Kettlebell Goblet squat alternative for warming up

[Roual]

Does anyone have any good alternatives to the goblet squat for using as part of the S&S warm up?

Few months back I had a climbing accident and dislocated my ankle, and although it is healing nicely, I'm still having to work on the mobility side of things, and currently don't have the required ankle mobility to get into a squat position.

Also can't do a full TGU for the same reason, can't stand up out of the kneeling position, so as soon as it's healthy enough, I'm going to start adding in some overhead lunges to make up for what will undoubtedly be a weakness with the movement for me.

 

[Papa Georgio]

You could start with commando rock-backs on the floor. If your ankle is well enough, you can do some kind of assisted squat. Grab onto something that allows you to go down low and twist your hips around. I have a TRX knock off that I use, and I do a few sets of these before my actual goblet squats. I find that I can work out the mobility in my ankles and hips better this way, because you can move and rock around a lot more without worry of falling over.
Good Luck!

 

[Steve Freides]

@Roual, the goblet squat is a warmup, not part of the program proper. You could warm up in some other way.

If you can't do a full getup, you could do as much of the getup as you're able, then head back down to the floor again.

And welcome to the StrongFirst forum.

-S-

 

[Steve W.]

@Roual,

You could start with commando rock-backs on the floor. If your ankle is well enough, you can do some kind of assisted squat. Grab onto something that allows you to go down low and twist your hips around. I have a TRX knock off that I use, and I do a few sets of these before my actual goblet squats. I find that I can work out the mobility in my ankles and hips better this way, because you can move and rock around a lot more without worry of falling over.
Good Luck!

I do think it's worthwhile to train the squat pattern, even if not specifically as a "warm up" for S&S. I second @Papa Georgio's suggestions for OS rocking and assisted squatting.

Rocking is like a horizontal version of the squat pattern and you can do it with limited ankle mobility. Assisted squatting allows you to squat while keeping the torso and shins very vertical and still maintain balance. The counterweight in the goblet squat also does this -- have you experimented with different weights and holding the weight further out from your body?

For assisted squatting, a doorframe, the upright of a power rack, or a suspension trainer work well. Another version that I like is to use a medium Jump Stretch band anchored in front of me and looped around my hips. The band tension pull the hips forward in the bottom of the squat and allows you to maintain a vertical torso/shins position.

For ankle rehab and increasing range of motion, here are a couple of ideas I find effective:

The Dick Hartzell (his first name is D I C K, but the language filter on this site makes a hash of that word) band traction technique is the most effective thing I've done for my ankles. He is the originator of Jump Stretch style bands. Here are a few videos showing it, although they don't all show the setup completely clearly (Edit: apparently the vidoes didn't embed, so I changed them to links):







You can do it with or without the voodoo floss compression wrap that Donnie Thompson shows. I usually do the traction without the floss wrap and with a shoe on. I also use the floss compression separately, which also helps.

If you search "Donnie Thompson ankle" he has some other prehab/rehab/training techniques, but the Dick Hartzell traction technique is one I have used for many years and can vouch for.

 

[Nate]

Seems you just need a more hip dominant squat that uses less ankle dorsiflexion right? Shins stay more vertical & ankle goes through less movement. The box squat or face the wall squat may be helpful. This video shows against the wall but once your pattern is right you could do without wall and loss with a deadlift grip...

 

[Roual]

You could start with commando rock-backs on the floor. If your ankle is well enough, you can do some kind of assisted squat. Grab onto something that allows you to go down low and twist your hips around. I have a TRX knock off that I use, and I do a few sets of these before my actual goblet squats. I find that I can work out the mobility in my ankles and hips better this way, because you can move and rock around a lot more without worry of falling over.
Good Luck!

You know, I actually used to do the commando rock-backs as part of my warm up for a squat session to loosen up my hips, but for some reason, I completely blanked on them when trying to come up with suitable alternatives. I'll add them in and see, thanks for the suggestion!

 

[Roual]

@Roual, the goblet squat is a warmup, not part of the program proper. You could warm up in some other way.

If you can't do a full getup, you could do as much of the getup as you're able, then head back down to the floor again.

And welcome to the StrongFirst forum.

