Kettlebell Kettlebell Armbar
- Thread starter somanaut
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somanaut
Level 5 Valued Member
So also a shoulder mobility drill/test? A support drill for TGU? Under what conditions would you use it yourself or for students/clients? I mean, is it to correct a motor dificiency or what? Sorry for the barrage of questions. kettlebell armbar "feels good" for chest and interscapular muscles (especially rhomboids?), and I can feel muscles are working to stabilize the weight in this position. Armbar feels like it challenges adduction (retraction) of the scapula, and isn't that one of the few shoulder movements not worked in the TGU, or have I misunderstood it?
Matts
Level 3 Valued Member
it's magic for me- gets the shoulder muscles firing properly, aligns scapula, strengthens shoulder area, and helps thoracic and hip mobility. Armbar helps me get a better feeling for supporting the up arm in TGU with the lat in the different positions. All this with very light weight and low effort
coachnathanwhite
Level 6 Valued Member
@somanaut As you said, yes the Armbar just "feels good" as it opens up the anterior capsule while simultaneously firing off the posterior delt.
Like the halo and prying goblet squat, the Armbar is good movement prep for many of the movements in kettlebell training and not just T Spine mobility. Think of the body as one piece.
One specific detail to practice: activate your lat and pull the shoulder down into the correct position. Often I see the Armbar performed with a bell that is way too heavy so this detail is missed as the student uses their traps instead. Go with a 10 or 12kg.
Testing: IMO, I would not use the kettlebell armbar with a brand new student to evaluate T Spine mobility. I would use an unloaded movement such as an Original Strength reset.
Like the halo and prying goblet squat, the Armbar is good movement prep for many of the movements in kettlebell training and not just T Spine mobility. Think of the body as one piece.
One specific detail to practice: activate your lat and pull the shoulder down into the correct position. Often I see the Armbar performed with a bell that is way too heavy so this detail is missed as the student uses their traps instead. Go with a 10 or 12kg.
Testing: IMO, I would not use the kettlebell armbar with a brand new student to evaluate T Spine mobility. I would use an unloaded movement such as an Original Strength reset.
somanaut
Level 5 Valued Member
thanks for all the comments so far!
@natewhite39 about how to use it, I am NOT a coach/trainer in any regard, so was just curious if there was something I myself should be overall aware of. I understand that you would use something more gentle to start with. So you would use the armbar as a supplement to the ex. the TGU or latissimus dorsi activation (to wake it up) for ex swing?
Makes sense if I view it as similar to the goblet squats prying movement. Hadn't thought of it that way. Have tried it for 10 secs each side 1-3 times with a 16kg, felt good but hadn't thought about the latissimus dorsi activation, as you can see my thoughts were on the rhomboids (middle fibers of trapezius). Does the rhomboids switch off in horizontal abduction of the glenohumeral joint if you turn on the latissimus dorsi in this position?
@natewhite39 about how to use it, I am NOT a coach/trainer in any regard, so was just curious if there was something I myself should be overall aware of. I understand that you would use something more gentle to start with. So you would use the armbar as a supplement to the ex. the TGU or latissimus dorsi activation (to wake it up) for ex swing?
Makes sense if I view it as similar to the goblet squats prying movement. Hadn't thought of it that way. Have tried it for 10 secs each side 1-3 times with a 16kg, felt good but hadn't thought about the latissimus dorsi activation, as you can see my thoughts were on the rhomboids (middle fibers of trapezius). Does the rhomboids switch off in horizontal abduction of the glenohumeral joint if you turn on the latissimus dorsi in this position?
coachnathanwhite
Level 6 Valued Member
I would use the Armbar / Bent Armbar in concert with the TGU and / or Bent Press as an accessory exercise. Spice on the main course. I would not typically pair it with swings other than just as general movement prep based on the students needs.
No, the rhomboids will be active when depressing and retracting the scapula into an optimal position during the Armbar. The lats do not inhibit this function.
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jhpowers
Level 6 Valued Member
Strangely, the Arm Bar creates all kinds of problems in my left shoulder. I am currently doing TGUs in S&S with the 24kg bell without problems, but when I add in the Arm Bar, I get shoulder pain. I think that my Left shoulder is somehow rotated more inwardly than my left and when the Arm Bar "Opens up the anterior capsule" I get laxity in the joint and pain on the following day. I don't quite understand why the get up doesn't cause the same problem.
coachnathanwhite
Level 6 Valued Member
@jhpowers More than likely this is a shoulder packing issue. Much easier to pack the shoulder during the TGU with the assistance of gravity.
