is it better for conditioning for example because of the way swings are trained?

The Program Minimum is not programmed and more loosely structured with no weight/rep standard to achieve (12 minutes to a comfortable stop) So... as written S&S will provide better conditioning IMO.


Does ETK PM style get-ups lead to more hypertrophy than S&S style with more rest?

The PM's 5 minutes of getups have no clear weight/rep standard. By Comparison, S&S's 10 minutes of getups with a clear rep and weight standard will produce better hypertrophy. Train for 10 minutes of getups with the BEAST and I dare you to not see muscle growth.
 
My read is the PM gets a beginner used to the swing and the getup (body as one piece) for a week or two, maybe a month, before a true training program (such as RoP). The swing preps for clean, and getup primes tension needed for the press.

The PM can also be a “I’d like a routine to keep me moving” between training programs or just when life gets busy, and/or a form of active recovery on off days.

I myself like 12 minutes of 24kg one-arm, hand-to-hand, then two-hand swing sets (each until “comfortable stop”), rest, repeat, then 5 minutes of continuous getups alternating left and right (sometimes reverse getups: starting from the top, switching at the next top with a snatch). With prying goblet squat and pump stretch before, and hanging and brisk walk after, it’s a nice change of pace from heavy or hard.
 
ETK PM seems to be structured as an intro to kettlebells and preparation for running the ROP. It also leaves many variables up to the practitioner

S&S seems to structured to be run as it's own stand alone program with less options to ensure consistency.

Both are valid, but I would guess most people (undisciplined like me) would make faster progress on S&S because of the structure built into it. In the end, you have to choose which program will keep you in the game with your habits and lifestyle. If the flexibility of ETK PM keeps it more manageable for your schedule and lifestyle, then you'll be more successful with that.
 
ETK PM seems to be structured as an intro to kettlebells and preparation for running the ROP. It also leaves many variables up to the practitioner

S&S seems to structured to be run as it's own stand alone program with less options to ensure consistency.

Both are valid, but I would guess most people (undisciplined like me) would make faster progress on S&S because of the structure built into it. In the end, you have to choose which program will keep you in the game with your habits and lifestyle. If the flexibility of ETK PM keeps it more manageable for your schedule and lifestyle, then you'll be more successful with that.
Good points.

I'm not a coach or anything, but if I had a friend interested in kettlebells and new (or returning) to "fitness", my recommendation of PM or S&S would depend on their personality.

S&S turned out to be the right choice for me (though I didn't know about PM/ETK when I started S&S) because I needed a progression framework that the PM lacks. I wouldn't have been able to "feel" progress in PM. But I can imagine other people would be turned off by S&S but might thrive if given basic parameters: do get-ups for 5 minutes and swings for 12 minutes, don't push either too hard, rest until ready to go again, practice/play, explore the movement. But, I do think PM under a coach's eye (or in a group setting) might still be better than S&S for a rank beginner, for the first say two weeks. Then if they want to progress their swings and getups in weight, S&S is a great progression framework. If they want more variety, PM plus clean-press-snatch practice sessions make a great combo; maybe they'll be more interested in strength training, in which case RoP is right there for the taking after just a few weeks of PM.
 
Also, I looked back in ETK and noticed that the "break-in plan" (page 41) for swings and getups (and warm-ups / drills) calls for 30 minutes of practice, 3-7 days a week.

The "Program Minimum" (page 72-73) is actually from Steve Baccari and designed/applied for grapplers:
  • Twice a week, 12 minutes of swings "to a comfortable stop" alternated with jogging or jump rope
  • Twice a week, 5 minutes of "continuous get-ups" (alternating sides each rep)
Presumably this could be done the same two days of the week, but it most likely meant four sessions in an A/B format. The "Baccari PM" seems to be one applied routine of the PM exercises (swing and getup) to meet the strength and conditioning needs of grapplers.

Why 12 minutes of swings? "Most of the guys had about a 10 min threshold . . . so I just bumped it up a step. Most of them are now doing about 15 min.” So the things that stick out to me are: establish baseline, push beyond, continue "bring up the baseline". So the 12 minutes isn't set in stone.

Why 5 minutes of getups? “I picked 5 min because that is the length of a round in both sparring and competition.” Again, the specific arrangement is based on the outcome desired.

@Tall guy Andrew I would think a recreational athlete or just someone wanting to get some quality movement in, could do the 30 minute practice as many days a week as desired, with exercise order up to them. On page 41 an easy circuit of drills, swings, and getups is alluded to. Incidentally, S&S is one such way to arrange swings and getups into a 30-minute practice (10 swings on the minute for 10 minutes, 1 getup/side on the minute for 20 minutes)!

This article from @Arryn Grogan is another way to introduce variability to swing and getup practice.
 
