High cholesterol questions

Mark Kidd

Level 4 Valued Member
Study the work of Dr. John McDougall Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn. Follow their protocols, fix the problem, and move on. They have helped thousands of people over decades with the same issue. It is a well trodden and well understood path.

It’s fairly simple, but simple doesn’t always mean easy.
What problem?
I failed a test that I knew I was going to fail because I was eating like crap. Next two came back fine. I’m trying to figure out what to do to keep off the inevitable while still having energy to play with my kids and keep working out.
 

mprevost

Level 6 Valued Member
Hey Folks

So, awhile back I failed a cholesterol test. It was unsurprising in retrospect. I was eating like garbage and inhaled half a Costco bag of chocolate almonds the night before.

I passed the next two no problem (as expected). But I was also working out 6 days a week.

We are expecting our 3rd child in a few weeks so I know 6 days a week isn’t going to happen.

So I have a few questions about cholesterol:
1) I’ve been doing a cutting program while doing Dry Fighting Weight (awesome program). I also did light swings and snatches on the off days. I felt like this caught up to me, and I didn’t get the final day results I hoped for. Can I back off and expect results? By back off to 3 days a week and still keep my cholesterol low?

2) I’m reading Quick and Dead. Is cholesterol stay low in the body if you take days off to recover?

3) How is cholesterol used during recovery days?

I’m asking because high cholesterol runsin the family and I’m in my early 40’s, the time when that tends to rise in my family.

Thanks.

If you have 30 minutes and want to learn all of the intricate details of how cholesterol is processed and regulated, I did a video here:
 

mprevost

Level 6 Valued Member
The triglyceride/HDL ratio is looking like it is more predictive of heart disease than other ratios, or total cholesterol. It is also correlated with insulin resistance and is predictive of a high LDL particle count (also bad). If your blood test is measured in mg/dl, you want the number to be less than 2. If measured in mmol/L, then you want less than .87. Lower is better. I'll bet that Steve's is less than 1. In people with insulin resistance, high carb intake tends to make this ratio much worse, by driving up triglyceride production. In those without insulin resistance, who knows. High vs low carbs did not impact my triglycerides much at all. In most studies, weight loss (especially belly fat) seems to have a positive impact on the ratio.
 

Mark Kidd

Level 4 Valued Member
The triglyceride/HDL ratio is looking like it is more predictive of heart disease than other ratios, or total cholesterol. It is also correlated with insulin resistance and is predictive of a high LDL particle count (also bad). If your blood test is measured in mg/dl, you want the number to be less than 2. If measured in mmol/L, then you want less than .87. Lower is better. I'll bet that Steve's is less than 1. In people with insulin resistance, high carb intake tends to make this ratio much worse, by driving up triglyceride production. In those without insulin resistance, who knows. High vs low carbs did not impact my triglycerides much at all. In most studies, weight loss (especially belly fat) seems to have a positive impact on the ratio.
I will watch your video and check those numbers on the report.
 

Mark Kidd

Level 4 Valued Member
If you have 30 minutes and want to learn all of the intricate details of how cholesterol is processed and regulated, I did a video here:
That was too far over my head. Thanks for posting it. I’m sure someone will get something out of it.
 

kennycro@@aol.com

Level 6 Valued Member
awhile back I failed a cholesterol test.

I passed the next two no problem (as expected). But I was also working out 6 days a week.

Pass-Fail

I would not classify a "Cholesterol Test" as something that falls into the category of "Pass-Fail"

Without knowing your numbers, it's impossible to provide any feed back.

Those numbers are vital in...

Knowing How To Read A Blood Lipid Profile

It comes down to knowing each individual number and there relationship to the other numbers.

The majority of individual, as wells as many physicians, fail to do that. Instead they tend to look at each number separately.

This amount to taking a snap shot of something rather the seeing the whole picture.

A snap shot does not tells you the complete story.

Puzzle Parts

Think of each reading (Total Cholesterol, HDL, LDL, and Triglycerides) as part of a puzzle.

With that in mind let's examine some of number in the...

