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Strong Endurance Do you prefer to use a timer ?

Do you prefer to use a timer ?

  • Yes

    Votes: 17 60.7%

  • No

    Votes: 5 17.9%

  • Sometimes, please explain below :)

    Votes: 6 21.4%
  • Total voters
    28
Adachi

Adachi

Level 7 Valued Member

Kettlebell - Geoff Neupert asks for beta testers for THE GiANT X and KETTLEBELL MAXIMORUM

Bottom line, I think it’s a rest issue. I know you’re assuming you’re getting sufficient rest, but maybe you’re not resting long enough. /\ THIS. Unfortunately, many, if not most guys STILL "race" their sets - try to get as many sets as possible, come hell or high water. I routinely get...
www.strongfirst.com

in the above post, @Geoff Neupert commends those participating in his programs for resting more and opines about resting more than you otherwise might in order to follow AutoRegulation.

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I understand that autoregulation is great. it's a principle that you can take from one domain to another. but one of the reasons I'm so stuck on using a timer for my efforts is because, for my strength-centric goals, it seems to be so much easier to overdo my efforts than to underdo them. So, when I use repeat times or intervals, like the 30s, 60s, or 90s; I don't mean to discount Auto Regulation, but maybe confess that I'm not so good at it. there were many occasions working up from 16kg to 32kg in S&S 2.0 where I experienced a cramp in my glute or ran into another stop sign, and had to cut the day's work short. because my tendency to gauge recovery is a little off.

the reason I use these timed intervals is that I'm building in some rounding up on my rest periods. I'm overestimating my recovery times, and even as the necessary recovery times decrease as I continue a punch-the-clock training style, I find that I get breath recovery sometimes only halfway through the rest period. But, I have found that this seems to be an ingredient in my ability to better match my goals for sets reps and volume, with my ability to recover. because apparently my eyes are bigger than my stomach, and I seem to have a tendency to bite off more than I can chew. So, I remember these days to take a full period of rest. My feelings do not matter.

How do you approach your work/rest ratios and timing issues?
what signs do you rely on for starting a new set?
 
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I use talk test on all my strength and other skills. I sometimes use time intervals for mobility work.
 
I’m not good at autoregulation myself for the reasons mentioned about pushing the pace, but I only use a timer when programs call for a minimum rest period. For Maximorum and similar, I find I watch my HR much more often than the time, and tend to start sets when it comes back down to 130 ish. I find that it correlates very well with my breathing, which seems to be good for this type of program and kettlebell lifts in general (Maximorum specifically calls for taking as much rest as needed and not more).

What it does NOT work well for is heavy barbell compound lifts, especially deadlifts and squats. For those, my HR might come down within a minute or so, but if I try to go at that point I’m likely to fail early in my next set. For those I generally wait at least 3 minutes, then try to figure out if I’m truly ready for a next set based on how the last set went and how I’m feeling in the moment.
 
I use a timer for aerobic intervals or it would defeat the mechanism, I’d take too much rest.

For plain resistance work I do not use a timer. I probably should, since I normally launch in less recovered than I aught. Normally I arrange my sets so I need less recovery from the first sets and take a longer break between exercises.

Isometrics I use a timer religiously. For some simple training I sometimes count inhale/exhale.
 
I set a timer on my phone but turn off the screen. I mostly use talk test but might take some extra time on heavy sets. I usually peak at the time around half way through and again near the end. I was a slave to the clock for a long time. I find this more enjoyable. I record reps with a cheap tally counter.
 
Yes, for rest intervals. I’ve learned from experience that I’m a “Do this” type of trainee as opposed to doing it “by feel.” Without a rest interval timer I tend to overdo it.
 
Easy Muscle was the first program I tried that's built on autoregulation. I love it!

I'm sure I have room for improvement though when it comes to staying within the guardrails.
 
Depends, when doing specific intervals I certainly do. Generally I don't for rest times... although I might start doing it again as my gym sessions are getting longer than they need to be.
 
It depends.

Sometimes I use a timer. I like it as an organization tool, especially when doing something like a slow circuit. For example, the other day I set a timer to beep every minute, Min 1 I did 10 swings, Min 2 I did I think 15 pushups, and Min 3 I did 3 pull-ups. Rinse and repeat. This organized my session, for the most part allowed plenty of rest, and controls the "duration" parameter so that if I want to increase work I can easily add and assess. It helps me get an amount of work done without rushing or my session taking too long .

I also like a timer as it outsources pushing/not pushing. Sometimes I don't have a problem with this, but sometimes I just don't have the mental energy or desire to do this, and setting it up on a timer just makes it easier to complete the workout. An example is, say, A&A snatches going by feel vs. Pavel's BJJ program timing. Both are governed by the talk test, but one uses the talk test as a sign to go again, and the other as a sign of when to stop. For me, many times, the timer makes it easier - I have a fixed max duration and a fixed interval, I've "outsourced" those. It

At the same time, sometimes there is indeed a "tyranny of the timer." Even timing the total session length (for example, time to do 100 swings) can become a thing where you keep pushing to get it faster, rather than just relaxing. Sometimes I like the task master (or task manager!), and sometimes the tyranny is overbearing and I need to break free and just ... be.
 
james_1127 said:
I use a timer or HR monitor... Once my HR gets down to around 125bpm I go again
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I used to do a hill sprint protocol based on this. You set a timer for 20 minutes, sprint up the hill until your HR gets above 90%ish, then fast and loose and slow breathing until your HR gets below 125ish, then go again.
Over time you track the number of hill sprints you can complete in 20 minutes.

Its a nice way to track recovery ability over time.
 
