Kettlebell KB Push Press vs Military Press

[sid]

Hi Folks,
needed some guidance here. What are the respective strengths between KB Push Press vs Military Press. When doing Pavels Ladders I've tended to use 2X24 kgs for doing Military Press and Front Squats.

I find the push press to be a more symmetrical movement between my left and right arms, While doing the Military Press I find that my left arm can make a slightly bigger arc while going up - This may lead to some tension leaking - and has caused some minor niggling neck/shoulder discomfort at times.

Fundamentally I think I need to get stronger on the Military Press before both the bells go up smoothly.

1. What is the preferred double KB press here?
2. Which is more effective for power and strength?
3. Which is more effective for hypertrophy?

Am i better of doing single KB Presses(although its not as fun and demanding as doing ladders with 2 24kg bells)

What do you folks think?

 

[Steve W.]

Single bell presses are much more forgiving of mobility restrictions and generally easier on the shoulders than doubles. So if you are having discomfort and noticing obvious asymmetry in technique, I would stick with singles.

As far as push presses vs strict presses, there are a lot of variables and no definitive answer (both are great exercises). Push presses MAY be easier on the shoulders, but poor technique on the drop of the push press can be hard on the shoulders, especially if you are push pressing a weight heavier than you would use for strict presses. Push presses can allow you to use a heavier weight and work the legs in a way that strict presses don't (for this reason I think lighter push presses are great for basketball players). Some people get a lot of carry over from push presses to strict presses, but a lot people don't. Push presses may also help you to feel more comfortable with a heavier weight that is a challenge to strict press. Effectiveness for strength and hypertrophy will depend on programming as much as the exercise.

Hope this helps.

 

[coachnathanwhite]

@sid I would say your instincts serve you well, as you fundamentally think that you need to get stronger on the MP first. I would go straight to the source material (Enter the Kettlebell) and devote the next 90-120 days of practice to the "Program Minimum" and the "The Rite of Passage."

Here is my opinion on your 3 questions:

1) Preferred DBL KB Press? Hardstyle MP. For me, this lift compliments all the other KB lifts more than the push press.

2) More effective for Power and Strength? Either can be effective depending on how you organize your sets / reps / rest periods for a focus on power or strength. It can be extremely taxing to put 100% focus into both power and strength during the same training cycle.

3) More effective for hypertrophy? DBL KB Push Press tends to offer more training stimulus for hypertrophy in my experience as you can move heavier weight.

 

[sid]

Hi @natewhite39 & @Steve W- Thank you for your insights.
I have been blazing through the program minimum with the 24kg KB's. I have been doing single hand swings with the 32kg KB and can do 100 reps in 5 mins. TGU's @24Kg 10 in under 10 mins. The sticky point for me is to get to the 24 KG KB up on rep 4 & 5 MP- specially on my left shoulder. I find the right KB goes up nice and straight, the let takes a wider arc before going up and is the point of failure for me. NO issues with cleans and Front squats. I have just been frustrated that i cant get to 5 reps easily on the MP.
Pavels book talks about C&P - but refers to the reps per arm. This is what kinda threw me off (and created some confusion )
Do i just go back and keep trying ladders with the 24kg KB's till i clear the ROP. I also feel that doing KB's and lots of pull ups may mean tighter Traps and hence i might need to deload as well.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[North Coast Miller]

This is my take,
the military press where the elbow moves out and the middle portion of the lift has the upper arm out to the side is similar in form to the barbell behind the neck press. This movement, flaring the elbow out at the commencement, isolates the front and middle deltoid heads and upper trap, and will induce possibly more shoulder hypertrophy (other factors involved) than other pressing movements.

People with shoulder issues or trying to move too much weight too quickly will have issues with this movement. Asymmetries probably more common as well.

I do not do a strict push press, but I do a straight press along the same line as the push press, mechanically more similar to the bottoms up. This drags the upper pec into the lift as well as strong activation of the middle and lower trap. It does not isolate the delts as much, so hypertrophy tends to not be as pronounced compared to power generation. I find I can do more weight with this method.

When using lighter weight to an overhead hold, I will tend to use the eccentric portion of the military press when lowering to the rack, just to get a little extra delt activation.

 

[Steve Freides]

While doing the Military Press I find that my left arm can make a slightly bigger arc while going up

This isn't a thing I'd be concerned with unless you have a reason, e.g., your FMS scores are different from side to side. One of the beauties of the MP is that each shoulder can find its own groove.

-S-

 

[Leesburgking]

1 cent - You might also consider doing some bottoms up presses. They will help you learn your optimal groove and teach you how to keep tension from the beginning to the end of your movement.

2 cents - Its also fun to use push press as a type of drop set from your regular press. Press until you cant press, then switch to push press for a few more.