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Kettlebell Iron Cardio

Hello everyone,
A first feedback and a question about Iron cardio...

I had planned to do iron cardio 2 days a week + Q&D 2 days a week. I wanted to do it with 28kg (hoping to transfer to the snatch test with 24kg), but I had been advised to do Q&D with 24kg in a first time.
It was very good advice: Q&D at 28kg alone would have been feasible, but not by mixing it with another program, the load linked to performing the snatches at full power (especially during the eccentric phase if we do an eccentric overspeed) is really very important.

Q&D with 24kg has not been proving appropriate for my goal (to stabilize and facilitate my snatch test), so I've opted for a more reasonable approach than Q&D given my abilities and characteristics: 2 days Iron cardio and 2 days A+A snatches (with essentially 28kg : 2 to 7 reps, most of the time EMOM, 20 to 40 sets) per week.
There's more volume with A+A training, but it's less "violent" than Q&D in the end.
For my iron cardio sessions, I alternate light, medium and hard sessions.
For the moment, I have a constant progression curve on both (iron cardio and A+A), without interference between the two, so I'm happy with that.

My question concerns the management of the difficulty of iron cardio sessions.
@Brett Jones , which "indicator" should I use first to estimate whether it's an easy, medium or hard session (I've read and reread the book, I know the variables can interact as you wrote in the book) :
- the sensation of general fatigue linked to volume and density?
- difficulty in "completing" repetitions (especially in the press)?
I'm wondering, for example, whether a low-volume session with high loads should be considered easy or difficult, for example weight ladders for 15-20 minutes with generous rests (low density): the general fatigue felt in this kind of session is low, but the sets done with the heaviest weight are still hard and the load, especially on the shoulders, is high). My main concern is to make progress without overloading my shoulders, which are in good health but can't take too much excess!

Sorry for this very long post, and thank you Brett for Iron cardio : I really enjoy each session !
Matthieu
 
Hello everyone,
A first feedback and a question about Iron cardio...

I had planned to do iron cardio 2 days a week + Q&D 2 days a week. I wanted to do it with 28kg (hoping to transfer to the snatch test with 24kg), but I had been advised to do Q&D with 24kg in a first time.
It was very good advice: Q&D at 28kg alone would have been feasible, but not by mixing it with another program, the load linked to performing the snatches at full power (especially during the eccentric phase if we do an eccentric overspeed) is really very important.

Q&D with 24kg has not been proving appropriate for my goal (to stabilize and facilitate my snatch test), so I've opted for a more reasonable approach than Q&D given my abilities and characteristics: 2 days Iron cardio and 2 days A+A snatches (with essentially 28kg : 2 to 7 reps, most of the time EMOM, 20 to 40 sets) per week.
There's more volume with A+A training, but it's less "violent" than Q&D in the end.
For my iron cardio sessions, I alternate light, medium and hard sessions.
For the moment, I have a constant progression curve on both (iron cardio and A+A), without interference between the two, so I'm happy with that.

My question concerns the management of the difficulty of iron cardio sessions.
@Brett Jones , which "indicator" should I use first to estimate whether it's an easy, medium or hard session (I've read and reread the book, I know the variables can interact as you wrote in the book) :
- the sensation of general fatigue linked to volume and density?
- difficulty in "completing" repetitions (especially in the press)?
I'm wondering, for example, whether a low-volume session with high loads should be considered easy or difficult, for example weight ladders for 15-20 minutes with generous rests (low density): the general fatigue felt in this kind of session is low, but the sets done with the heaviest weight are still hard and the load, especially on the shoulders, is high). My main concern is to make progress without overloading my shoulders, which are in good health but can't take too much excess!

Sorry for this very long post, and thank you Brett for Iron cardio : I really enjoy each session !
Matthieu
Matthieu,

Easy, Med, Hard is a combination of factors—intensity, density, volume and the combination of the variation.

Intensity meaning load—in my own training this has become 32kg easy, 36kg med, 40kg heavy.

Density—discussed here before if you doubling the time in sets (40 sets in 20 min) then the density is high and a more difficult variation and with double bells it is likely somewhere in the set every 45 seconds range. (still working that one out)

Volume—I've pushed to 60 set sessions and have found 30-40 sets to be a sweet spot. But you also have to do the math on the session.
Classic IC is 3 reps a set so 40 sets = 120 reps, add snatch and its 140. Do a rep ladder for 60 sets and you get 120 presses, 60 cleans and 60 squats = 240 reps. Traveling 2's....you get the idea

The combo of the variation—Classic IC at my easy and med intensity weights will be easier sessions (unless I push the density and then they can become medium), +Snatch takes my easy and med weight and now we have medium and hard sessions, etc.

