Nutrition RDA's/RNI's

[Meursault]

Just something i've been pondering lately about micronutrient intake -

Many posters on this board seem to follow some form of time-restricted eating, i'm wondering what are peoples thoughts on not hitting the RDAs for vitamins and minerals whilst doing so? I would imagine that it is unlikely that many following the more 'extreme' forms of these types of diet are consuming the recommended amounts of many micronutrients, yet we dont see thread upon thread of people having any health-related issues. The same goes for many yoga-practitioners I see following OMAD and such things.

Just wondering what people would put this down to - are RDAs a bit antiquated, or are the amounts slightly exaggerated, perhaps individual difference, perhaps the issues will only evidence themselves in later life? just curious.

 

[LukeV]

For me discovering the carnivore diet was a big OMG!!! moment. Here were people claiming to have eaten only meat for decades and in perfect health with bikini photos and bloodwork posted to prove it. Didn't this go against everything homo sapien mothers have told their offspring for 200000 years? That if you didn't eat your vegetables you would be dead by about this time next week!!!! You can't tell me you can get the complete nutritional profile eating only grass-fed beef. I mean I know that technically you can if you eat the whole animal raw including hoofs and drink the blood (as per the Dothraki Diet). But people on the Carnivore Diet don't seem to go to extremes, as such. So what gives?

 

[Meursault]

Yeah the carnivore diet would be another example - to my knowledge its a relatively new 'movement' so I would be intrigued to see how many people are still adhering to it in 10 years or so without any health related issues arising. I guess im slightly too sceptical to take peoples word on what they eat and how they are doing - we've all heard about breatharians and fruitarians etc.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

I've been running a paleo,keto,carnivore hybrid thing mixed with IF, a 5-7 day water coffee fast once or twice a year, not eating for 24 hrs once a week etc. I also supplement a good bit. Something interesting about full carnivore is the idea that when eliminating many foods which contain anti-nutrients ( lectins,oxalates,phytates) you don't need RDA amounts of vitamins and minerals in you diet since none are being used to process non carnivore foods and none are being bound to the anti-nutrients and excreted. Also interesting to see the amount of nutrition in 1 lb of grass fed liver, and then throw in the nutrition from some fresh oysters. Many that go nose to tail will also add sea salt,potass, and magnesium to their program. See what works for you, find your own path.

 

[Meursault]

I put the 1lb of beef liver/1/2lb of oysters diet into cronometer just to see what would come up. Deficient in B1, vit C,D,E,K as well as calcium, magnesium, potassium. Also contains what would be considered dangerous levels of copper, iron, b12. Interesting idea about anti-nutrients reducing RDA needs; but i'd be surprised if an 'average' or standard diet would contain enough to justify higher RDAs compared to a carnivore diet.

 

[Steve Freides]

@Meursault, I am neither doctor nor nutritionist, but to the best of my knowledge, there is no upper limit for the consumption of B12 in human beings, so the idea that any natural source could result in "dangerous levels" of B12 seems specious.

-S-

 

[Meursault]

@Meursault, I am neither doctor nor nutritionist, but to the best of my knowledge, there is no upper limit for the consumption of B12 in human beings, so the idea that any natural source could result in "dangerous levels" of B12 seems specious.

-S-

You are of course, correct. My mistake.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

@Meursault, I am neither doctor nor nutritionist, but to the best of my knowledge, there is no upper limit for the consumption of B12 in human beings, so the idea that any natural source could result in "dangerous levels" of B12 seems specious.

-S-

Yes, there is a depth to this game way beyond my pay grade when dealing with nutrients from food as apposed to synthetic supplements.
For instance, I've read the amount of Vit. C in 1/4 small lime is around 5.7 mgs, which is said to be equivalent to 1000 mgs of ascorbic acid.
Steve, an example of this would be the MAF multi you take, 60 mgs of Vit. C from acerola cherries, which would be considered a low amount if not food based.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

I put the 1lb of beef liver/1/2lb of oysters diet into cronometer just to see what would come up. Deficient in B1, vit C,D,E,K as well as calcium, magnesium, potassium. Also contains what would be considered dangerous levels of copper, iron, b12. Interesting idea about anti-nutrients reducing RDA needs; but i'd be surprised if an 'average' or standard diet would contain enough to justify higher RDAs compared to a carnivore diet.

You could try comparing the liver/oyster combo to something like a pound of kale and a 1/2 pound of black beans or some such. I'll take the former.

 

[Steve Freides]

Yes, there is a depth to this game way beyond my pay grade when dealing with nutrients from food as apposed to synthetic supplements.
For instance, I've read the amount of Vit. C in 1/4 small lime is around 5.7 mgs, which is said to be equivalent to 1000 mgs of ascorbic acid.
Steve, an example of this would be the MAF multi you take, 60 mgs of Vit. C from acerola cherries, which would be considered a low amount if not food based.

Thanks for that. Yes, way out of my area, too. Do you have a reference about Vitamin C in a lime versus 1000 of ascorbic acid? That would be interesting reading? FWIW, I've never found benefit to taking extra C, and it's bothered my stomach. But my wife and one of my sons like it.

-S-

 

[Don Fairbanks]

Thanks for that. Yes, way out of my area, too. Do you have a reference about Vitamin C in a lime versus 1000 of ascorbic acid? That would be interesting reading? FWIW, I've never found benefit to taking extra C, and it's bothered my stomach. But my wife and one of my sons like it.

-S-

I use Daily C- Protect powder from MegaFood. I'll dig around a bit, info could have come from Albert Szent-Gyorgyi or Linus Pauling, or something to do with lime -juicer ( limey term ) connected to British Sailors and their ration of lime juice in relation to ascorbic acid and the prevention of scurvy.

 

[Meursault]

You could try comparing the liver/oyster combo to something like a pound of kale and a 1/2 pound of black beans or some such. I'll take the former.

I wasn't meaning to sound dismissive, so my apologies if you took it that way. I don't think the kale/bean combo would be nutritionally balanced either, and haven't suggested such - my point is rather that many diets that seem popular at the moment would appear to be, in light of RDAs, deficient. I was looking to see what others have hypothesised for the apparent mismatch between the recommendations and what supposedly deficient, but apparently healthy people are able to eat.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

@Meursault All good. My point with the combo was an example of the nutritional density of a well planned minimalist diet regimen and I put as much weight in the US RDAs as I do in the US food pyramid/myplate, close to none. With nutrition I like to ask the question, "How's that working for you?" Elimination diets generally ensue which can then lead to paleo/keto,carnivore, or whatever will work for that particular person. Yes, as you mentioned, many healthy people with different eating styles.

True story: The liver eating scene in Revenant lead me to looking into its nutritional content.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

I use Daily C- Protect powder from MegaFood. I'll dig around a bit, info could have come from Albert Szent-Gyorgyi or Linus Pauling, or something to do with lime -juicer ( limey term ) connected to British Sailors and their ration of lime juice in relation to ascorbic acid and the prevention of scurvy.

Another quality Vit C. powder, C Complete Powder by Innate Response Formulas.