Kettlebell Kettlebell Rows

[somanaut]

Yes, I think I get it. I am not sure if this is the "right" answer but my approach on this tends to be simple. Anti-shrug - pull the shoulders down towards your hips. Shoulder away from ear. Practice when doing swings, especially the top of the swing, and get-ups (every position, every transition). Don't overthink it.

One other place to practice is push-ups. Lots of people tend to let the shoulder shrug up towards the ear as they lower down in a push-up. This is a hard pattern to correct (from personal experience, and some of my students), but with practice can be done and will help the shoulders behave better overall.

Maybe there's more to it... I'm certainly willing to consider other inputs myself if people have them. I know my right shoulder still has a tendency to misbehave (shrug up) when I don't pay attention... when bench pressing, when riding a bike, and various other things.

And, yes, t-spine extension is also related... good catch, @Shahaf Levin.

Thanks Anna will focus on that.

 

[North Coast Miller]

I wouldn't recommend doing these with a lot of weight, but you could pass a towel through your KB handle and do some upright rows, hands about a foot along on either side and don't pull your elbows higher than your jaw.

I don't think there is any lift that better isolates the scapula and retracts and depresses them in roughly equal portions.

 

[conor78]

Check out Taco Fleur's Gorilla Rows...lethal

 

[Shahaf Levin]

Is straight arm bar a good model of t-spine rotation? Is the camera angle usefull? That is my more stiff side.

The arm bar is a good drill to develop t-spine extension/rotation and scapular stability. However, since the load is an awareness tool and assist better movement I prefer that the ROM screen would be unloaded. FMS shoulder mobility screen If you can get, t-spine 3 way (@Anna C had a video showing it), tall kneeling contra-lateral rotations and such are better to see true ROM.

If you still go with the arm bar to test then video from to of your head as well, it will help see if you shoulders are aligned.

The arm bar inithe video look OK, have you tried bent arm bars? That for me was the real game changer

EDIT: try adding some shoulder rotations to the straight arm bar

 

[User 4484]

Well... it depends.

Generally I either do ladders (*) or follow a simple 5x5 program.

(*) 3x(1,2,3), or 3x(2,4,6), or if I feel brave enough, 3x(3,6,9).

But lately I’ve been experimenting with something more work capacity oriented.

The progression would be something like this: each line is a different session.

Week One: this week is EXTREMELY NOT CHALLENGING on purpose.
1 rep on the minute, for 1 minute.

1 rep on the minute, for 2 minutes.

1 rep on the minute, for 3 minutes.

Week Two:
2 reps on the minute, for 1 minute.

2 reps on the minute, for 2 minutes.

2 reps on the minute, for 3 minutes.

Week Three:
3 reps on the minute, for 1 minute.

3 reps on the minute, for 2 minutes.

3 reps on the minute, for 3 minutes.


Now, it starts to get interesting.


Week Four:
1 rep on the minute, for 2 minutes.

1 rep on the minute, for 4 minutes.

1 rep on the minute, for 6 minutes.


Week Five:
2 reps on the minute, for 2 minutes.

2 reps on the minute, for 4 minutes.

2 reps on the minute, for 6 minutes.


Week Six:
3 reps on the minute, for 2 minutes.

3 reps on the minute, for 4 minutes.

3 reps on the minute, for 6 minutes.


And this is where real fun begins.


Week Seven:

1 rep on the minute, for 3 minutes.

1 rep on the minute, for 6 minutes.

1 rep on the minute, for 9 minutes.


Week Eight:

2 reps on the minute, for 3 minutes.

2 reps on the minute, for 6 minutes.

2 reps on the minute, for 9 minutes.


Week Nine:

3 reps on the minute, for 3 minutes.

3 reps on the minute, for 6 minutes.

3 reps on the minute, for 9 minutes.


The week starts with very low volume and it keeps increasing each session. Each week’s first session has a significantly lower volume than the previous week’s last session.

This is on purpose, so you can start fresh each week and work your way up in a sustainable fashion.

Since you only do singles, doubles or triples, good form is possible to maintain at all times and rest periods, albeit insufficent, are adequate for the strength-endurance building purpose I’m currently chasing.

