Conditioning overrated for fat loss

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CharlieJay

Level 2 Valued Member
I'm probably gonna get some heat for this but I believe that metabolic conditioning is highly overrated for fat loss. I'm not saying it doesn't work but it doesn't seem to work any better than heavy lifting (Deadlifts, squats, MPs) with long breaks in between sets paired with good nutrition. In fact, the most vascular I've ever been was after a few cycles of PTTP.
Is it my my own individual biology, or do any of you feel the same?
 

rhgo5

Level 2 Valued Member
Best fat loss program is eating right.



Resistance training for strength and hypertrophy;proper diet for fat loss.

One cant outrun/outlift cake and ice cream
 

CharlieJay

Level 2 Valued Member
Right, so I'm not crazy. When I was a kid, anything would cause me to lose weight - even light jogging! But now, it seems that lifting heavy s*** and eating right is my best option when it comes to staying lean.
 

elli

Level 9 Valued Member
True.
But moving more in your daily life is important, too. If you are so tired from lifting that you have to sit on the couch for the rest of the day, I would still not call you an active or sporty person. Clean your house, work in the garden, do the shopping by bike...MOVE YOUR A.
 

Al Ciampa

Level 7 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
Charles,

What "S F" said... Nutrition for body comp; exercise for performance/movement.
Both = superior health.
 

Steve Freides

Staff
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
Charles, Pavel talks about this in Kettlebell Simple & Sinister.

-S-
 

Bill Been

Level 6 Valued Member
I recently de-phatted myself after a season of exactly the same barbell pure strength training you describe, except I was on the See Food Diet™. I was determined to "do the program" as-written, meaning adequate rest, adequate sleep, and more than adequate food to drive recovery. Bunches of weight added to the bar, and bunches of pounds (20) on my body later, the novice period drew to a close and it was time to pare back down. BMI sucks royally as an individual health metric, but Flight Docs are stuck with it and I don't want to listen to any more lectures about it, especially ones that immediately follow a congratulations on how awesome my resting heart rate, EKG, and blood pressure are. The cognitive dissonance is too much to bear. As I've gotten older (52) merely stripping carbohydrates out of my diet has not worked as well as it used to for whatever reason. So I reduced them to very low levels except on the 2-3 days/weeks I did HIIT with the Prowler. Yes, I used MetCons. But as Charles C contends, I'm under no illusions about where the "power" is in body comp: it's diet. If you view the MetCons as "auxiliary" or "complimentary" to the dietary cleanup, they can be beneficial. I stripped-off the 20 pounds in about 5 weeks. But again: the FACT of weight loss was DIET. The SPEED of weight loss MAY be enhanced with MetCons.
 

Steve Freides

Staff
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
I must add that having a "soft" practice in your life helps with body composition. For me, it changed my appetite so that I eat better without having to suffer - I'm still eating what I want, but what I want has changed.

-S-
 

Pavel

Founder and Chairman
Master Certified Instructor
Charles, it is a very long conversation with a lot of gray.

You are right that developing your fast fibers with serious strength training has a profound metabolic effect. (See a blog I wrote with Geoff Neupert, "Dry Fighting Weight").
 

CharlieJay

Level 2 Valued Member
Okay, so I took the time to read S&S and "Dry Fighting Weight" since getting those suggestions. I enjoyed them both. I was just more or less wondering if anyone here is in the same boat with the whole met-con thing. I'm not super fat or anything. It's just a little strange how stubborn my weight is. Even eating very small amounts of food, fasting, counting macros, Yadda yadda. I find that eating 2-3 small meals, lifting heavy, and NEVER snacking keeps me relatively lean. I used to think that Met-Con would be the answer to becoming very lean. Even with all the super strict/clean eating, I didn't notice a difference. Plus, heavy lifting is way more fun ( :
 

Inuk

Level 3 Valued Member
Metcons are great, for variation. Just dont think they are the end answer when it comes to fatloss.
 

CharlieJay

Level 2 Valued Member
Yeah, I feel pretty good after MetCon. That's probably my favorite thing about them. It's like a burst of energy for the rest of the day. As far as fat loss goes, I still say overrated.
 

Steve Freides

Staff
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
This thread makes interesting reading in light of some of the other threads about heart rate and training zones. My guess, and it's just that and nothing more, is that _proper_ training that is not _over- or _under-training works across a wide spectrum of energy systems. "Works" here means that it helps body composition and overall health.

Overtraining and undertraining are, IMHO, the most likely culprits when it comes to not achieving body composition changes. If that's true, then it's probably the best argument for following a proven program as written, and/or being under the guidance of a competent exercise professional.

-S-
 

Jim Lauerman

Level 6 Valued Member
Steve,

I agree. I have struggled with my body composition all of my life. I also have run and biked too fast and tried to advance on S&S too quickly. Unfortunately, it seems my motto is, "If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing."

The pattern is: 1) Go too far too fast. 2) Burnout with exhaustion.. 3) Eat everything that isn't nailed down because I am exhausted and depressed. 4) Crash and burn. 5) Recover for a week. 6)Repeat.

The recent threads on patience in training are really helping me. I still need to deal with some emotional nightime eating issues but at least I don't feel as though I'm working against myself when training.

Jim
 

Tarzan

Level 4 Valued Member
That reminds me of something an old guy I worked with as a teenager used to say all the time, mostly about me and my impetuous nature.

It was a story about two rams, an old one and his son.
One day the young ram spotted a flock of sheep grazing in a field.
The young ram said in an excited voice
"Hey Dad let's run down there and screw some of those sheep"
The older ram replied calmly
"No son, we will walk down there and screw them all"

His language was a lot more colourful than that, but you get the picture.

It was reinforced when I started track cycling. There was an old guy (almost 70) who was a regular at the velodrome who would train for hours at a time at a steady pace and just do one big effort at the end of his training on the days when he felt good. Younger riders who didn't know him would burst onto the track in a mad rush and scream past him and sometimes even lap him, but he would plug away and catch up to them and slowly lift the pace.

Then he would start talking to them and watch them struggle for breath as they tried to answer his questions and every time they would have to pull over and stop because they were exhausted. Most of them went home in shame and never returned.
 
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