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Other/Mixed Lifting weights bad for boxing?

Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
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Easy strength type of lifting, deadlift, bench press, full contact twist - great for boxers. I guess it depends on the exercise selection and programming.
 
I have no contribution except to thank you for the article. I've also always heard that lifting won't make you slow or stiff (although logically, I feel like it must to an extent), so it's cool to hear another side of the story with some reasonable arguments.
 
There are some good points in this article.

Power is force x speed. In boxing term, it means being able to display strength in the shortest time. If you have strength but no speed, you are going to push, not snap : no power. On this, I am with him. On the other hand, if you have no strength, you have nothing to display: you simply cannot have power.

The thing is that the author was a powerlifter, who was very strong when he started boxing, but probably had not worked on explositivity. Hence the pushing/snapping explanation.
I would be tented to write him "Lifting weights is not bad for your boxing. The way you lifts weights is".

A good strength program for fighters should make you stronger than your competition (almost quoting Easy strength...), not as strong as a powerlifter. Maybe this is what the author is missing.
 
Freddie Roach (Pacquiao's trainer) has been quite vocal about not using weight training for smaller boxers. He believes it slows them down. I have seen a couple of pictures of Pacquiao doing a trap-bar deadlift. My own thought is that deadlifts and squats, down sparingly, shouldn't interfere with hand speed that much but would improve leg strength significantly and probably assist to keep a fighter on his feet during bad moments
 
I would believe that for smaller boxers it would have mixed benefits, heavier boxers I'd imagine there to be great benefit as only speed work is not going to cover all the bases. If you are doing bodyweight, you could be doing resistance - is all the same depending on how it is structured. How do these trainers feel about bodyweight resistance?

For the smaller boxers it probably adds not so much. The amount of motor recruitment drops off as the speed of a limb increases. For punching only the acceleration phase is important when it comes to strength, technique will have the boxer reducing antagonistic muscle activation for max inertia into the target. Only a small amount of muscular activation is needed to stiffen/stabilize the limb somewhat upon impact.

I imagine the heavier boxer would need some weight training to get the most acceleration and endurance with the larger mass.

That said, all in all I agree with the OP linked article for the most part - the reasoning is sound. But some intelligent periodizing should prevent the sorts of issues the author experienced. Either way, heavy weight training is probably contraindicated unless someone is deliberately trying to gain weight.

From the article;
I’m not saying you can’t ever lift weights for boxing.
I’m only saying: “lifting heavy weights will not increase punching power”.

Folks I emulated who could throw heavy lumber didn't lift weights, but they did a ton of bodyweight training and isometrics. It isn't how far the bag (or your opponent) moves after they've been hit, its how far your fist sinks into the target before it begins to move.
 
Enjoying this thread as I recently found out I suck at throwing strikes and would like to improve. Has anyone read the book "Parting the Clouds - The Science of the Martial Arts"?
 
I think "lifting weights" is a too broad a statement. If we take lifting weights literally, weightlifting is all about power. Powerlifting, ironically, not so much so.

I think strength is an attribute that is generally necessary in certain amounts to be a successful boxer. The amount varies. As does the best tool to achieve the necessary strength for peak performance.
 
Wesker11 said:
Enjoying this thread as I recently found out I suck at throwing strikes and would like to improve. Has anyone read the book "Parting the Clouds - The Science of the Martial Arts"?
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Bruce Lee's Tao of Jeet Kune Do is a great resource for breaking down punching power. Nothing like a good sparring partner or teacher though.

I had a couple of good instructors, one of whom could toss in shots so fast and hard my hands would start shaking after holding the focus mits for anything more than a couple of rounds.

I learned a lot from him in a short time. At one point when I had my bag and wooden dummy set up in a detached garage, the wife told me she could feel the vibration from my body shots in the house, close to 20 ft away.

Keep in mind, the human wrist is not made to support punching "as hard as possible" any more than the skull is meant to absorb hits, and high impact training can adversely effect your future joint integrity - even with perfect form. Bare knucklers only hit about 50-70% power.
 
I find this type of thread fascinating. I fear it will end up in the same basket as cardio vs strength. Personally I think kettlebells have a lot to offer boxers particularly the TGU and swing. Old school boxing coaches are still wary of engaging with the barbell and seem to prefer bodyweight exercises to target strength endurance. I have boxed and when I was I rarely lifted heavy weight. I am bigger and stronger at 39 than I was at 29 but I'd still say my 29 self would box my ears off. Sparring and drilling of skills/combos trump strength in my experience...
 
Perhaps the most important distinction to draw is between GPP and sport-specific training. Weight lifting for a boxer is GPP and as such isn't intended to be sport-specific or address any specific sports attribute.

-S-
 
North Coast Miller said:
Bruce Lee's Tao of Jeet Kune Do is a great resource for breaking down punching power. Nothing like a good sparring partner or teacher though.

I had a couple of good instructors, one of whom could toss in shots so fast and hard my hands would start shaking after holding the focus mits for anything more than a couple of rounds.

I learned a lot from him in a short time. At one point when I had my bag and wooden dummy set up in a detached garage, the wife told me she could feel the vibration from my body shots in the house, close to 20 ft away.

Keep in mind, the human wrist is not made to support punching "as hard as possible" any more than the skull is meant to absorb hits, and high impact training can adversely effect your future joint integrity - even with perfect form. Bare knucklers only hit about 50-70% power.
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Thanks for the recommendation, I will put it on my list. I went ahead and ordered the book I mentioned earlier, so I will read that first. I do have an instructor, but I am pretty new to Martial Arts.
 
I see how there can be misconceptions, especially when it is viewed as lifting weights=bench press. I read an article translated by Dr. Yessis from a Soviet study done on boxers where they found that arm extension only contributed around 24-25% to punching power, and the rest came from trunk rotation and rear leg extension (I imagine this is a straight/cross). Focusing on bench pressing would yield a rather small ROI. On the other hand I once saw Pacquiao at the Wild Card training for Cotto, and every punch he threw during shadowboxing I heard a hard stomp on the ring. Leg power maybe? Because his calves were rather large.

I had a very short professional boxing career in the Philippines, and my coach did make me lift weights but only after about 3 years of training; if I remember correctly it was only 3 sets of barbell Squats 2-3 times a week, and only AFTER all my training was done. I think the biggest issue with mixing weights with boxing is the amount of time spent lifting weights that could have been spent boxing. Boxing is a skill sport, and more often than not skill prevails over strength. If one uses lifting weights to balance out all the repetitive movements performed during practice, I believe it would be very beneficial. But otherwise, we all have limited time and recovery, and if boxing is the priority, time must primarily be spent boxing. Keep the goal the goal.

@Mark Limbaga works with the RP Boxing Team. I'm sure he will have some valuable insight on this.
 
How has nobody mentioned Fast & Loose or Relax Into Stretch? I mean, the article has a point, but it's wrong-headed with regards to weight lifting.

Strength helps. Relaxation helps. Both of these are just aspects of learning how to train and turn your tension dial.
 
Lifting weights, calisthenics = gpp

bag/mitt drills, sparring and sparring drills= spp

I am willing to wager that given two new novices to boxing with equal size, the one who lifts will hit harder 9 out of 10 times.
 
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