Barbell Olympic lifts

[MikeTheBear]

Glenn Pendlay had some excellent videos where he had teaching progressions for the lifts. Thankfully they can still be found here:

How to Snatch Tutorial with Glenn Pendlay - All Things Gym

I learned a ton from these videos. Notice how in part 1 he recommends starting off in the power position with a vertical torso. If you're used to swinging with a hip hinge and really "hiking" the KB backwards, the vertical torso will feel awkward as h$ll. But this is the correct technique for the Olympic lifts. This position does use more quad strength than a swing, which is one of the reasons Olympic lifters prefer the high bar squat among other reasons, but you'll definitely be using the posterior chain as well. As @kennycro@@aol.com mentioned, heavy KB swings transfer over to the Olympic lifts. There was a time when I really tried to improve my snatch and I did all my snatches starting from this same bar in hip crease vertical torso position, and I recall I had some workouts where my glutes actually cramped up. It's a swing with a vertical torso.

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

I have read about the HCB earlier on. It is an interesting device and it should be cheap done DIY. I think I may build one in the future.

Home Made Hungarian Core Blaster

The cost to make it is about $20.00.

You can purchase the pipe to make it at Lows or Home Depot.

It takes 5 minutes to put it together.

You can purchase some used standard plate for about 55 cent per pound.

I load my Hungarian up with 170 lbs of plate and use it; there was room for more weight.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[Harald Motz]

I haven't seen much about the Olympic lifts here at the forum. I'm just curious why. Not even at the training logs. Maybe it's because they are difficult?

I do not bother. Everytime I use two bells of the same size it feels to me like weightlifting, kettlebell style. More so than with one "only", maybe a reason for that is that I like to put on some russian lifting shoes then.

 

[petes89]

After working with a few olympic lifting coaches I've found the 'ProCoach' app to be the best tool... is basically distance coaching on an app but they have the best coaches on it like Glenn Pendlay who was mentioned in this before, and Michaela Breeze the Olympian as well as Ben Turner (Commonwealth Games Medalist) and Danny Camargo (USA Head Coach). Cost me $5.99 to get feedback from Ben Turner who instantly picked up 4 technical points that our gym coach never even mentioned

 

[ShawnM]

+1 for @kennycro@@aol.com first post. There are several S&C college coaches that are moving away from Olympic lifts for there younger athletes in favor of heavy swings using a T-Handle or Hungarian Core Blaster. The reasoning being that a lot of athletes coming from High School don't have the O-lifts backround and it is easier to teach the hinge explosively with a swing motion. Once the athlete is in a program for a while the training eventually moves to high pulls and power cleans.

 

[Kenny Croxdale]

+1 for @kennycro@@aol.com first post. There are several S&C college coaches that are moving away from Olympic lifts for there younger athletes in favor of heavy swings using a T-Handle or Hungarian Core Blaster. The reasoning being that a lot of athletes coming from High School don't have the O-lifts backround and it is easier to teach the hinge explosively with a swing motion. Once the athlete is in a program for a while the training eventually moves to high pulls and power cleans.

Excellent Point

I am a proponent of implementing Heavy Kettlebell Swings as a means of increasing Power, in place of the Oympic Movement for the reason you stated.

Dr Bret Contreras' research demonstrated the Power Output of Kettlebell Swings rivals Olympic Movements.

With said, let me add that based on research Olympic Lifts are more effective for sports that involve Vertical Jumps while Kettlebell Swing are more effective for Horizontal Jumps.

Another method is the...

Trap Bar Deadlift Jumps

Research has demonstrated that Power Output with the appropriate load, rivals the Olympic Lifts.

Trap Bar Deadlift Jumps elicit essentially the same Power Output development as the Olympic Lifts. And as you noted; it is an easier movement to learn.

Kenny Croxdale

 

[watchnerd]

My impression is that Olympic lifts are to barbell as GS is to kettlebell. It is a competitive sport.

Hmmm...other than being a competitive strength sport, they don't have much in common.

The Olifts are explosive, over in seconds, best of 3 attempts. It's not an endurance sport like GS, nor a grind lift like powerlifting.

 

[Anna C]

Hmmm...other than being a competitive strength sport, they don't have much in common.

The Olifts are explosive, over in seconds, best of 3 attempts. It's not an endurance sport like GS, nor a grind lift like powerlifting.

True, yes... The feature in common is that there is a different end to the means. By the same token we could also add in training to be a competitive powerlifter. Training to be competitive in GS, Weightlifting, or Powerlifting certainly develops physical attributes that are similar to what us mere mortals are after in our training, but there is a different end goal in mind that changes the emphasis and methods of training. For those of us who are not trying to be competitive in sport, there is usually a more well-rounded and direct route to our goals and objectives.

 

[North Coast Miller]

From the reading I've done, only Trap Bar work equaled the power output of unweighted jumping. After that you have a high technique demand exercise that maybe is of limited utility for actual power output in other disciplines (many coaches including Maxwell have come to this conclusion) compared to doing the sport specific actions. The injury rate is higher than the average across common forms of resistance training as well, so I'd need a real good reason to pursue this from a non-competitive standpoint.