I have previously used a timer but have more recently been experimenting with HRM. My current protocol is to let my HR return to 160 minus my age before starting the next set. This is quite low so the volume of work per session is less, or it takes me more time to complete, but I am fresher and my technique is more consistent.
 
I train with the use of a timer pretty much every time I do Giant nowadays, I set my goal rounds and figure out my rest periods and hit the workout. I back off my goal if it isn’t feeling possible and have yet to fail a rep with this strategy. I decided to throw on a HRM today and trained as I normally would and found it pretty interesting how well it synced up with my heart rate.

I think the issue would become when you let the timer dictate your lifting instead of as a suggestion. My workout starts at the second spike (first spike was a warm up set).

30- 1
25 - 2
20 - 3
15 - 4
10 - 5
5 - 6
1 - 7
 

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John K said:
It depends.

Sometimes I use a timer. I like it as an organization tool, especially when doing something like a slow circuit. For example, the other day I set a timer to beep every minute, Min 1 I did 10 swings, Min 2 I did I think 15 pushups, and Min 3 I did 3 pull-ups. Rinse and repeat. This organized my session, for the most part allowed plenty of rest, and controls the "duration" parameter so that if I want to increase work I can easily add and assess. It helps me get an amount of work done without rushing or my session taking too long .

I also like a timer as it outsources pushing/not pushing. Sometimes I don't have a problem with this, but sometimes I just don't have the mental energy or desire to do this, and setting it up on a timer just makes it easier to complete the workout. An example is, say, A&A snatches going by feel vs. Pavel's BJJ program timing. Both are governed by the talk test, but one uses the talk test as a sign to go again, and the other as a sign of when to stop. For me, many times, the timer makes it easier - I have a fixed max duration and a fixed interval, I've "outsourced" those. It

At the same time, sometimes there is indeed a "tyranny of the timer." Even timing the total session length (for example, time to do 100 swings) can become a thing where you keep pushing to get it faster, rather than just relaxing. Sometimes I like the task master (or task manager!), and sometimes the tyranny is overbearing and I need to break free and just ... be.
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I like this a lot.

For ballistics, I have come to like timed sessions to keep me accountable and to keep going. It also makes me focus more on the way I recover between sets, making me more mindful.

For grinds in a ladder format I use a timer to get a minimum amount of rest and to outsource counting... I have set up my Impetus Interval app to tell me how many reps to do and how long to rest. (Btw: It has a new feature on my suggestion: Rounds can now be counted down, which comes in handy for KBSF sessions).

But it depends. With S&S I prefered to focus on getting the volume in and not worrying about pace at all. Only every few weeks would I record something like a bench marking session to see if anything had changed. But even then I just noted the starting time and then turned around all watches to avoid looking at them all the time.

Btw: I am pretty sure that I would choose the work-constrained approach for Iron Cardio - and not the time-constrained.
 
I work more often with a timer but I really love the workouts without a timer much much more.

I did a "KB Strong first" (swing and getups) program for the last quarter of 2022. I hated the swings on the minute. But I loved the last part of the program where I just did get ups (sometimes presses) as much as I felt needed in a 15 minuets timeframe.

Before the "KB Strong first" Programm I did the RoP with a 24kg bell. There I rested for minutes like reps. So after a 4 rep rung I rested for 4 minutes. After a 5 rep rung I rested for 5 minutes etc. In total it took me round about 15 minutes of rest per ladder.
This approach was fine. It mostly felt like I got enough rest but it didn't feel like I was resting to much. My goal back than wasn't to improve the density but to finish all reps.

Two weeks ago I started with the RoP 28kg. I will try a slightly different approach. I will ignore the timer completely and just do the workload through the day. After two weeks I have to say that I like this approach much better. It doesn't feel like I am "bound" to the kettlebell for the duration of my training but that I am free to do whatever I like. (hard to describe what I mean with this). I don't know if the results will be any similar to the timed rest approach I did with the 24kg. But after searching and asking questions it seems that it doesn't really matter for strength. Only hypertrophy will be much less because of the long rest periods.

Before the RoP 24kg I did 12 weeks of A+A snatching. For the first half of the program I did them OTM. It did make me crazy after a while that o got the feeling that I was not improving any longer. It was just to hard. After asking here in the forum I think Anna suggested me to just ignore the timer. So for the second half of the program I tried autoregulation and just set a timer for maximum training duration. And that was a big surprise. The training felt much better. The difference was huge. And the most interesting part was, that the total workload wasn't even that much less than my OTM workload. So for example if I rolled my dice with a 4 that meant 30 minutes wit 5 Snatches OTM for a total of 150 snatches. But after getting rid of the timer and the OTM concept I would do on a dice 4 30 minutes in total with autoregulation. But my workload wasn't that far off. Instead of 150 snatches I my be was able to get 135 or so. And it felt like I was improving much more now. This showed to me that the auto regulation approach works for me better. Now I am excited to see if the "training through the day" approach will be good. One problem at the moment that I see is that it somehow doesn't even seems like I am training. I am not even sweating. I can't even write in my Google fit app that I was training that day. :D

BTW. I have to go start my third ladder for today.
 
With the timer I never lose track ie is it swings or pullups next ? So not really used for time but more for tracking whats been done and whats next - far easier than putting stones in a jar or ticking off a list on a whiteboard or notebook.
 
BillSteamshovel said:
With the timer I never lose track ie is it swings or pullups next ? So not really used for time but more for tracking whats been done and whats next - far easier than putting stones in a jar or ticking off a list on a whiteboard or notebook.
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For those of us who ate crayons and have trouble counting (me!), this is incredibly helpful! I can just train and not worry about ticks, counting, where I am, etc. Just focus on the current movement.
 
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