Blood Lipid Profile

1) Total Cholesterol
: This number alone means nothing. The main value it has is in determining Remnant Cholesterol. This is a vital number for determining your Cardiovascular Risk.

Total Cholesterol = HDL + LDL + (Triglycerides divided by 5)

The relevance of Total Cholesterol as a measurement of you cardiovascular health is in determining your...

Remnant Cholesterol

Remnant Cholesterol - Total Cholesterol - (HDL +LDL)
  • Below 20 mg/dL (0.49 mmol/L) is generally optimal
  • Around 20-30 mg/dL (0.49-0.78 mmol/L) is generally medium risk
  • Above 30 mg/dL (.78 mmol/L) is higher risk
Remnant Calculator

Plug your numbers into the calculator above to see where you are.

2) LDL: This is another number that by itself means nothing. Ironically, many physicians and most of the general population view it as the "Bad Cholesterol".

The determinate factor in determining if LDL is good or bad is the percentage of LDL Particles.

a) Particle A LDL Is Good: If you have a larger percentage of good Particle A LDL, your LDL is fine.

b) Particle B LDL Is Bad: If you have a larger percentage of bad Particle B LDL, you have a health issue.

Particle Test can determine if your percentage is good or bad LDL. However, physical don't tells you about it nor do they prescribe the lab work for it.

However, there is practical method of determining if you have good or bad LDL. More on that in a minute.

3) HDL: This is an important number. Higher is better, lower isn't so good.

HDL is increased with exercise. Ironically, consuming Saturated Fat will also increase your HDL. No physician ever tells you that.

4) Triglycerides: This is a vital number. Lower is better.

5) Triglycerides:HDL Ratio: The ratio is vital in determining cardiovascular health.

a) Low Triglycerides and High HDL is good.

b) High Triglycerides and Low HDL is bad.

c) Your ratio indicates if you have more good Particle A or more bad Particle B.

d) A lower number means you have more good Particle A and a high number means you have more bad Particle B.

Math: Divide you HDL into your Triglycerides.

a) 2 or less is really good.

b) 2 - 3 is in the grey area. The higher the number the darker the grey.

c) 4 plus, means a dramatic increase in Cardiovascular Risk.

This information falls in line with most of Mike Prevost post.
 
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Mark Kidd

Level 4 Valued Member
Pass-Fail

I would not classify a "Cholesterol Test" as something that falls into the category of "Pass-Fail"

Without knowing your numbers, it's impossible to provide any feed back.

Those numbers are vital in...

Knowing How To Read A Blood Lipid Profile

It comes down to knowing each individual number and there relationship to the other numbers.

The majority of individual, as wells as many physicians, fail to do that. Instead they tend to look at each number separately.

This amount to taking a snap shot of something rather the seeing the whole picture.

A snap shot does not tells you the complete story.

Puzzle Parts

Think of each reading (Total Cholesterol, HDL, LDL, and Triglycerides) as part of a puzzle.

With that in mind let's examine some of number in the...

Blood Lipid Profile

1) Total Cholesterol
: This number alone means nothing. The main value it has is in determining Remnant Cholesterol. This is a vital number for determining your Cardiovascular Risk.

Total Cholesterol = HDL + LDL + (Triglycerides divided by 5)

The relevance of Total Cholesterol as a measurement of you cardiovascular health is in determining your...

Remnant Cholesterol

Remnant Cholesterol - Total Cholesterol - (HDL +LDL)
  • Below 20 mg/dL (0.49 mmol/L) is generally optimal
  • Around 20-30 mg/dL (0.49-0.78 mmol/L) is generally medium risk
  • Above 30 mg/dL (.78 mmol/L) is higher risk
Remnant Calculator

Plug your numbers into the calculator above to see where you are.

2) LDL: This is another number that by itself means nothing. Ironically, many physicians and most of the general population view it as the "Bad Cholesterol".

The determinate factor in determining if LDL is good or bad is the percentage of LDL Particles.

a) Particle A LDL Is Good: If you have a larger percentage of good Particle A LDL, your LDL is fine.

b) Particle B LDL Is Bad: If you have a larger percentage of bad Particle B LDL, you have a health issue.

