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Bodyweight Get better at chins

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A classic approach that works for many lifts is light-medium-heavy. For bw chinup, use it as an approach to volume rather than weight.

Here's a way to mix it w/ GTG for your current 3RM:

Light - GTG singles
Medium - GTG mixing doubles and singles
Heavy - warmup (perhaps with one or two singles, or a single and a double), then go for a near-max set, no GTG

On the other days, do other things or, if you still want to GTG, keep the volume low. For Heavy Day, take the day off both before and after. I can almost guarantee you you'll hit a new PR within two weeks of starting this.

-S-
 
GTG took my chins from 15 to 30 and pullups from 20 to 30.
Another thing to focus on for calithstenics is tension/torque.
keep your body tight,spine neutral and pretend like you are trying to bend the bar
the reddeltaproject has good content on the above
 
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I have never understood this idea. If grip strength is what's limiting my pullups, doesn't that mean practicing pullups is already working my grip to its limit? Why would adding more grip training help? Wouldn't that just fatigue my grip more, making me less able to practice pullups?

Not tyring to challenge anyone, I am genuinely curious. I have seen this type of "more work for the weak point" advice a lot and I just don't get it.
 
Matt604 said:
I have never understood this idea. If grip strength is what's limiting my pullups, doesn't that mean practicing pullups is already working my grip to its limit? Why would adding more grip training help? Wouldn't that just fatigue my grip more, making me less able to practice pullups?

Not tyring to challenge anyone, I am genuinely curious. I have seen this type of "more work for the weak point" advice a lot and I just don't get it.
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From what I have heard from the likes of Adam T Glass (grip training guy), the best way to train your grip is deadlift with a fat bar. Pullups would be similar I'd think, but that's a pretty uneducated opinion too. He also advocates not doing "grippers", as it is 1. A different sort of grip to holding a bar, and 2. Easy to injure your hand with the spring loaded nature of them.

YMMV, my 2c
 
I believe that both grippers and fatbar holds are great. But for different kind of gripping.
 
Matt604 said:
I have never understood this idea. If grip strength is what's limiting my pullups, doesn't that mean practicing pullups is already working my grip to its limit? Why would adding more grip training help? Wouldn't that just fatigue my grip more, making me less able to practice pullups?

Not tyring to challenge anyone, I am genuinely curious. I have seen this type of "more work for the weak point" advice a lot and I just don't get it.
Click to expand...
The real question here is whether grip strength is what is actually limiting your pullups. If one's pullup numbers are still relatively low (under 3, then maybe between 5-8) I doubt it is the grip. If you can hang on to a bar long enough to do up to somewhere around 5-8 reps, but you can't actually pull up, it might not be the grip.

That being said, grip is tied to greater muscle activation up the kinetic chain. I just have my own doubts that if someone's RM for pullups or chins is under 10, the grip is getting plenty of work and might not be the limiting factor. Once you start chasing higher numbers, and you are spending a lot more time hanging from the bar, then it makes sense that grip might be a limiting factor.

The numbers I threw out above are just guestimates; obviously there are individual factors such as height/weight, etc. This is also just my two cents. Maybe it'll turn on some lightbulbs.
 
I think Jeff is right - grip is probably not the limiting factor. BUT...
Matt604 said:
I have never understood this idea. If grip strength is what's limiting my pullups, doesn't that mean practicing pullups is already working my grip to its limit? Why would adding more grip training help? Wouldn't that just fatigue my grip more, making me less able to practice pullups?
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...if it IS the limiting factor, adding some grip training (I wouldn't overcomplicate it - if you're weak, a little hanging after your work sets would probably be enough) would be a good idea. And no, done intelligently and assuming you're recovering adequately, it shouldn't make you less able to practice pull-ups.
 
bluejeff said:
The real question here is whether grip strength is what is actually limiting your pullups. If one's pullup numbers are still relatively low (under 3, then maybe between 5-8) I doubt it is the grip. If you can hang on to a bar long enough to do up to somewhere around 5-8 reps, but you can't actually pull up, it might not be the grip.

That being said, grip is tied to greater muscle activation up the kinetic chain. I just have my own doubts that if someone's RM for pullups or chins is under 10, the grip is getting plenty of work and might not be the limiting factor. Once you start chasing higher numbers, and you are spending a lot more time hanging from the bar, then it makes sense that grip might be a limiting factor.

The numbers I threw out above are just guestimates; obviously there are individual factors such as height/weight, etc. This is also just my two cents. Maybe it'll turn on some lightbulbs.
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Yeah… makes sense to me.
I’ve done a few pull-ups over the years, and I can’t say that failing grip has ever been a limiting factor.
 
Matt604 said:
I have never understood this idea. If grip strength is what's limiting my pullups, doesn't that mean practicing pullups is already working my grip to its limit? Why would adding more grip training help? Wouldn't that just fatigue my grip more, making me less able to practice pullups?