Interesting way to program. Haven't seen that before. Like the progression!

 

[Marc]

I think you cannnot really go wrong with adding some rows to any programme.
They balance out all the pushing and are very useful in gereral since most people spend a lot of time sitting and hunched over.
I also don't see how they might be detrimental to any routine.

 

[guardian7]

They are a staple, must-do movement IMHO. I most often do them from a low hinge/DL posture, aligned over the non load-bearing leg. With a real heavy or awkward load (sandbag) I will place a support hand on that knee, otherwise I prefer to float the upper body.

Scapular retraction - I visualize grinding my upper arm across the curve of my rib cage. Have learned to limit almost entirely the amount of bicep recruited and let the arm suspend from elbow to hand.

Have also been known to pass a towel through a couple of KBs and do them as a bent row w/ two hands.

I agree. Lack of rowing movements may be the only hole I can find in the standard approach to KB work. I join a gym once a year in the winter and do cable rows and face pulls every workout to make up for neglecting it the rest of the year.

 

[guardian7]

Does anyone use kettlebell rows? I know that TTC uses the renegade row, but that is not a move I am strong enough to even try yet. But what about standard bent over rows? Reason why I am asking is, that I am trying to be better at shoulder packing, but perhaps I need a specific drill to address this. Rows focus (as I see it) on scapular retraction. Thoughts?

It may be one of the few holes in the standard approach to KB work. Yes, definately, especially if you do a lot of pressing and pushups. Pullups are not enough. A few people here, maybe Karen Smith?, has mentioned that the risk/reward for renegade rows is not rational. A row you can load heavier just by taking a second to stand up but a potentially serious wrist injury. Do bottoms up rows for wrist work I suggest. Kind of like box jumps. Great exercise, but ...

 

[the hansenator]

A few people here, maybe Karen Smith?, has mentioned that the risk/reward for renegade rows is not rational....

I like to do renegade rows one side at a time with my other hand on a box. It's a lot more stable and seems safe enough. It's actually more of an ab exercise and I feel it's been beneficial to me.

 

[guardian7]

I like to do renegade rows one side at a time with my other hand on a box. It's a lot more stable and seems safe enough. It's actually more of an ab exercise and I feel it's been beneficial to me.

That seems like a sensible compromise.

 

[Sauli]

Great back exercise. I really feel those in my lats. Presses, pushups and rows are basically all you need for decent upperbody....

 

[watchnerd]

I like Kettlebell Rows. You can use a pretty decent amount of load and still great for learning tension through your midsection. Pro tip from an instructor for single row (from a lunge position): Pull the kettlebell straight into your pocket. Make sure you use the lat!

I just tried them this way, with the 'row into your pocket' or 'row in an arc' cue.

WHOA....waaaaay harder.

And kind of freaky. I was using a modest 16 kg bell....and yet I barbell row with anywhere between 5x-10x that weight, depending upon if I'm trying to be explosive (Pendlay row) vs strict.

I'm a big gobsmacked.

 

[guardian7]

Does anyone use kettlebell rows? I know that TTC uses the renegade row, but that is not a move I am strong enough to even try yet. But what about standard bent over rows? Reason why I am asking is, that I am trying to be better at shoulder packing, but perhaps I need a specific drill to address this. Rows focus (as I see it) on scapular retraction. Thoughts?

If you are in a health club, I also recommend cable seated rows with a pause at each rep. Focus on mind muscle connection rather than weight. Cable rows and face pulls are the only two exercises where I think machines are really valuable. With supplementary tricep work as well. Basically, they are good for filling in the very few holes in KB work. For many people, their bell weight is not enough for a challenging row weight. I do prefer the KB or dumbell row to the barbell row.

You could also try the crucifix stretch or holds with very light dumbells or kettlebells. There are also many types of band pull aparts that are good for shoulder health. As they say the shoulder is complex and retraction is only one function.

 

[Richm76]

Tony Gentilcore recently had an article on correcting the shoulders on his website. Lots of good ideas to get the shoulders working and stuff you could easily add to a routine/warmup.