Kettlebell Gripping technique for KB Goblet Squats

[guardian7]

@PaulAtreides
Goblet squats are my go to move for legs right now, I like the demands they place on my abdomen, this is my focus more than legs, combining these with renegade rows are incredible for tension practice.

Regarding goblet squat grip I like to use the horns up version, my grip is with three fingers and the index finger points at about 45 degrees up and guides more than holds.
The heel of the hand tucks hard into the lower half of the horn and is helped by squeezing pecs together, this also becomes part of the tension chain.
The forearms stay mostly vertical and hands follow in a straight line from the forearm. At no time do I exert pressure 'sideways' on the hand or wrist. The forearms themselves also help to squeeze the bell and hold it up, it feels good to squeeze the bell into my chest as well, this way the bell becomes part of my upper body, front loading it safely and with stability.
Using this method I can squat with 40k and have no issues, I haven't gone heavier yet as 40 seems about right for 5 reps at the moment.
Lighter weights feel good also.. depends on the day

Don't you find the double KB front squat even more challenging for core strength? I agree with fractal. It should be promoted more in SF. It is all you need for GPP and can progress a lot with more safety and a lower learning curve and much more convience than the barbell squat for a general population. The barbell is necessary for elite numbers, I concede.

 

[fractal]

Thanks for all of your good advice everyone

I feel very tempted to buy a second 24kg and 32kg bell, but I'm on a budget for the next couple of months... DFSQs are awesome, tried them at a friends place a couple of years ago.
I do have a barbell, a half-rack, J-hooks and spotter arms though, so I guess I should just get real and learn how to barbell-squat properly.

Since I have an inordinate amount of respect for all kinds of squats (or maybe just the right amount of it, who knows), I'll definitely make a thread for my squatting technique, be it Goblet, DFSQ, Single KB FSQ or barbell squat.

As for my grip question regarding the goblet squat: I've tried horns up (as described by @Bret S.) which worked really well for the 24kg but not the 32kg (have to reposition the bell after or during each rep, tried upside down which I felt was harder than my initial technique. holding it by the bell body works perfectly for the 32kg, however I have no idea how to get it into that position so I sort of cleaned it up and caught it mid-flip with the other hand, and getting it back down to the floor was a pretty dangerous act of randomness... tweaked my left shoulder blade and wrists a little but should be fine by Monday.

Is there any good video or set of instructions out there for how to safely get it into and out of that position?
-----------------

If you had to choose just one type of squat to train for, say, a year or two, which one would you choose?
Preferably the technique shouldn't be too taxing on grip and wrists, since I'm already doing a lot of gripwork.
Also it should be as easy to learn as possible (I've heard people say the low bar squat is hard to learn).
What I want from the squat is stronger legs mainly for stronger leg drive when footbiking and concept2 rowing,
and a stronger back for everyday utility, BJJ and injury prevention through strength.

I'm guessing I should opt for the high bar squat?

If I had all options available, it would still be hard to pull me away from DFSQ. Based on your criteria, the zercher squat is probably what you’re after. I’d probably cycle that one in myself if I still had a barbell.

 

[Oscar]

Thanks for all of your good advice everyone

I feel very tempted to buy a second 24kg and 32kg bell, but I'm on a budget for the next couple of months... DFSQs are awesome, tried them at a friends place a couple of years ago.
I do have a barbell, a half-rack, J-hooks and spotter arms though, so I guess I should just get real and learn how to barbell-squat properly.

Since I have an inordinate amount of respect for all kinds of squats (or maybe just the right amount of it, who knows), I'll definitely make a thread for my squatting technique, be it Goblet, DFSQ, Single KB FSQ or barbell squat.

As for my grip question regarding the goblet squat: I've tried horns up (as described by @Bret S.) which worked really well for the 24kg but not the 32kg (have to reposition the bell after or during each rep, tried upside down which I felt was harder than my initial technique. holding it by the bell body works perfectly for the 32kg, however I have no idea how to get it into that position so I sort of cleaned it up and caught it mid-flip with the other hand, and getting it back down to the floor was a pretty dangerous act of randomness... tweaked my left shoulder blade and wrists a little but should be fine by Monday.

Is there any good video or set of instructions out there for how to safely get it into and out of that position?
-----------------

If you had to choose just one type of squat to train for, say, a year or two, which one would you choose?
Preferably the technique shouldn't be too taxing on grip and wrists, since I'm already doing a lot of gripwork.
Also it should be as easy to learn as possible (I've heard people say the low bar squat is hard to learn).
What I want from the squat is stronger legs mainly for stronger leg drive when footbiking and concept2 rowing,
and a stronger back for everyday utility, BJJ and injury prevention through strength.

I'm guessing I should opt for the high bar squat?

From your description, it appears that the goblet squat is with 32 is still a bit heavy for you. Just keep using the 24 and every now and then include a few reps with 32.