That said, I'd love to take some time and learn a few of these, but being realistic I barely have time for the stuff I do currently.

 

[watchnerd]

True, yes... The feature in common is that there is a different end to the means. By the same token we could also add in training to be a competitive powerlifter. Training to be competitive in GS, Weightlifting, or Powerlifting certainly develops physical attributes that are similar to what us mere mortals are after in our training, but there is a different end goal in mind that changes the emphasis and methods of training. For those of us who are not trying to be competitive in sport, there is usually a more well-rounded and direct route to our goals and objectives.

The specificity of training you're referring to is certainly true of Olympic weightlifters in their prime lifting years gunning for world records.

But I find that to be far less true as a competitive "Masters", aka over 35, lifter.

All the folks I know who are still trying to compete, let alone be competitive, after the age of 40, spend about as much time working on mobility and "fitness" as they do working on the competition lifts.

The reason? If you can just maintain your lifts at their present level, and not decline or get injured-out, your relative competitive ranking goes up.

Example: right now, I'm turning 49 this year, so compete at the very tail of the 45-49 bracket. My lifts put me at about #6 - #7, nationally. If I can maintain those lifts in 2020 when I move into the 50-54 bracket, my relative ranking will go up.

So staying in the game matters a lot, and doing that, for most lifters I know, requires a more balanced approach than when younger. Personally, I do barbell training 2 times a week, S&S 2 times a week, yoga 2 times a week.

Lastly, as far as goals and methodologies....

I don't see a vast difference in mindset between someone practicing to pass the Sinister 48kg goal and someone practicing to hit a 100kg snatch.

In fact, many of the Russian studies that Pavel and others FMS / strength and conditioning coaches reference were done in the context of their Olympic weightlifting program.

But I still refuse to bench.

 

[watchnerd]

From the reading I've done, only Trap Bar work equaled the power output of unweighted jumping. After that you have a high technique demand exercise that maybe is of limited utility for actual power output in other disciplines (many coaches including Maxwell have come to this conclusion) compared to doing the sport specific actions. The injury rate is higher than the average across common forms of resistance training as well, so I'd need a real good reason to pursue this from a non-competitive standpoint.

That said, I'd love to take some time and learn a few of these, but being realistic I barely have time for the stuff I do currently.

As a garage gym lifter, if I ever buy a trap bar, I've gone way too far on the "gear buying" spectrum......

 

[North Coast Miller]

As a garage gym lifter, if I ever buy a trap bar, I've gone way too far on the "gear buying" spectrum......

LOl !
I agree 100%. But if you don't have any gear and are thinking about Oly lifting due to the "power output" buzz and not to learn the lifts for their own sake, it could actually save you money.

I wonder how partial squat jumps with a sandbag compare to Trap Bar jumps?

 

[MikeTheBear]

The reason? If you can just maintain your lifts at their present level, and not decline or get injured-out, your relative competitive ranking goes up.

There is a saying among us masters lifters: You don't need to get stronger. Just get older!

As a garage gym lifter, if I ever buy a trap bar, I've gone way too far on the "gear buying" spectrum......

I have one. I like buying fitness toys. Yes, I recognize I have a problem. Unfortunately there is no 12 step program for exercise equipment junkies.

 

[LoneRider]

I generally use the power clean and power snatch in my training. Very recently I've begun doing 5x3 for the Power Clean (it gets its own day in my strength training programming), but historically I've done 5-6 singles of the power clean or power snatch before deadlifting and experienced some decent successes.

 

[Zack]

All excellent points.

Personally, I invested in a coach and a few months of dedicated training to get acquainted and somewhat competent with the lifts.

Were I still in a fully-equipped facility with ample time to train, I would have definitely kept them in the mix. Unfortunately, reality dictates brief routines, often in a 3rd floor apartment.

 

[watchnerd]

I have one. I like buying fitness toys. Yes, I recognize I have a problem. Unfortunately there is no 12 step program for exercise equipment junkies.

I hear you. Sometimes I feel inadequate owning only 1 barbell (IWF type).

I've been looking for an excuse to either buy a power bar, or maybe one of those screwy Russian style bars:

 

[watchnerd]

I generally use the power clean and power snatch in my training. Very recently I've begun doing 5x3 for the Power Clean (it gets its own day in my strength training programming), but historically I've done 5-6 singles of the power clean or power snatch before deadlifting and experienced some decent successes.

I stopped doing dedicated power cleans when I went to a "no rack" set up.

Which means now I have to clean everything I squat or press....which means cleans happen organically every workout, it makes practically every move a 'complex' of some sort.

Example of my Klokov Press routine:

1. Clean
2. Push press
3. Adjust to snatch grip, lower bar behind neck
4. Klokov Press for reps
5. Overhead squat on last rep
6. Bail

 

[Steve Freides]

This thread became contentious. The original poster's questions were already well-answered. Some posts were removed and the thread closed.

-S-