-S-

Thanks Steve. I do understand that they're only supposed to be part of the warm up, but I've seen massive benefits from them in the past, so I'm annoyed that I can't do them properly at the moment (after reading something from Dan John, I started doing daily goblet squats to groove the squat pattern, which really helped with my barbell squats, and I'm also convinced it's what allowed me to walk away from being dropped from the top of a 7m climbing wall).

For the get ups, I'm currently getting to the kneeling position, holding it with a bit of a hip flexor stretch for around 10 seconds, then reversing the process back to the start.

Thanks for the welcome as well, not a traditional first post I'll admit, but I've been lurking here for so long I sometimes forget that I haven't actually engaged with the community at all.

 

[Roual]

@Roual,


I do think it's worthwhile to train the squat pattern, even if not specifically as a "warm up" for S&S. I second @Papa Georgio's suggestions for OS rocking and assisted squatting.

Rocking is like a horizontal version of the squat pattern and you can do it with limited ankle mobility. Assisted squatting allows you to squat while keeping the torso and shins very vertical and still maintain balance. The counterweight in the goblet squat also does this -- have you experimented with different weights and holding the weight further out from your body?

For assisted squatting, a doorframe, the upright of a power rack, or a suspension trainer work well. Another version that I like is to use a medium Jump Stretch band anchored in front of me and looped around my hips. The band tension pull the hips forward in the bottom of the squat and allows you to maintain a vertical torso/shins position.

For ankle rehab and increasing range of motion, here are a couple of ideas I find effective:

The d@#$ Hartzell (his first name is D I C K, but the language filter on this site makes a hash of that word) band traction technique is the most effective thing I've done for my ankles. He is the originator of Jump Stretch style bands. Here are a few videos showing it, although they don't all show the setup completely clearly (Edit: apparently the vidoes didn't embed, so I changed them to links):







You can do it with or without the voodoo floss compression wrap that Donnie Thompson shows. I usually do the traction without the floss wrap and with a shoe on. I also use the floss compression separately, which also helps.

If you search "Donnie Thompson ankle" he has some other prehab/rehab/training techniques, but the d@#$ Hartzell traction technique is one I have used for many years and can vouch for.

These are great, thank you!

I can manage barbell box squats with a wide stance at the gym, but I train S&S in the morning at home and only have access to limited equipment. I hadn't actually thought about shifting the 'bell so I can keep my shins more vertical, thinking about it, elevating my heels slightly would also allow me to goblet squat until I get the required mobility back.

I'll give those videos a watch later on. I can feel a fair amount of scar tissue surrounding the ankle joint, so the idea of using voodoo floss on them is actually very interesting.

 

[Roual]

Seems you just need a more hip dominant squat that uses less ankle dorsiflexion right? Shins stay more vertical & ankle goes through less movement. The box squat or face the wall squat may be helpful. This video shows against the wall but once your pattern is right you could do without wall and loss with a deadlift grip...

I do actually do wider stance box squats as part of a separate training session, but I'll give the face the wall squats a go as well, I know my thoracic extension isn't great, so they might help with that as well.

 

[Nate]

I do actually do wider stance box squats as part of a separate training session, but I'll give the face the wall squats a go as well, I know my thoracic extension isn't great, so they might help with that as well.

Armbars did more for my thoracic than anything else. Boatloads of swings & lessening pushing (bench) probably helped too.

 

[Roual]

Armbars did more for my thoracic than anything else. Boatloads of swings & lessening pushing (bench) probably helped too.

Armbars are a new one for me, though from watching a couple of videos it makes sense how they'd be great for thoracic mobility. Are they taught in one of the SF courses / qualifications? (So far I've only attended the one day kettlebell course)

 

[Bauer]

For the last 4 weeks, due to vacation and a busy life, I did mostly leopard crawling for exercise + GTG hanging (passive, active and assisted with feet on the ground).

This week I got back to S&S and was pleased: my Goblet Squat depth has improved my joints feel great.

In general my joint mobility and stability have improved (shoulders, hips, knees, ankles, wrists) and my core stability as well (especially my reflexive strength in the back swing - keeping my core engaged and thus protecting my lower back).

The results are so striking that I consider keeping crawling in the mix and sometimes skipping goblet squats and maybe even TGU in favour of more crawling.

For ankle mobilty try to roll over your pinky toe when crawling - I got this tip from Aleks Salkin (SFG) who credits Geoff Neupert.

Hanging, crawling and arm bars are great for shoulder mobility and stability. Really clears things up over the course of weeks.