all posts post new thread

Barbell Large jump DL

  • Thread starter Deleted member 5559
  • Start date
Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)

Deleted member 5559

Guest
What programs are good for jumps of 40-50 lbs? I have 45 and 25 lb plates. Adding a set of the heavier weight similar to KB jumping?
 
Sounds like you need a good step cycle, but I don't know of (nor could I find) any that are set up for the deadlift at those increments. I mean, it would essentially just be working up to a high volume with a given weight, then dropping the volume while you throw on the next set of plates, and then working on increasing volume again. 40 and 50 pounds jumps are pretty big, but I'm sure you could get it to work; I just don't know if someone has written something for it. If I had to do something like that I think I would use 20 and 30 pound jumps. Of course, if you bought a couple 10 pound plates, you could do 20 and 30 pound jumps. But you still wouldn't have program.

If you could vary the depth, I suppose you could work up to a high volume from a deficit, then drop the volume and ROM while increasing weight, then start increasing volume. From there, cycle the volume a few times, increasing ROM each cycle. Still not an actual program.
 
50lbs jumps sounds allot for deadlift... but that doesn't mean it can't be done. Less options is mostly a good thing :)

I have a few suggestions, but they are based on reading and not experience. All of them are on my "to try list"

KB-ish approach
What you said... let the volume do the talking and add heavier sets when possible

Justa's singles
If you can load a bar to around you 70% give one of his singles program a chance. The daily singles call for a weight change every 2 weeks, but you will probably get away with not doing it (or increasing the volume?). The every-other-day singles call for a small weight increase every workout, but maybe a @Iron Tamer approach of increasing the volume like the Double Press programs from the blog or the Justafied singles from Taming the Bent Press might work...

Progressive ROM
As suggested earlier here.

Regressive reverse bands
Used the reverse band / lightened method (WSB), load the bar heavy and reduce the band assistance with time. I actually tried it a little bit a while back with good results. It definitely makes heavy weight looks less intimidating.

What ever you do, I am interested and will follow you results :)
 
Last edited:
For most people and most purposes, those jumps might be too big. Not using the 2.5 lb plates and maybe not the 5 lb. plates will keep your jumps to 20 lbs. minimum.

-S-
 
Snowman said:
If you could vary the depth, I suppose you could work up to a high volume from a deficit, then drop the volume and ROM while increasing weight, then start increasing volume. From there, cycle the volume a few times, increasing ROM each cycle. Still not an actual program.
Click to expand...

I don't know what you mean by "an actual program", but progressive movement training is a very powerful method that both Paul Anderson and Bob Peoples used, and Pavel gives good guidelines to follow in Beyond Bodybuilding.

@Bro Mo, is there a particular reason why getting some smaller plates would be difficult? And for what it's worth, there is this article by Dan John: The Big 5 of Getting Big | T Nation
 
@kodo kb when I think of a program, I think of detailed sets, reps, percentages, etc. I don't know if there's one of those kinds of programs out there. However, it would appear that there are a few potential training methods to be used if @Bro Mo wants to start experimenting. Personally, I love super simple programs, so I'm interested to see what happens.
 
I train the deadlift in 45's and 25's, but I do use fractional plates also. It is instinctual to me.

135x5, 185x5, 225x4, 275x4, 315x3, 365x3, 405x2, 455x2, 495x1, 545x1, 365xAMRAP, 315xAMRAP

That is a typical amount of work for my main lift of the day. Add a rep each training session. Do your back off work how ever you feel, not necessarily AMRAP.
 
@kodo kb It's not hard to get them, I just have never tried not using them, and I want to experiment with it. I'm wondering if something like the fighter pull-up protocol could work. Could start at the 3RM schedule then to the 5RM schedule, then add the next set of plates and start over. Otherwise, I feel like deficit deadlifts would be the way to go. Maybe combine the two and start over at a new deficit a few times before adding weight.
 
I think I'm gonna willingly adopt the plate size limitation for the next 2 - 3 deadlift cycles.

After some more reading of Never Let Go I feel that less option in decision making might be better...

My last two cycles where Dan John's Simple Strength (5 days a week easy lifting and 3 time in 2 weeks of heavy-ish lifting). I kept thinking if I can add 10kg in easy days or 5kg on heavy days and tried to figure out how to account for beach volleyball in total volume. That, combined with probably not eating enough left me with a mediocre cycle, lifting to heavy when tired and to light when fresh. If I would only use 10kg and 20kg plates there were no useless dilemma. 20kg weight increases makes for simple decisions.