And of course tracking RPE.

Its an ongoing coversation not a "set" rulebook IMO.
 
The combo of the variation—Classic IC at my easy and med intensity weights will be easier sessions (unless I push the density and then they can become medium), +Snatch takes my easy and med weight and now we have medium and hard sessions, etc.

And of course tracking RPE.

Its an ongoing coversation not a "set" rulebook IMO.
Thank you Brett for your quick answer !
 
Just finished my last week of IC, have been doing 2 sessions a week alongside 2 runs and 2 sessions of Q&D.

Today I did 80 reps (40 each side) in a 40 minute session, so a rep about every 30 seconds. Was doing single 24kg clean, press, squat, snatch.

Great program, thanks!
 
So many levers that can be pulled in Iron Cardio. I typically use my 5RM bell as recommended and after two sequences let my HR return to 160 minus my age before starting the next sequence. This morning I went with my 10RM bell as recommended in the original Strength Aerobics article and compressed my usual rest breaks. Throughout the 30-minute session my HR stayed within my theoretical Zone 2 range. Of course, very different to a Zone 2 session but a nice change from the heavier sessions with longer rest breaks.
 
I have been continuing my Iron Cardio training but in the back of mind I've been wondering how to know when to progress it. I came up with the idea of training Iron Cardio style but with The Tactical Barbell's method of programming intensity and progression. So I have roughly worked out my 1RTM for each of my 3 movements in my training cluster and have then worked out my actual training percentages as outlined in the Tactical Barbell book. I feel this will be a good combination of methods and allow me train some HIC and occasional LISS as outlined in Tactical Barbell 2.
 
I have been continuing my Iron Cardio training but in the back of mind I've been wondering how to know when to progress it. I came up with the idea of training Iron Cardio style but with The Tactical Barbell's method of programming intensity and progression. So I have roughly worked out my 1RTM for each of my 3 movements in my training cluster and have then worked out my actual training percentages as outlined in the Tactical Barbell book. I feel this will be a good combination of methods and allow me train some HIC and occasional LISS as outlined in Tactical Barbell 2.
I’m not familiar with the TB2 progression method, but @Brett Jones recommends progressing to more challenging variations or a heavier bell when you can do twice as many sets as there are minutes in your session (e.g. 40 sets in 20 minutes).

I’m about to start an Iron Cardio run with a few variations; I figure I’ll return to Classic often as a benchmark to see if I’m ready to progress.
 
As recommended by Paules and because it will build total body strength/muscle I'm sticking with trap bar deadlifts, pull-ups and dips. I do 1 X tbdl, 2 X pull-ups, 2 X dips EMOM. Today I did that for 25 minutes which is the same as doing 5 X 5 of the tbdl's and 10 X 5 of pull-ups & dips. Much more time efficient in my opinion.
 
Matthieu,

Easy, Med, Hard is a combination of factors—intensity, density, volume and the combination of the variation.

Intensity meaning load—in my own training this has become 32kg easy, 36kg med, 40kg heavy.

Density—discussed here before if you doubling the time in sets (40 sets in 20 min) then the density is high and a more difficult variation and with double bells it is likely somewhere in the set every 45 seconds range. (still working that one out)

Volume—I've pushed to 60 set sessions and have found 30-40 sets to be a sweet spot. But you also have to do the math on the session.
Classic IC is 3 reps a set so 40 sets = 120 reps, add snatch and its 140. Do a rep ladder for 60 sets and you get 120 presses, 60 cleans and 60 squats = 240 reps. Traveling 2's....you get the idea

The combo of the variation—Classic IC at my easy and med intensity weights will be easier sessions (unless I push the density and then they can become medium), +Snatch takes my easy and med weight and now we have medium and hard sessions, etc.

And of course tracking RPE.

Its an ongoing coversation not a "set" rulebook IMO.
Right there is why I look at these forums. Incredible information in a few sentences.
 
As recommended by Paules and because it will build total body strength/muscle I'm sticking with trap bar deadlifts, pull-ups and dips. I do 1 X tbdl, 2 X pull-ups, 2 X dips EMOM. Today I did that for 25 minutes which is the same as doing 5 X 5 of the tbdl's and 10 X 5 of pull-ups & dips. Much more time efficient in my opinion.
Cool. What sort of loading for the TBDL?
 
