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Other/Mixed Little sleep training

Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
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Slatersan

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My work and school schedule is a bit all over the place. There are a few days where I don’t get a lot of sleep. Would it be best to just rest on these days? Or do some kind of light training any ways? What is the best approach to this?

Thanks
 
There is a lot of missing information in your question....

What is not ‘a lot of sleep’?

What type of training do you do?

What are your goals and training aspirations?

What is your age?

How does your body normally recover / respond to ‘low sleep’ situations?

Some folks seem to get by on 6hrs, others need much more.

It does seem to be generally accepted that more (within reason) is better than less when it comes to sleep and hard training...
 
My work and school schedule is a bit all over the place. There are a few days where I don’t get a lot of sleep. Would it be best to just rest on these days? Or do some kind of light training any ways? What is the best approach to this?

Thanks
I’m doing S and S. If I have a night where the baby keeps me up every 2 hours and everything is just bad in general I find that a quick session with the 16 and not the 24 (working weight) actually makes me feel better. And the days I don’t do anything about half way through the day I think “I really COULD have done something”.
But it’s a fine line sometimes differentiating a need to recover for another day vs general exhaustion. Usually in my first 2 sets of swings I can tell what’s what.
 
I’m doing S and S. If I have a night where the baby keeps me up every 2 hours and everything is just bad in general I find that a quick session with the 16 and not the 24 (working weight) actually makes me feel better. And the days I don’t do anything about half way through the day I think “I really COULD have done something”.
But it’s a fine line sometimes differentiating a need to recover for another day vs general exhaustion. Usually in my first 2 sets of swings I can tell what’s what.
Awesome. Thanks man.
 
There is a lot of missing information in your question....

What is not ‘a lot of sleep’?

What type of training do you do?

What are your goals and training aspirations?

What is your age?

How does your body normally recover / respond to ‘low sleep’ situations?

Some folks seem to get by on 6hrs, others need much more.

It does seem to be generally accepted that more (within reason) is better than less when it comes to sleep and hard training...
One of my days I can only get a max of 6 hours but sometimes it’s hard to wind down to even get near that. Like last night was about 2-3 hours.

I am 34.

I mostly am a bjj athlete with some Muay Thai in there. My main goal is being the best I can be at bjj. I have been training bjj for four years. Muay Thai 3 years before that. Now both. Bjj I do 3 - 5 times a week. Muay Thai 1-2. S & C 2-3 x a week. 1 rest day a week.

I have been doing easy strength type workouts 2-3 x a week. Following a combat sport version from Dan John. I just received a 32 kg kettlebell so I will be working towards timed simple. I have done timeless several times.

I have several old injuries that will start bothering me if I consistently train with lack of sleep. Not so much an issue if its once in a while.

So with that said the question is more if I get low sleep once a week should i just take the day as a rest day? Like does it benefit me to even train if I didnt sleep well to train? I was also looking for others own experience with the same issue.
 
If it were me I would take a ‘rest’ day. For me that doesn’t necessarily mean no training; but something not as intense as planned, or maybe just mobility work. Today is a perfect example: I was all set to go for a 2+ hour ride this morning, but I slept poorly. I opted to not ride, but I still did my other training.
 
My work and school schedule is a bit all over the place. There are a few days where I don’t get a lot of sleep. Would it be best to just rest on these days? Or do some kind of light training any ways? What is the best approach to this?

Thanks

Interesting subject, and as Brian stated everyone is different. I worked for 37 years without a schedule. So I might have a day where I wasn't "supposed" to work until the next morning, so I do a hard workout. Go to bed by 10 pm and 30 min. later the phone would ring. By the time I'd get home two days later I knew it would take probably two days to recover from that. But maybe I get a four hour nap and then head to the gym for a light workout. I can honestly tell you that once in a great while once I got started those ended up being great workouts.

Here is what I did notice over that career as far as training went. It and a poor nutrition schedule probably kept me from ever really reaching my potential. Those two things over time probably had more to do with feeling like I'd hit a period of overtraining than the training itself. Those two things probably had as much to do with any injuries I had as a bad routine, bad form, or anything else.

So, having said that I really would have to recommend S&S. That's what it's for, the least amount you can do and still see results. Even when life gets in the way.

The other option might be an A+A set up. A+A will limit the time you go glycolytic. It will put less stress on your nervous system and allow you to recover. On those days you just aren't your best you could just do a nice 30-40 min. MAF run or other aerobic training at MAF.

I can't answer your question completely but I can relate to it.
 
Light, technique focused training sessions a’la Easy Strength are worth doing even on days with less than optimal sleep. If you time them well, they will give you a boost of energy better than coffee. Just keep it light, fun and smart.
 
Awesome info from all of you. Much appreciated. Definitely the advice I was looking for.

At 34 my whole mindset for training now is to “train smart”. I even apply that to jiu jitsu. I switched to a school that is more focused on learning technique and drilling rather than just hard sparring (rolling) every session like where I started bjj at.
 