Prior to these 2 cycle I did 4 weeks of 2-3 Easy Strength sessions a week. Going over my journal I saw a 3x3 day of:
@70kg + green band x 3
@75kg + green band x 3
@77.5kg + green band x 3​

Really??? Is that seemed to me like a worthwhile use of brain cells and time loading the bar?
On limit weights? yeah, 2.5kg - 5kg can be huge. On percent based programs? sure, follow the numbers.
But in a park-bench easy-strength opportunistic approach???
Gonna use 20kg and 10kg plates, maybe also 5kg plates... Maybe...
 
@Bro Mo AMRAP for me is Almost As Many Reps As Possible. As a general rule I try not to fail reps, and stop short of technical breakdown.

Generally AMRAP is back off work, assistance exercises, and finisher exercises or circuits for me.

Strongman type exercises like carry medleys, loading medleys, keg bottoms up or mixed grip clean and press, sandbag shouldering, and pressing medleys are a workout themselves and the weights are set. Generally odd object training.

Kettlebell swings, snatches, goblet squats, and circuits work as AMRAP workouts for me. I used to do long sessions aiming for 100 get ups. Once a month I would do 100 get ups with 24kg in singles, and eventually 1-2-3 ladders. Sessions generally lasted about 90 min.

Nothing but AMRAP? No, I always do a thorough warmup and
5-10 cool down.
 


Hate to thread jack but in a video Pavel said for men 10kg plates are the smallest we should be using -- that would mean 40 lb jumps in weight. Anyone have any guidelines?
 
In the video, he says 5 kg plates are OK.

The principle he explains is that increasing the volume with a lower weight is a strategy not only born of necessity, it's also beneficial because increasing training volume with moderately heavy weights is key to long-term success.

One can and should make an exception if one is using a trusted program where specific percentages are given and you need smaller plates to hit the right number on the bar. E.g. even though my deadlift maxes at around 350 lbs., I still make large jumps in weight, but if my program calls for exactly 300 lbs, that means I need a 2-1/2 lb. plate on each end of the bar, so that's what I do - some of the time; at other times, I'll round to the nearest weight that lets me use 5 lb. or 10 lb. plates. The closer I am to my 1RM, the more careful I'll be about matching the exact weights, e.g. for a 75% weight, I'll just get close enough and not worry if I'm a percentage point or two on one side or the other.

Another example - when ramping/warming up, use 45's and 25's (in lbs., the equivalent would be 10 kg) plates. For me, if I was warming up like most folks, that would mean 135, then 225, then 275. (I don't bother - I start with 275, my 75% weight.)

Hope that helps.

-S-
 
Steve Freides said:
In the video, he says 5 kg plates are OK.

The principle he explains is that increasing the volume with a lower weight is a strategy not only born of necessity, it's also beneficial because increasing training volume with moderately heavy weights is key to long-term success.

One can and should make an exception if one is using a trusted program where specific percentages are given and you need smaller plates to hit the right number on the bar. E.g. even though my deadlift maxes at around 350 lbs., I still make large jumps in weight, but if my program calls for exactly 300 lbs, that means I need a 2-1/2 lb. plate on each end of the bar, so that's what I do - some of the time; at other times, I'll round to the nearest weight that lets me use 5 lb. or 10 lb. plates. The closer I am to my 1RM, the more careful I'll be about matching the exact weights, e.g. for a 75% weight, I'll just get close enough and not worry if I'm a percentage point or two on one side or the other.

Another example - when ramping/warming up, use 45's and 25's (in lbs., the equivalent would be 10 kg) plates. For me, if I was warming up like most folks, that would mean 135, then 225, then 275. (I don't bother - I start with 275, my 75% weight.)

Hope that helps.

-S-
Click to expand...

It does - my confusion lies, I suppose, when you're at a relatively low weight - single 45lb ers on each side of a 7 foot bar. The amount of the increment affects the waving strategy and those steps are a decreasing percentage of base weight as your poundage climbs.

Its useful to remember, though, that 5 kg is really 10+lbs, so that means 20+ lb steps at a minimum.
 
@Benedictine Monk, use your judgement. Our main point here is to avoid things like adding 5 lbs. to the bar and considering it a heavier weight. Even with 135 lbs., you can go to 145 lbs. next.

-S-
 
Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
Back
Top Bottom