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I've recently been thinking about going back to the original PM. My new job is brutal (hand digging holes all day), getting up at 330 and not getting home till 7 or 8. So I need a routine that is short, effective, and doesn't add any more undue stress.
 
I've recently been thinking about going back to the original PM. My new job is brutal (hand digging holes all day), getting up at 330 and not getting home till 7 or 8. So I need a routine that is short, effective, and doesn't add any more undue stress.

Me too, partly because I have couple of hobbies that take quite a bit of time at the moment. But if Im completely honest, I dont think that is a good reason to change from s&s as it can be done even just a couple of times a week and with a lighter weight etc. So in my mind it actually is more flexible than ETK PM because the latter requires 4 sessions a week... Biggest reason Im considering the change, is that I really miss two hand swings with higher rep range. I havent reached simple yet and Im stuck between my 26kg and 32kg bells. And after 14 months (I know its not a crazy long time) of s&s Im bored with it to be honest. So I could do ETK PM for awhile and then start ROP after the golf season is over. I know its recommended to reach simple before starting ROP but would this be such a crime? Afterall, I need to enjoy the training...

(Sorry, this turned out to go a bit off topic, which wasnt planned)
 
@Nacho It may be against the “party line”, but I would say you should do RoP if you are competent in the clean and press and have a bell that where a 1,2,3 ladder (you’ll do 3 such ladders the first heavy day) feels only moderately heavy, as soon as to want to.

You can always do S&S on variety days, and/or use the 10x10 structure for the swing portion of RoP instead of the dice method. Or to fuse both: assign sets to one dice and wave the swing volume (sets of 10) that way.
 
@Nacho It may be against the “party line”, but I would say you should do RoP if you are competent in the clean and press and have a bell that where a 1,2,3 ladder (you’ll do 3 such ladders the first heavy day) feels only moderately heavy, as soon as to want to.

You can always do S&S on variety days, and/or use the 10x10 structure for the swing portion of RoP instead of the dice method. Or to fuse both: assign sets to one dice and wave the swing volume (sets of 10) that way.

My kb set is a bit unconventional, 18,22,26,32. I can clean and press 26 once (at least). Never pressed a lot before... Only tried a couple of times.
 
My kb set is a bit unconventional, 18,22,26,32. I can clean and press 26 once (at least). Never pressed a lot before... Only tried a couple of times.
Try Strength Aerobics with the 18 or 22 (clean-press-squat L on :00, repeat R on :30, or once per side on the minute, for ~20 minutes) a day or two a week. You will accumulate volume and drill the form that way, without wearing you out. Should get you ready for RoP with the 18 or 22.
 
Try Strength Aerobics with the 18 or 22 (clean-press-squat L on :00, repeat R on :30, or once per side on the minute, for ~20 minutes) a day or two a week. You will accumulate volume and drill the form that way, without wearing you out. Should get you ready for RoP with the 18 or 22.

Thanks for suggestion. I’ll try ETK PM for now though, but I agree it makes sense to have some pressing practice before starting rop.

I did already one session for each exercise from PM. As I hadnt done any two hand swings for awhile, it was surprising to notice how much power I was able to put in those. The next day my hamstrings were a bit sore. Rest periods were shorter also than with regular s&s session. Today I played 1,5 rounds of golf and did my get ups in s&s manner. I would have skipped s&s session, but doing only the get ups was ok. Warmed up with OS resets. This might be a nice change while still working on swings & get ups and it suits my schedule and energy resources during the golf season. Not that s&s doesnt, but I feel much better doing one of the exercises fairly heavy rather than full (light) s&s session on the same day Im playing. OS resets I do every day no matter what. I might go back to s&s 5-6 times a week when the season is over, or try rop. We’ll see... I like to change things just a little to keep it interesting, but I dont feel any need to necessarily change the exercises from swings and get ups.
 
I just found this

FAQ: Comparing Kettlebell: Simple & Sinister and the ETK Program Minimum and ROP

I think its a very nice and informative summary by Steve. So basically, s&s is better for power and etk pm is better for strenght endurance when it comes to swings. After over a year of doing s&s, Im stronger than ever and I can swing with much more power. However, after doing couple of etk pm swing sessions, I must say its a different animal. A year and a half ago I didnt follow any program but it was my go to workout to do ie. 300 swings with 22kg or 200 with a 32 with sets from anywhere between 10-100. I couldnt imagine doing crisp 1 arm swings or get ups with a 32 though.

So this got me thinking.
How about cycling/combining s&s with etk pm?
Btw, I recall s&s does suggest doing as many swings as possible in a row once every two weeks I think... ? Might be a bit overlooked part of the program? I must admit I never did it during last 14 months.
 
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