Do you have a copy of Enter the Kettlebell? Check out the tutorial for the "Wedge" drill using a doorway. Get familiar with the feeling in your shoulder during the drill then practice the Armbar with a light bell.
Another drill, practice the Armbar with a partner instead of using a kettlebell. Get into position and then have your partner apply easy downward pressure to your arm so you can then pull down with your lat into a comfortable and packed position.
Do you have a copy of Enter the Kettlebell? Check out the tutorial for the "Wedge" drill using a doorway. Get familiar with the feeling in your shoulder during the drill then practice the Armbar with a light bell.
Another drill, practice the Armbar with a partner instead of using a kettlebell. Get into position and then have your partner apply easy downward pressure to your arm so you can then pull down with your lat into a comfortable and packed position.
Not all benefits are muscular. The arm bar teaches one to proprioceptively find vertical - that's a good and useful thing.
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offwidth
Level 10 Valued Member
My left shoulder and upper arm are a bit jacked up. A naked TGU hurts like heck, a 16kg bell not so much, a 24kg feels great
coachnathanwhite
Level 6 Valued Member
coachnathanwhite
Level 6 Valued Member
@offwidth Ok, the biceps tendon impingement explains why the 24 feels good. The weight is basically forcing you into proper alignment or the pain would be intense.
I have seen this with bodybuilders before where the heavy stuff feels good, until something eventually breaks. Do you have a rehab protocol from a PT?
I have seen this with bodybuilders before where the heavy stuff feels good, until something eventually breaks. Do you have a rehab protocol from a PT?
offwidth
Level 10 Valued Member
@natewhite39 thanks for the info...
I have a script and am working on getting something set up. Catch is I am on the road until January so it will need to wait until then. And until then, I just plan on taking it as easy as I can.
I have a script and am working on getting something set up. Catch is I am on the road until January so it will need to wait until then. And until then, I just plan on taking it as easy as I can.
Shahaf Levin
Level 5 Valued Member
+1 for all of @natewhite39 and @Steve Freides advice. And one more thing I learned here about the armbar (and that made it way more effective) - it is not a pec stretch...
@offwidth , I have a torn labrum accompanied with dislocated bicep tendon on my right shoulder. PT rehab did allot of good things. When I started bent pressing I found some T-spine / scapular compensation I ingrained. Bent pressing pretty much forced me to repattern my movement and use proper alignment of sequencing or my right shoulder bicep tendon would "click" all around and hurt the next day. So basically what I'm saying is when you rehabbing keep assessing your entire movement pallet and make sure your not compensating. As you probably figured out I prefer to use movements with high mobility-stability-control demand for that purpose
@offwidth , I have a torn labrum accompanied with dislocated bicep tendon on my right shoulder. PT rehab did allot of good things. When I started bent pressing I found some T-spine / scapular compensation I ingrained. Bent pressing pretty much forced me to repattern my movement and use proper alignment of sequencing or my right shoulder bicep tendon would "click" all around and hurt the next day. So basically what I'm saying is when you rehabbing keep assessing your entire movement pallet and make sure your not compensating. As you probably figured out I prefer to use movements with high mobility-stability-control demand for that purpose
offwidth
Level 10 Valued Member
Good points. Thank you. I will heed your advice. I had my right labrum surgically repaired a few years back... fun times.+1 for all of @natewhite39 and @Steve Freides advice. And one more thing I learned here about the armbar (and that made it way more effective) - it is not a pec stretch...
@offwidth , I have a torn labrum accompanied with dislocated bicep tendon on my right shoulder. PT rehab did allot of good things. When I started bent pressing I found some T-spine / scapular compensation I ingrained. Bent pressing pretty much forced me to repattern my movement and use proper alignment of sequencing or my right shoulder bicep tendon would "click" all around and hurt the next day. So basically what I'm saying is when you rehabbing keep assessing your entire movement pallet and make sure your not compensating. As you probably figured out I prefer to use movements with high mobility-stability-control demand for that purpose
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