Personally I would say your setting yourself up for overtraining/burnout/ injury. At 34 your recovery and mobility should be a focus and priority(thinking "long game " here)BJJ and Muay Thai is a potent mix and my choice as well but according to your post ,you are training one or the other 6 days a week. Now of course a lot of this depends on how hard you are training each art. Are you training like your in camp or just for a hobby? The frequency you mention is a lot , especially if your rolling an open mat type scenario 1-2 x a week. I used to push the gas pedal a lot in training when I was younger and now have to deal with the consequences of those actions. Many people mention on these forums they train BJJ as an afterthought which always confused me, BJJ is a bodyweight based resistance training and should be treated and respected as such. Good luck in your journey
 
Personally I would say your setting yourself up for overtraining/burnout/ injury. At 34 your recovery and mobility should be a focus and priority(thinking "long game " here)BJJ and Muay Thai is a potent mix and my choice as well but according to your post ,you are training one or the other 6 days a week. Now of course a lot of this depends on how hard you are training each art. Are you training like your in camp or just for a hobby? The frequency you mention is a lot , especially if your rolling an open mat type scenario 1-2 x a week. I used to push the gas pedal a lot in training when I was younger and now have to deal with the consequences of those actions. Many people mention on these forums they train BJJ as an afterthought which always confused me, BJJ is a bodyweight based resistance training and should be treated and respected as such. Good luck in your journey
One of my posts in this thread states that I switched to a school that only does technique and drilling for the class. Rolling after is optional. Its extremely low impact. I have also been doing bjj long enough to where I don’t have to exert much energy in to it even when I do roll. I can go to this school five days in a row and I have no wear and tear from it. The Muay Thai class is set up in the same way. You can choose to stay after to do the sparring but it isn’t a part of the initial class. This way I can pick and choose light days and hard days. That’s why I switched to this school. If I feel like I’m not recovered from other training I don’t roll. I have been doing martial arts regularly for 7 years and I know what works for me and what doesn’t in that regard. This thread was just about others views on training while low sleep.
 
Back spasms from yesterdays am work out, so this am Untying the Four Knots by Jon Engum and the Twelve Minute Foundation By Eric Goodman. Forced programming that I probably should have programmed anyhow.
 
Sounds good , You stated your primary goal was to get better at BJJ." My main goal is being the best I can be at bjj." As you probably know this is going to entail lots of hard sparring/rolling to pressure test the techniques your learning. Also lots of repetition of techniques. If you want to be competitive at higher levels it is going to be a full time job. The elite of BJJ these days are absolute monsters.
 
Sounds good , You stated your primary goal was to get better at BJJ." My main goal is being the best I can be at bjj." As you probably know this is going to entail lots of hard sparring/rolling to pressure test the techniques your learning. Also lots of repetition of techniques. If you want to be competitive at higher levels it is going to be a full time job. The elite of BJJ these days are absolute monsters.
I believe even monsters should wave their intensity.
 
S and s punch the clock with generous talk test rest

Easy strength

Strength shortcuts by @Geoff Neupert
Yesterday pulled an all-day drive home back from vacation. Didn't get to bed until 2, slept maybe 4 hours. Was pretty tired from the drive and lack of sleep but managed to squeeze in an S&S session mid afternoon. Went with heavy 2HS, timeless and dropped down a bell size for the TGUs and emphasized pauses at each stage.

I do timeless sessions by starting my next set when my HR goes below 100. Days like today (super fatigued) usually mean the session takes an extra few minutes than normal. Felt like a million bucks after I finished. Not beat up, but energized. Punch the clock.
 
You are seeking to alter and adjust your training, but are you also looking at the other variable in the equation...your sleep circumstances and how to optimize that as much as possible?

You can change your training all you want, but if you don't do something to change your sleep environment and quality (the things you have control over, there are things like work schedules and crying newborns that are more tricky), it will be all for nothing.

Many things to look at here .... any routine to quiet your mind (@elli suggestion of yoga for example is excellent), meditation, turning off electronics and if you like so many people use a cellphone as an alarm clock, have it way out of arms reach so not rolling over in the night and scrolling the internet, room temp, blackout curtains or eye shades, timing of caffeine intake, ruling out sleep apnea and snoring and if that is a factor treating that, etc. You mention having trouble "winding down", how close to "bedtime" is your BJJ practice and do you do anything specific to "wind down" for sleep after...any way that could change, or even number of days per week you practice?


I've been a shiftworker many years, so sleep is near and dear to my heart. At pushing 50 yrs old and with still with that type of schedule S&S is quite enough for me at the moment, and having some days in the last few weeks of occasions of not able to leave work and up almost 24hrs, I either do not do a session at all and just focus on mobility and a walk, or like other said dial down to 2 handed swings or just do a regular session with a lot more rest than I usually need. Depends on how I have slept, how I feel when I wake up, if I have to work again that day, etc.

You are young, and it is good you are looking at this now. There are many of us who are "older" who wish we would have been smarter when younger in the sleep department....and being how difficult it is to look ahead to one's "future self", so many who do not truly realize how serious chronic sleep deprivation is.
 
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