Particle Test can determine if your percentage is good or bad LDL. However, physical don't tells you about it nor do they prescribe the lab work for it.

However, there is practical method of determining if you have good or bad LDL. More on that in a minute.

3) HDL: This is an important number. Higher is better, lower isn't so good.

HDL is increased with exercise. Ironically, consuming Saturated Fat will also increase your HDL. No physician ever tells you that.

4) Triglycerides: This is a vital number. Lower is better.

5) Triglycerides:HDL Ratio: The ratio is vital in determining cardiovascular health.

a) Low Triglycerides and High HDL is good.

b) High Triglycerides and Low HDL is bad.

c) Your ratio indicates if you have more good Particle A or more bad Particle B.

d) A lower number means you have more good Particle A and a high number means you have more bad Particle B.

Math: Divide you HDL into your Triglycerides.

a) 2 or less is really good.

b) 2 - 3 is in the grey area. The higher the number the darker the grey.

c) 4 plus, means a dramatic increase in Cardiovascular Risk.

This information falls in line with most of Mike Prevost post.
I did a quick calculation. This could be better, but aren’t bad. Will continue to work on them.
 

silveraw

Level 6 Valued Member
Study the work of Dr. John McDougall Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn. Follow their protocols, fix the problem, and move on. They have helped thousands of people over decades with the same issue. It is a well trodden and well understood path.

It’s fairly simple, but simple doesn’t always mean easy.
Lol I was reading Esselstyns trial studies and you aren’t kidding. They had something like an 80% non compliance rate with the diet test subjects.

to put that in perspective, the Minnesota starvation study had zero non compliance And a subject was so delirious from hunger that they chopped their own fingers off and still didn’t quit.
 

Don Fairbanks

SFG II
Certified Instructor
Peter Attia has excellent info. So does Paul Saladino, Mike Mutzel,Chris Kresser, and Josh Axe.
I'd be concerned with fasting and postprandial ( after meal ) glucose levels.
Several servings of oatmeal per day can cause problems.
Jogging recommendation, with an Achilles issue? Crazy talk.
 

BrianCF

Level 6 Valued Member
As someone with a 210+ high cholesterol and 51, the key is to get the HDL number up. That's the good cholesterol.

Eat fiber, from beans, quinoa, green vegetables. Lay off the booze. I love a drink as much as anyone, but it will screw up your renal function, blood pressure and cholesterol numbers. You will lose weight from the lack of extra calories. And have better workouts, and be leaner.
 

kennycro@@aol.com

Level 6 Valued Member
As someone with a 210+ high cholesterol and 51, the key is to get the HDL number up. That's the good cholesterol.

Total Cholesterol Number

This number alone means nothing.

The value of knowing your Total Cholesterol Number is in determining your Remnant Cholesterol Number,

HDL Number

Yes, a high HDL Number is good.

LDL Number

LDL isn't necessarily good or bad.

You can have high LDL be healthy. You can have low LDL and have a health issue.

Particle Size

LDL come in two flavors;

Particle A LDL; If you have a high percentage of it you are healthy.

Particle B LDL: If you have a high percentage of it, you need to be concerned.

All this information is in my above post.

The key to understanding your Blood Lipid Profile is knowing how to interpret the number and their correlation with each other.
 

Don Fairbanks

SFG II
Certified Instructor
Hey Folks

So, awhile back I failed a cholesterol test. It was unsurprising in retrospect. I was eating like garbage and inhaled half a Costco bag of chocolate almonds the night before.

I passed the next two no problem (as expected). But I was also working out 6 days a week.

We are expecting our 3rd child in a few weeks so I know 6 days a week isn’t going to happen.

So I have a few questions about cholesterol:
1) I’ve been doing a cutting program while doing Dry Fighting Weight (awesome program). I also did light swings and snatches on the off days. I felt like this caught up to me, and I didn’t get the final day results I hoped for. Can I back off and expect results? By back off to 3 days a week and still keep my cholesterol low?

2) I’m reading Quick and Dead. Is cholesterol stay low in the body if you take days off to recover?