Not tyring to challenge anyone, I am genuinely curious. I have seen this type of "more work for the weak point" advice a lot and I just don't get it.
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Good question.
I am not a sports scientist so I can't tell you a hundred percent why grip work has helped my pullups (although I have a few theories. see below).
I can offer you my experience and my clients and training partners.
All of them had big improvments in pullups,chinups and DLs.

I have a few theories.

1. Irradiation and Tension
Pavel explains (Power to the People) that strength is the ability to generate tension.
He also explains ( pg. 34) that the Law of Irradiation states that "a muscle working hard recruits neighberhood muscles and if they are part of the action it amplifies their strength"...
The more force/strength the forearms can generate the more the other muscles in that movement (biceps,lats) can generate.

2. Compensation
It is true that pullups in theory should work the grip strength adequetly enough that no specialty training should be needed. However many times i have found that pullups unevenly works the lats and biceps more than the forearms despite the fact that the forearms is the majority working muscle in the upper half of the pullup.
If you watch people when they hit their max reps and pullups you will often see they are trying to generate tension out of their lats and biceps at the top of the pullup (when their chin is trying to go over the bar) instead of their grip. This is to compensate for lack of proper forearm strength and it bleeds out strength for future reps.
After improving my grip I found that i needed to work my lats less at the top of the pullup so I had more power in the bank for more pullups.
offwidth said:
Yeah… makes sense to me.
I’ve done a few pull-ups over the years, and I can’t say that failing grip has ever been a limiting factor.
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I cant speak to anyone elses experience but my own and the people that I have trained around.
I will try to post a video of one of my friends that worked on his grip alongside his pullups.
his form is perfect (look like he is floating) and he can effortlessly knock out 30 pullups...and one arm chinups
 
Girevik007 said:
1. Irradiation and Tension
Pavel explains (Power to the People) that strength is the ability to generate tension.
He also explains ( pg. 34) that the Law of Irradiation states that "a muscle working hard recruits neighberhood muscles and if they are part of the action it amplifies their strength"...
The more force/strength the forearms can generate the more the other muscles in that movement (biceps,lats) can generate.
Click to expand...
I agree with the irradiaion part, however, I believe it to be a neurological thing. I think if the forearms are squeezing hard, you might get more muscle recruitment upstream.
Girevik007 said:
2. Compensation
It is true that pullups in theory should work the grip strength adequetly enough that no specialty training should be needed. However many times i have found that pullups unevenly works the lats and biceps more than the forearms despite the fact that the forearms is the majority working muscle in the upper half of the pullup.
If you watch people when they hit their max reps and pullups you will often see they are trying to generate tension out of their lats and biceps at the top of the pullup (when their chin is trying to go over the bar) instead of their grip. This is to compensate for lack of proper forearm strength and it bleeds out strength for future reps.
After improving my grip I found that i needed to work my lats less at the top of the pullup so I had more power in the bank for more pullups.
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Just my opinion/hunch, without deep diving into research at this point:

Without a strong enough grip, you obviously couldn't pull as hard/heavy, however, biomechanically the grip contributes next to nothing in the actual pulling motion. The forearm muscles mostly connect to to the hand/wrist. Few muscles in what we tend to think of as the forearm itself actually cross the elbow joint. The reason you see people " trying to generate tension out of their lats and biceps at the top of the pullup" is more likely because that's one of the end-ranges of those muscles. It is most difficult to generate tension at the most lengthened and most contracted ranges of motion of a muscle (you can look up "length tension relationship," if you are not already familiar), so they are more likely to be the first to fatigue.

Not really trying to start a debate here but I am always open to others' thoughts and experiences :) I would just bet the reason the grip training helped you was more of a neurological thing. I could start a whole thread about why I think paying more attention to the hands and the feet help with any movement.
 
bluejeff said:
I agree with the irradiaion part, however, I believe it to be a neurological thing. I think if the forearms are squeezing hard, you might get more muscle recruitment upstream.

Just my opinion/hunch, without deep diving into research at this point:
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Could be.
Im not a sports scientist so all I care about is results so......:)

as far as the second part:
I am aware that grip is not used much as far as the movement is concerned but I do think people expand energy gripping the bar and if they would have better grip strength they could throw it more towards the actual pullup

As a side note I got into Captain of crush when I heard Pavel mention using it (I think on Joe Rogan)
I would love to know his take....
If anyone reading this has VIP access to Chief please fwd him....
 
Of course a stronger grip is going to help you do chins/pull-ups. Having a strength reserve in any muscle involved is going to be an advantage. But the question is where is the weak link. If the grip isn't even close to giving out before the arms and lats are, I don't know how well placed that training is.

I mean, if you like grip training (and I do), then by all means do it, but grippers never did much for my holding power.
 
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