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Barbell Low bar squat form check

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solarbear said:
This was the very first and one of the shorter lists I found. Seems kinda contrived. You really notice it when you go to teach a youngster how many different variables you have to teach and make them aware of. I like squats because they are super effective, but I often wonder if they are not really a made up movement or a movement that was never supposed to be done with extreme weight.
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Not really sure how to respond to that or what you mean exactly by 'contrived'. Of course it's a made up movement, as are most "exercises" and "sports".
 
Boris Bachmann said:
Not really sure how to respond to that or what you mean exactly by 'contrived'. Of course it's a made up movement, as are most "exercises" and "sports".
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I was watching a dude lift huge atlas stones the other day. Omg the butt wink. Got me really thinking about squats and the human anatomy of lifting. Butt wink is essential to lifting huge stones off the ground but is a 'no no' for squats. So what feels natural is a 'no no.' Like a golf swing, the backwardness of this makes squats very difficult to learn or teach. Which is why it feels a bit 'contrived'. Certainly, there are blokes with certain hip anatomy and squatting is super easy for them, but for the rest of us they can be very confounding exercise. Hence, the internet is full of 'help me with my form' videos.
 
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solarbear said:
I was watching a dude lift huge atlas stones the other day. Omg the butt wink. Got me really thinking about squats and the human anatomy of lifting. Butt wink is essential to lifting huge stones off the ground but is a 'no no' for squats. So what feels natural is a 'no no.' Like a golf swing, the backwardness of this makes squats very difficult to learn or teach. Which is why it feels a bit 'contrived'. Certainly, there are blokes with certain hip anatomy and squatting is super easy for them, but for the rest of us they can be very confounding exercise. Hence, the internet is full of 'help me with my form' videos.
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Sure. There's talking about squatting and then there's actual squatting. I don't disagree - on the internet there's too much of the former and not enough of the latter.

As far as poor technique goes, and I've had this argument more than once, there are events like the stones that put you into disadvantageous positions, but that doesn't mean you would unnecessarily put yourself into poor (i.e. high risk) positions on purpose.
 
solarbear said:
I was watching a dude lift huge atlas stones the other day. Omg the butt wink. Got me really thinking about squats and the human anatomy of lifting. Butt wink is essential to lifting huge stones off the ground but is a 'no no' for squats. So what feels natural is a 'no no.' Like a golf swing, the backwardness of this makes squats very difficult to learn or teach. Which is why it feels a bit 'contrived'. Certainly, there are blokes with certain hip anatomy and squatting is super easy for them, but for the rest of us they can be very confounding exercise. Hence, the internet is full of 'help me with my form' videos.
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I'm not certain of this, but 2 thoughts or possibilities that come to mind:

1) Strongmen lifting atlas stones is probably submaximal for them. The stones are relatively light compared to how much weight they could back squat. Itnis more of a strength endurance event. It is likely half of their back squat weight. Submaximal lifting with full ROM is probably a good thing. Such as somebody doing a light full a#@ to grass squat with a 24kg kbell VS a heavy parallel barbell squat. But wink with a 24kg bell is probably ok, and maybe even healthy for a stretch. Butt wink with 500lb on your back is probably not.

2) There is a different between a competition and training. When training, you maintain perfect, safe form. When competing, you do whatever it takes to win! Even if that means you put yourself in less safe positions to gain leverage on a lift.

Eric
 
v1dem said:
Hello,

Finally managed to record a front view video of my 130kg x5 set. Would be glad to see your comments.
youtube.com

130kg x5 (front view)

youtube.com youtube.com

Thanks& Regards!
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Looks really good! I would bend forward a little bit more on your descent. This would help keep your back angle consistent and thus your position more stable. Basically the body finds the angle it needs on the ascent (more bent over than your current descent) and when there's too much shift between descent and ascent, the body can overshoot and then it moves toward the "good morning squat".
 
Steve Freides said:
Following up on the earlier discussion of what kind of shoes people squat in and why, I created an informal poll on the US Powerlifting Association (USPA) group on Facebook. Here's what I got:

1. High Bar, Oly shoes. (3 people or 7%)
2. High Bar, flat shoes. (6 people or 14%)
3. Low Bar, Oly shoes. (14 people or 32.5%)
4. Low Bar, flat shoes. (20 people or 46.5%)

So, there you have it. It's a public FB group if anyone wishes to join - you could then read the comments along with the results. Link:



-S-
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But, yeah, I think argument/discussion (goal post) shifted from don't low bar squat with heels ... to ... powerlifters don't lowbar squat w/ heels.

Steve Freides said:
It's tough to actually see your bar placement in these videos, but you mention low bar - but you're wearing Oly lifting shoes, not something many, me included, would recommend for a low bar squat. Your depth on the heavier set, to me, looked like some reps made depth while others didn't.

-S-
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A lot of people low-bar squat, and squat well, with Oly shoes. People over at Starting Strength use Romaleos and Adipowers all the time there. That combo is quite popular over there (Oly shoes w/ lowbar). I'm not endorsing their methods or ideas (I myself have been banned from there for thinking outside the echo chamber) but that place IS the ultimate epitome / mecca of the LBBS ....
and you would not get chastised for using lifters there to squat in at all.

For general strength training, which means heavy barbell loads... its fine.
Competitive PL is something different.

Just because you have a heeled shoe doesn't automatically make your shin go forward more, it can help, or allow it to happen, sure.
But sending your hips back, bending over, and keeping your hamstrings tight is what (mostly) controls the shin angle (or taking a really wide stance).
 
solarbear said:
I was watching a dude lift huge atlas stones the other day. Omg the butt wink. Got me really thinking about squats and the human anatomy of lifting. Butt wink is essential to lifting huge stones off the ground but is a 'no no' for squats. So what feels natural is a 'no no.' Like a golf swing, the backwardness of this makes squats very difficult to learn or teach. Which is why it feels a bit 'contrived'. Certainly, there are blokes with certain hip anatomy and squatting is super easy for them, but for the rest of us they can be very confounding exercise. Hence, the internet is full of 'help me with my form' videos.
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As a SM guy, I feel that I can comment here. Butt wink is an invented problem. Yeah, I just said that. I did it with more than 500 lbs in training, it never caused an issue. If you watch, a lot of guys do it. Novikov does it on his training videos. Not doing it is more about loss of flexibility and your legs getting too big to let you. Fighting to correct it is like herding cats, you'll expend a lot of energy and accomplish very little. Stones have more in common with Zercher DL and RDL's than the other lifts, and in spite of the "Bad form" of the event, the thing you never see is a back injury from doing Stones. I've seen injuries happen, it's never the back. Never.
 
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