 

[PaulAtreides]

thanks again for your valuable inputs.

here's what I'll do:
1. learn the Zercher squat with an empty/lightly loaded bar and post videos of my technique for coaching. switch to training zercher squats as soon as I'm confident of my technique.
1.1 in the meantime, train my legs with 24kg goblet squats for much higher reps and sets than I did up to now. I'll post videos of my technique of that as well, just to be sure.
2. Once I have the money for a couple more kettlebells, I'll get another 24kg & 32kg KB and learn the proper DFSQ. guess that'll happen around february or march 2019.
2.2 keep training Zercher squats until I'm confident of my DFSQ technique, then switch to DFSQ and start alternating DFSQs and Zerchers every cycle or two.

@fractal is there any technique video / list of instructions for the zercher you can recommend, to get me started?

 

[PaulAtreides]

@guardian7 I think I didn't do the technique properly back when I tried the DFSQ 2x24kg (rounded back like a scared little kitty and losing most of the tension at the bottom of each rep), but even with that technique, I remember it hitting the core harder than the 32kg goblet squat. Thanks for the hint about using the bench to set up the goblet squat. I may give that a try at some point, but for now I'll go for Zerchers and 24kg goblet squats.

@Oscar good call. If it weren't for the grip, I could do 10+ reps with the 32kg.
but you're right; since I can do 24kg goblet squats without being bottlenecked by my grip, I'll go for more 24kg work and learn the Zercher squat in the meantime

@fractal Now that you mention the Zercher squat, it seems to be exactly what I'm after since there's not much if any gripping involved. Are these two videos any good in terms of technique? looking for a "role model" video to get me started

 

[guardian7]

@guardian7 I think I didn't do the technique properly back when I tried the DFSQ 2x24kg (rounded back like a scared little kitty and losing most of the tension at the bottom of each rep), but even with that technique, I remember it hitting the core harder than the 32kg goblet squat. Thanks for the hint about using the bench to set up the goblet squat. I may give that a try at some point, but for now I'll go for Zerchers and 24kg goblet squats.

@Oscar good call. If it weren't for the grip, I could do 10+ reps with the 32kg.
but you're right; since I can do 24kg goblet squats without being bottlenecked by my grip, I'll go for more 24kg work and learn the Zercher squat in the meantime

@fractal Now that you mention the Zercher squat, it seems to be exactly what I'm after since there's not much if any gripping involved. Are these two videos any good in terms of technique? looking for a "role model" video to get me started

The Zercher was recommended and added to the SF barbell user's course I took. I am glad it was.

 

[Anna C]

Are these two videos any good in terms of technique? looking for a "role model" video to get me started

The first video is OK, but he says to keep the torso upright. What SFL teaches is to lean over more like a low bar back squat. I think you'll get more benefits this way. Here's a video I made a while back if it helps. Notice 5 reps with the SFL-taught torso angle, and then a 6th rep with more of an upright torso like a goblet squat. Not "wrong", but not the way it's taught for best strength-building effects. You can load heavier AND get more challenge to the abs if you lean the torso forward.

The second video, he's not even going to parallel with the thighs, much less below parallel. I would say don't follow that one.

In both of them, they try to bring the hands close to the chest. There's no need to do that. Just have the forearms at an angle high enough to have the barbell secure; i.e. just above parallel.

 

[PaulAtreides]

@Anna C thanks for your demonstration.

I'll study both your video and the first one I posted, and find myself a cameraman.
I'll try to post my first technique video sometime next week in a new thread in the barbell section.

 

[Ryan T]

@PaulAtreides You got some great accomplishments on your signature line and love the quote from Dune!

 

[Bret S.]

Don't you find the double KB front squat even more challenging for core strength?

Maybe it's in my head only, but the carryover from goblets to snatching seems to be connected somehow, as though the abdominal recruitment pattern is similar. I haven't heard or read it, just a 'gut' feeling I have.
Doubles front squat has been my go to for the most part. I'm right now experimenting.

To the question, the DBFS is definitely more challenging, probably more due to heavier loading. With GS loading is 'different' with center of bell mass being more forward of the torso, at least it feels that way to me. In the end I like any version of squats.

 

[fractal]

The first video is OK, but he says to keep the torso upright. What SFL teaches is to lean over more like a low bar back squat. I think you'll get more benefits this way. Here's a video I made a while back if it helps. Notice 5 reps with the SFL-taught torso angle, and then a 6th rep with more of an upright torso like a goblet squat. Not "wrong", but not the way it's taught for best strength-building effects. You can load heavier AND get more challenge to the abs if you lean the torso forward.

The second video, he's not even going to parallel with the thighs, much less below parallel. I would say don't follow that one.

In both of them, they try to bring the hands close to the chest. There's no need to do that. Just have the forearms at an angle high enough to have the barbell secure; i.e. just above parallel.

This covers it. My personal preference is to not clasp the hands but to keep the forearms parallel with palms up and fists made. I would say the first video demonstrates a bit more neck extension than I’d like as well - but I’m sure folks stronger than myself may disagree.

 

[PaulAtreides]

Thanks for all of your advice, it was very helpful!

for those interested, I've just opened a thread to review my squatting technique (and some other kettlebell moves):

General Technique Review [Videos]