Ladders question

Mirek

Quadruple-Digit Post Count
@Mark Kidd it's not 1.5 hour each time but as you progress they are getting longer, yes
Also, ROP can be done 3 times a week, i.e. without variety days
 

Steve W.

Quadruple-Digit Post Count
RoP is awesome but with a 15 month old I don't have 1.5 hours to work out.
Near the end of the sequence, heavy press days can take a long time. However, that's not the norm throughout the progression. Some factors that make it more workable without a long dedicated block of time (including a lot of points made by previous posters):

--Most sessions aren't that long. Medium and light days, and heavy days earlier in the progression are much shorter.

--Press ladders are only done 3 days a week, so you don't need to make time every day.

--You can split your heavy day swings to another day that would otherwise be a variety day. I've used ROP quite a bit and more often than not did the heavy day swings on a separate day (not by the book, but...).

--As others have pointed out, rest periods can be flexible. You can spread the work out throughout the day, doing a set at a time in spare moments (a great option with a challenging bell, if your situation allows it logistically) or you can use a bell that allows more condensed rest periods (especially if your goal is hypertrophy or to consolidate gains with a bell you have already used for the progression with longer rests).

Obviously you don't HAVE to do ROP, but there are ways to make it work. It's a press-focused program that emphasizes volume, so you're going to do a lot of pressing, but it does not REQUIRE 1.5 hr sessions.
 
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Questionfear

Double-Digit Post Count
Wow. Really that long between rungs eh? I was always under the impression that the "rest" periods were while the other arm was working. I would take 5-6 minutes between sets of ladders, but nowhere near the between-rung rest you guys did. This could actually be a huge reason I had to stop ROP as I felt I was just getting beat up with the 20kg.

How long does a full session take of five rungs, 90 minutes?
I don't do a ton of rest between rungs either; for the lighter days I barely rest between rungs and on heavier days I just give it a minute until my muscles are calmer. I figure if I hit a point where I'm not resting enough between rungs then I will extend it.
 

Kettlebelephant

Quadruple-Digit Post Count
@Mark Kidd take a 10-12RM and work on density. You probably won't gain as much strength as with a 5-8RM, but your sessions are much, much faster and I think you won't mind the little extra hypertrophy that comes with compressing rest times :)
 

Mark Kidd

More than 500 posts
@Mark Kidd take a 10-12RM and work on density. You probably won't gain as much strength as with a 5-8RM, but your sessions are much, much faster and I think you won't mind the little extra hypertrophy that comes with compressing rest times :)
Nah. I just want strength. I'm just wanting to add strength. I'm 105 kg as is.
 

Steve Freides

Forum Administrator
Senior Certified Instructor
@Mark Kidd, the ROP is a high volume program. If you don't have the time for it, there's nothing wrong with either you or the program; it's just not a good fit for you for now.

There is no one-size-fits-all for these things. There are times when doing 20 sets over the course of 8 hours is the right approach, and others when two sets of 5 is all you want. It all depends on your goals and how the program's design approaches achieving them.

-S-
 

Baker

Triple-Digit Post Count
Breathing Ladders are an approach that works for some people between rungs. It reinforces proper breathing technique...sort of like a breathing super set.

1 press left, 1 press right, 1 deep breath
2 press left, 2 press right, 2 deep breaths
Etc.

Once you get complete "5" take 2-5 minutes and repeat for the desired number of ladders.
 

Mirek

Quadruple-Digit Post Count
@Mark Kidd To give you something constructive, here's the 12 week pressing plan, Soviet style:
1) Numbers are total reps per arm of military press (or clean and press) for a given day
2) You train 3-5 time a week
3) If you use your 6 RM bell, attain the total daily reps by combination of sets of 2,3, and 4
4) If you use your 8 RM bell, attain the total daily reps by combination of sets of 3,4, and 5
5) If you use your 10 RM bell, attain the total daily reps by combination of sets of 4,5, and 6

Day/Week 1. 2. 3. 4.
Mon 8 10 14 14
Tue 10 20 10 -
Wed - - 18 6
Thu 6 12 8 -
Fri 16 18 20 10
Day/Week 5. 6. 7. 8.
Mon 12 6 18 16
Tue 18 - 10 8
Wed - 14 20 6
Thu 20 - 8 -
Fri 10 10 14 10
Day/Week 9. 10. 11. 12.
Mon 20 14 6 14
Tue 18 10 8 -
Wed - 8 - 6
Thu 12 20 16 -
Fri 10 18 10 10

EDIT: Converted to table to make it more readable.
 
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Steve Freides

Forum Administrator
Senior Certified Instructor
Ladies and Gentlemen,

I removed a post here because it contained proprietary information from one of our experimental protocols.

While we do not want that information posted publicly now, we do want everyone to be aware that you can apply to participate in the testing process by contacting Craig Marker, @CMarker, here on the forum via private message or by any other means, e.g., emailing him at StrongFirst. When you apply and if you are accepted, your acceptance will be contingent upon agreeing to keep things private until such point as StrongFirst decides to publish them.

Thanks, everyone.

-S-
 

Mirek

Quadruple-Digit Post Count
Ladies and Gentlemen,

I removed a post here because it contained proprietary information from one of our experimental protocols.

While we do not want that information posted publicly now, we do want everyone to be aware that you can apply to participate in the testing process by contacting Craig Marker, @CMarker, here on the forum via private message or by any other means, e.g., emailing him at StrongFirst. When you apply and if you are accepted, your acceptance will be contingent upon agreeing to keep things private until such point as StrongFirst decides to publish them.

Thanks, everyone.

-S-
Just to make it clear - I did not ever participate in any of the experimental programs of SF.

I got the idea of the program by combining the wisdom from here: From Simple to Sinister: Waving Volume on S&S
and here: The Origins of StrongFirst Programming: The Soviet System. Both of these are freely available on the SF webpages.
I simply scaled down the published volume for swings by order of magnitude (2000 reps in press someone?) to 200 per four weeks,
i.e. average of 50 reps per week and then used the recommended reps 1/3 - 2/3 of your 70 - 80 % RM as Soviets did. That's all.

I did not intend to publish anything proprietary from SF simply because I do not know anything proprietary.
 
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