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Kettlebell Programming snatch for TSC

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damogari

damogari

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Hello everyone,

I am thinking about starting a program where I would be able to prepare for TSC while improving my double press. It would consist of these elements:
  • Double Press twice a week (KB Strong template)
  • Pull Ups every other day (FPP template)
  • Snatch twice a week
  • Deadlift once a week (Beyond 5/3/1 template)
As you see press, pull up and deadlift are already programmed. This DL template is a thing I am doing for a couple of months now. It was done next to ROP and TTC, so I think that I would be able to mix it with KB Strong and still recover well. I don't find FPP volume 3x/week to be very demanding overally.

I dont have an idea how to program Snatches. I am doing them lately with 28kg and 32kg in sets of 5 in A+A style. I really like to train them this way, but on the other side I know that I need to dial up density to prep for TSC. My weak link from "lungs, buns and guns" are definitely lungs.
My baseline for snatch is 82 reps in 5min, tested on April, I would be happy to hit the 100 mark on 5min test on October.

Can you recommend a snatch protocol that would include A+A heavy snatches and 24kg density sessions? When I have to start snatching in glycolytic fashion to get the best results for TSC?
 
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This fall will be my first TSC, and I am just following the (excellent) TSC Training for Athletes of All Levels.

Basically twice a week, starting with 5/5 (second session is 4/4) on the minute for 7 minutes, adding a rep per side each week until 10/10, then go back to 5/5 with a higher weight. So given your numbers, it says to start with 5/5 at 28 until you are at 10/10 at 28 for 7 minutes, then back to 5/5 with 32.
 
Thank you @Sean M and @Jan! I know these programs but I am not sure that working with that intensity for 3 months is optimal? I read somewhere that it is sometimes better to work A+A for most of the time and push the density in a few weeks before event?

@Mark Limbaga I will do 5min test tomorrow, I tested it a few months ago (82 reps) but I think that its not so accurate anymore
 
damogari said:
Thank you @Sean M and @Jan! I know these programs but I am not sure that working with that intensity for 3 months is optimal? I read somewhere that it is sometimes better to work A+A for most of the time and push the density in a few weeks before event?

@Mark Limbaga I will do 5min test tomorrow, I tested it a few months ago (82 reps) but I think that its not so accurate anymore
Click to expand...

Get us an updated baseline then we'll go from there..
 
I did snatch test day today and got 99 reps in form of:

12L, 13R, 12L, 12R, rest, 8L, 8R, rest, 8L, rest, 8R, rest, 5L, 5R, rest, 5L, 3R (not sure if last one counts)

Was working without looking at the timer (camera was on), I think that I would break this 100 rep mark if I knew how much time was left ;)

Anyway my biggest problem are lungs (was winded after first 50) and I am pretty sure that there is a lot to improve in my technique. I prefer faster cadence with parking bell between the sets, but I am open for other snatch test strategies.

Of course any critique of my technique is welcomed.

 
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Some reps on your right arm look more like you're pressing the last 20% of the ROM instead of the "float'n'punch".
A lot of body-english and loss of tension as fatigue builds up.

You're in a good position to use this: The Escalating Snatch Protocol: How To Crush The Kettlebell Snatch Test
Since you have more than 8 weeks left you could start inreasing the reps.
For example:
Week 9: 12/12 - 10/10 - 10/10 - 10/10 - 10/10
Week 10: 12/12 - 12/12 - 10/10 - 10/10 - 10/10
etc.
That way you should be able to get somewhere between 100 and 120 reps at the TSC (depending on how you feel that day and how much the DL + Pullups take out of you).

In my experience it's usually better to go into something like the snatch test with a fixed plan. Going for a certain number of reps before switching hands and resting (like the 10/10 in the plan) is better IMO than just snatching until you need to rest. You sure are able to get more than 10/10 in the first minute, but it will catch up to you in the later minutes.
 
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Great job, @damogari ! Snatch tests are not easy. You did well.

+1 to @Kettlebelephant's input above

damogari said:
Can you recommend a snatch protocol that would include A+A heavy snatches and 24kg density sessions? When I have to start snatching in glycolytic fashion to get the best results for TSC?
Click to expand...

What I did with Al C's guidance for the Oct 2016 TSC was continue A+A snatches until 2 weeks before the TSC, then some glycolytic peaking. It doesn't take long, only 6 sessions or so in the final weeks. I'd say keep working on the strength and technique of the snatch with your chosen protocol, not overworking the density just yet. Make sure you are all the way to vertical lockout, especially on that right side. Use the hips a bit more (sit into it). And try the power breath on the hip snap.
 
what K-phant and Anna said. Butt more back, maybe the head not that much extended on the downswing. Try how it feels, when you bring your feet closer together, as they seem very sumo to me. For your (right) lockout snatch technique work in front of a mirror may be useful from time to time. More nose breathing as far agony permits it...it's all said easily, to watch others in torture.

Great effort. You are on a good way.
 