3) How is cholesterol used during recovery days?

I’m asking because high cholesterol runsin the family and I’m in my early 40’s, the time when that tends to rise in my family.

Thanks.
I believe you will find the book The Big Fat Surprise by Nina Teicholz interesting.

CliffsNotes vid. version for the time challenged.
 
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Steve Freides

Staff
Staff member
Senior Certified Instructor
Elite Certified Instructor
I'll bet that Steve's is less than 1.
I will have to find my paperwork and check.

A question for anyone who can answer - I am coming up on my next physical exam, and I'm supposed to call my doctor's office this week and ask them to order bloodwork for me, for which I'll go to a local lab.

Whoever I spoke with at the doctor's office had no idea that there was a finer-grained test than the usual kind of cholesterol test available, and I know we've discussed that here. Can someone please tell me exactly _what_ to ask for? I would like to have the more fine-grained cholesterol test, but not know what it's called, I am unable to ask for it from a nurse or secretary who also doesn't know. At least if I have a name, she can run that by the doctor and get it added to the script.

Thanks in advance.

-S-
 

mprevost

Level 6 Valued Member
It is called an LDL-P test (the "P" stands for particle count). Usually is is called an NMP Lipoprofile test (NMR is nuclear magnetic resonance). Dr. Peter Attia, Dr. Tom Dayspring, Dr. Tara Doll all have lots of information online regarding the interpretation of these tests. It is usually about $100. Realistically, based on your numbers, you almost certainly will have a low particle count.
 

bistrik

First Post
I have personally tried this and I know it helps 100%

1-Oatmeal half a cup before lunch and I put one tablespoon of maple syrup to make it tastier (you can eat carbs and sugar)
2-I stopped eating carbs and sugar. That's another way.
 

kennycro@@aol.com

Level 6 Valued Member
I believe cholesterol levels are really dictated from diet.
Genetic Not Diet

This is a myth that continues to be perpetuated when statements like this are make.

What matters are the facts not what you think of believe. Google is your friend.

Four Common Cholesterol Misconceptions

"About 85% of the cholesterol in the body is produced in the liver, rather than from the cholesterol we consume.2 Additionally, it is believed that when dietary cholesterol is increased, the body compensates, and the liver starts to produce less cholesterol.

As you found out...

The lowest cholesterol levels I've ever had was after a stint on the Atkins diet where I lost 40lbs while eating bacon and eggs every morning.

cholesterol is needed for testosterone production.

Yes.

It's a little frustrating that many doctors want to chalk it up to hereditary

Many physicians do not know how to interpret a Blood Lipid Blood Panel.

A lot of their knowledge is based on information they learned in the 20th Century, rather than the present 21 Century.

Physician have not kept up.

Secondly, the American Medical Association is extremely conservative. It take them decades to rectify out dated information with new research data.

Thus, physician are a huge issue when it comes to disseminating the newest research findings.

Medical errors are the third-leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer.

As a case in point, my son and his girl friend took vacation trip to India, years ago.

He came back sick. The doctor treated him for Malaria; which he didn't have.

After a few weeks, he was admitted to a hospital intensive care unit. He had Typhoid.

The doctor incorrectly diagnosed it; which take us back to their issues with Medical Errors.

Part of that blame is also on patients who are looking for an easy button.

Common Issue

The general public wants a simple answer/solution to a complex issue. They are not willing to make an effort to resolve it.

My sister is an example. She has Non-Alcoholic Fatty Liver. This usually can be corrected with diet.

However, she isn't willing to make any diet changes. She pops a pill to fix it; only it not fixing it, it is getting worse.

It is only a matter of time before she's dead.

My bother in law is a diabetic on insulin. He consume a lot of simple sugar junk foods.

His solution is to just shoot up more insulin after consuming all the junk food.

It is impossible to have any empathy or sympathy for individuals make those choices.

I'd encourage anybody to do your research before settling in on a solution.

Following Your Own Advice

You should have followed you own advice and looked some of this information up before posting it.

"No one ever got dumber from reading a book (research article, etc)". Alwyn Cosgrove
 
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