There's been a few posts on alternating IC and Q&D. Has anyone played around with IC and A+A? particularily kb snatches? Or are they too similar in their benefits? meaning steady work with a moderately heavy load repeats.
I'm always fascinated with the whole 'if you could only bring one piece of equipment to a deserted island' question. My A+A snatch sized kb is the same as what I use for IC. When travelling, one could alternate IC and A+A snatch sessions using the same kb (in my case the 24k).
 
There's been a few posts on alternating IC and Q&D. Has anyone played around with IC and A+A? particularily kb snatches? Or are they too similar in their benefits? meaning steady work with a moderately heavy load repeats.
I'm always fascinated with the whole 'if you could only bring one piece of equipment to a deserted island' question. My A+A snatch sized kb is the same as what I use for IC. When travelling, one could alternate IC and A+A snatch sessions using the same kb (in my case the 24k).
That’s been the mainstay of my training for a while now. 2 days of IC, 2 days of A+A snatches and 2 days of zone 2. Covers a lot of bases.
 
There's been a few posts on alternating IC and Q&D. Has anyone played around with IC and A+A? particularily kb snatches? Or are they too similar in their benefits? meaning steady work with a moderately heavy load repeats.
I'm always fascinated with the whole 'if you could only bring one piece of equipment to a deserted island' question. My A+A snatch sized kb is the same as what I use for IC. When travelling, one could alternate IC and A+A snatch sessions using the same kb (in my case the 24k).
I'm not certain what A+A means but I've been doing HIC (High Intensity Conditioning) drills on the days between my Iron Cardio training. Stuff like hill sprints, 10 rounds of 10 KB swings 10 Burpees 1 minute rest, sprints combined with Burpees or kB swings etc. Also one day a week of Endurance training via a long run/jump rope session.
 
That’s been the mainstay of my training for a while now. 2 days of IC, 2 days of A+A snatches and 2 days of zone 2. Covers a lot of bases.

Are you doing IC without the snatch? And what's yr A&A and Z2 program look like if you have time?

Just finished IC with snatch and thinking might up the weight & sub pull-up instead of snatch, and do 2 sessions of swings and 2 runs which sounds pretty much dead on the same as you're doing.
 
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Are you doing IC without the snatch? And what's yr A&A and Z2 program look like if you have time?

Just finished IC with snatch and thinking might up the weight & sub pull-up instead of snatch, and do 2 sessions of swings and 2 runs which sounds pretty much dead on the same as you're doing.
My IC sessions are typically the standard CL-PR-FSQ or the standard with pull ups. Mostly single bell but sometimes doubles. Unstructured deadlifts sprinkled in at the end from time to time.

My A+A snatch sessions are repeats of 5 reps allowing my HR to return to 105BPM before starting next repeat. Anywhere between 20 - 50 repeats but typically 30.

Zone 2 is usually done on one of the Concept2 machines for at least 30 minutes but typically 60.

I also run or ruck 3-5 times a week commuting from work with the running mostly Z2 but sometimes Z3/4 and rucking Z1.
 
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Week 1 of Tactical Iron Cardio complete. I've decided that my conditioning training will consist of rucking/walking. I find them easy to recover from, can be done everyday, multiple times a day if wanted and leave me plenty of energy to put into my main workouts. I have upped my daily calories in an effort to try and put on some muscle. I've never really tried to gain much weight before and it will be interesting to see how it goes.
 
Today's 45 minute circuit kicked my butt because of the extreme heat. 3 rounds of:
10 minutes 16kg Kettlebell Snatch (switch hands on the minute, 10rpm)
1 minute rest
TRX Mt. Climber x 20 @ 1min
Pull-Ups: 5 @ 1min
Glute Ham Raise x 8 @ 1min
Cossack SQ: bdwt x 10 @ 1min
aug242023circuit.png
 
This was yesterday's Iron Cardio session:

1) Iron Cardio - 15 minutes at 32KG: Clean/Press/Squat then either 1 or 2 pullups: I got sixteen total sets done with 16x C/P/S and 24 Pullups
AVG HR- 142 BPM
MAX HR -170 BPM
2) A&A Swings: x5/EMOM at 32KG for 7 Minutes (only change was AVG HR was 143 BPM)
3) 1.88 kilometer ruck to our base pool
AVG HR: 140 BPM and MAX HR: 154 BPM - Right in Zone 2
4) 210 meter swim (10x 21 meter intervals)
 
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