It's hard to tell for sure from the camera angle, but it looks like you are turning a swing into a snatch rather than keeping the bell close to your body which makes for a more efficient snatch. Anyway, good work! If you started at 99, you will build it up quickly and have an impressive score!
 
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@Anna C Oohhhh I am very interested in the peaking plan! I may need to send Al an email about that. I plan to do about 5-6 weeks of pure A+A work, and then I will have 2-3 weeks before the TSC. That could be fun :)
 
damogari said:
Anyway my biggest problem are lungs (was winded after first 50) and I am pretty sure that there is a lot to improve in my technique.
Click to expand...
No idea about technique, as I'm beginning my snatch journey.
But for lungs, I'm thinking of keeping in SaS's non-stop swing testing every two weeks with a heavier bell...32k or heavier. Getting 32k x 100 non-stop two hand swings has got to help with 24k snatches.
 
Thank you for all your advices!

I will work on my technique, especially focusing on keeping the bell closer to my body and going deeper into the hinge.

There are 12 weeks left + TSC week. I was thinking a little about your program ideas and came up with mix of A+A and Escalating Snatch Protocol:

Weeks 1-9:
A+A sessions
  • two times a week
  • starting from mix of 28kg and 32kg sets and working towards 32kg sets only
  • volume - I don't know how many sets of 5 I should do, I was doing about 100 reps a session so far. Maybe I should vary the volume each session?

Weeks 10-12:
The Escalating Snatch Protocol: How To Crush The Kettlebell Snatch Test (advanced progression)
  • two times a week
  • working with 24kg
  • 6 sessions (EMOM 5min):
    • 10/10, 8/8, 6/6, 6/6, 6/6
    • 10/10, 8/8, 8/8, 8/8, 6/6
    • 10/10, 10/10, 8/8, 8/8, 8/8
    • 10/10, 10/10, 10/10, 10/10, 8/8
    • 12/12, 10/10, 10/10, 10/10, 10/10
    • 12/12, 12/12, 12/12, 10/10, 10/10
Week 13:
Rest with goal of 120 reps in form of 12/12 EMOM on Saturday TSC

What do you think about it? If it sounds right how I should program A+A part?
 
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damogari said:
I don't know how many sets of 5 I should do, I was doing about 100 reps a session so far. Maybe I should vary the volume each session?
Click to expand...

For the A+A, 100 reps in a session is a good default. That's 20 repeats of 5. In the protocols and in our more freestyle work since then we varied the number of repeats (NR), maybe as few as 12 or 16 on a light day, as many as 40 or slightly more on a heavy day. That's with 2 - 4 sessions per week with a default of 3. If you're only doing 2, I might suggest working towards 24-30 NR on one day, and 30-40 NR on the other day... if your hands can take it. Since you have 9 weeks there, just build up slowly.

I have not tried the Escalating plan, but the progression / time / # of sessions looks about right. I suspect anything glycolytic for a couple of weeks will work.
 
@damogari definitely stick with the A+A work. I may have missed it but are you competing in the open division? If so after several weeks of A+A with a 32 the 24 feels like a feather!! Try to work some lsd into your plan. It'll help you go longer!
 
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Anna C said:
For the A+A, 100 reps in a session is a good default. That's 20 repeats of 5. In the protocols and in our more freestyle work since then we varied the number of repeats (NR), maybe as few as 12 or 16 on a light day, as many as 40 or slightly more on a heavy day. That's with 2 - 4 sessions per week with a default of 3. If you're only doing 2, I might suggest working towards 24-30 NR on one day, and 30-40 NR on the other day... if your hands can take it. Since you have 9 weeks there, just build up slowly.

I have not tried the Escalating plan, but the progression / time / # of sessions looks about right. I suspect anything glycolytic for a couple of weeks will work.
Click to expand...
Thank you @Anna C! I will build up volume slowly with these A+A sessions, there's a lot more volume than I thought! Really like this style of training.

Timothy Friel said:
@damogari definitely stick with the A+A work. I may have missed it but are you competing in the open division? If so after several weeks of A+A with a 32 the 24 feels like a feather!! Try to work some lsd into your plan. It'll help you go longer!
Click to expand...
Thank you @Timothy Friel! Your log was an inspiration for this thread. I will snatch 24kg on test. After a few sessions with 28kg and 32kg my test bell already feels much lighter! Thank you for advice about long distance cardio - I am trying to do some light running / heavy rucking weekly, but between snatches, deadlifting and pressing theres not much time and energy left to do a lot of them.
 
@damogari another option to vary your sessions is the good old roll of the dice method. Give each number an amount of repeats. That's what I'll be doing closer to the tsc as my deadlifts get heavier, reducing my A+A volume down to 20-30 repeats twice a week. Rolling the dice each session. Don't do the same volume two sessions in a row. If you roll the same just roll again.

Watch your lsd work. Keep it at a recovery pace if your doing it on off days. One thing I have done in the past is to ruck after I snatch, as long as it was a lower volume snatch session.
 
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