Erik Hournou
Level 7 Valued Member
If you want to increase limit strength why not keep SS 3-4 times x week and add 1 or 2 deadlift sessions per week?
Barbell Do you GTG with Deadlifts?
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Bauer
Level 8 Valued Member
Phil Maffetone says yes, you can GTG Deadlifts, with 80%1RM. He advsises against lifting directly in the morning.
philmaffetone.com
philmaffetone.com
It's time to Get Strong!
Editor’s review: A strength-training program that works for everybody — and every body. For the past two years I’ve been working closely with Dr. Phil Maffetone to pull together his...
philmaffetone.com
It's time to Get Strong!
Editor’s review: A strength-training program that works for everybody — and every body. For the past two years I’ve been working closely with Dr. Phil Maffetone to pull together his...
philmaffetone.com
He has a new book on it which I haven't read.
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Antti
Level 10 Valued Member
Phil Maffetone says yes, you can GTG Deadlifts, with 80%1RM. He advsises against lifting directly in the morning.
It's time to Get Strong!
Editor’s review: A strength-training program that works for everybody — and every body. For the past two years I’ve been working closely with Dr. Phil Maffetone to pull together his...It's time to Get Strong!
Editor’s review: A strength-training program that works for everybody — and every body. For the past two years I’ve been working closely with Dr. Phil Maffetone to pull together his...
He has a new book on it which I haven't read.
80% is a lot to train with without warm up. I suspect it gets worse the stronger one is, but I'm not sure it's good for anyone.
Kenny Croxdale
Level 7 Valued Member
Technique Training and Development
Grease The Grove is essentially Technique Training and Development
It increase the load you can push or pull by improving technique by neural development.
Greasing The The Groove
This video quotes Pavel as stating the Strength is a skill. We have to grease the neurological groove.
Get Stronger By Greasing the Groove
To become an all-around stronger man, you have to practice strength.
www.artofmanliness.com
When you lift a heavy weight (be it yourself or a barbell), your muscles contract. That contraction begins when your nervous system sends a signal to your muscle fibers. When a movement is performed over and over again, and the muscle fibers repeatedly receive an identical signal, a more efficient neuromuscular motor pattern develops.
Focus on perfection.
Greasing the groove is how we practice the skill of strength, and as we know, practice doesn’t make perfect — perfect practice does.
How To Develop Technique
Basically to perform at a competition level, you have to train at that level or close to it.
When it come to Strength Sports such as Olympic Lifting or Powerlifting, Technique and the Nervous System are optimally developed with loads that are near your 1 Repetition Max.
Optimal Technique Training Loads
Loads of approximately 85% plus of a 1 Repetition Max are the most effective for developing Technique and the Neural System.
Load of around 70% are effective but to a lesser degree.
Baseball Analogy
As I have noted before, practicing hitting a 60 mph baseball make you good at hitting a 60 mph baseball.
It does little for helping you hit a 90 mph fast ball.
Auxiliary Exercises
The key to maintaining and/or increasing strength in something like a Deadlift is performing Auxiliary Exercise that are similar in nature to the movement such as: Good Mornings, Hip/Back Extensions, Stiff Leg Deadlift (slight break in the knees), etc.
Summery
1) Grease The Grove
This falls into the category of Technique Training and improving the Neural System.
2) Technique Development
It is optimally trained with load of 85% plus of a 1 Repetition Max for single repetitions; "Focus on perfection".
3) Auxiliary Exercise
The key to increasing strength in a movement is with Auxiliary Exercise that are similar in nature to the lift.
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rwrjr
Level 4 Valued Member
While not a strictly GtG approach, years ago David Whitley published a DL singles program on the DD site. My son used it and got very good results in the TBDL. It is called "Deadlift Singles Success Story". Since it's singles only and you DL five days per week I think it would work well in lieu of GtG. The program calls for 30-45 second between reps but we found EMOM is just easier.
Philippe Geoffrion
Level 7 Valued Member
Well, if were to combine @kennycro@@aol.com s post info with GTG and the specificity principle of neural adaptation, I think we run into a large problem.
GTG implies frequent practice as in close to 10 sessions a day at about 50 % I believe and according to this data in order for it to transfer to a heavy DL, it must be 85% of a 1rm... this just doesn’t seem feasible.
You said you’d load up a “measly” 300 something pounds and just DL throughout the day? Unless you’re deadlifting 6 plates plus, I don’t really see this being maintainable unless it’s like once a day...which is pretty much PTTP. GTG implies training throughout the day, not once a day.
Alas, I believe you can GTG with deadlifts but I think around 60-70% is better. You could probably get away with less honestly. In PTTP PRO, Pavel touches on this quite a bit. The practice is better for grinders as explosive lifters will certainly burn out their adrenals quickly. If you were to do this, the amplitude, speed, movement pattern must all resemble a ME lift, ie tight and slow. This is the only I believe GTG should be done with deadlifts.
GTG implies frequent practice as in close to 10 sessions a day at about 50 % I believe and according to this data in order for it to transfer to a heavy DL, it must be 85% of a 1rm... this just doesn’t seem feasible.
You said you’d load up a “measly” 300 something pounds and just DL throughout the day? Unless you’re deadlifting 6 plates plus, I don’t really see this being maintainable unless it’s like once a day...which is pretty much PTTP. GTG implies training throughout the day, not once a day.
Alas, I believe you can GTG with deadlifts but I think around 60-70% is better. You could probably get away with less honestly. In PTTP PRO, Pavel touches on this quite a bit. The practice is better for grinders as explosive lifters will certainly burn out their adrenals quickly. If you were to do this, the amplitude, speed, movement pattern must all resemble a ME lift, ie tight and slow. This is the only I believe GTG should be done with deadlifts.
Bauer
Level 8 Valued Member
Btw, I think it is the same as Vodka and Pickles, but with more sessions per week. And also featured in Easy Strength (old Westside template).
Bauer
Level 8 Valued Member
I don't know, I guess it depends on your genetics and your general training. Just have a look at the minimal volume in the Quick and the Deadlift: Q&D + Minimalist Deadlifts | StrongFirst
1-2 DL sessions per week, with 3-5 singles...
Philippe Geoffrion
Level 7 Valued Member
I’m confused as to the relation to what I said and The Quick and The Deadlift article.
Bauer
Level 8 Valued Member
Ah, I am sorry, I misread your post. It's been a long day. Anyway, GTG is 50% of max reps per set, not of 1RM.
I just wanted to highlight that minimal volume can apparently work in the right circumstances.
Antti
Level 10 Valued Member
The deadlift works very well with minimal volume.
But I would say that GTG is about maximal volume.
rwrjr
Level 4 Valued Member
Makes sense because Whitley said Pavel gave him the program. My son was a novice so we modified the program by removing the deload weeks and adding only 4 lbs on the bar each week. At the end of 8 weeks that added up to 408 singles and a 30% 1RM bump. As a novice just about any decent 8-week program may have given him such results.
It's not GtG but you are doing 51 reps each week. If your goal is to dial in the deadlift pattern it's a tiny time investment each day.
Philippe Geoffrion
Level 7 Valued Member
Ahh yes. I see. It’s been a long year!!! And I do agree with your conclusion
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