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Barbell Reduce progress but develop grip or keep going with mixed grip?

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guardian7

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Although I am still making progress on my PTTP SLF user course program, I am reaching the limit of my grip strength at doubleoverhand. How do you decide whether to slow down a program and build form and grip or go mixed and keep the gains going?

So far, I seem to be doing OK on the pull but the bar slides into my fingers and I lose the grip on the descent, which is not a big deal as some people just drop the bar on the negative.

145KG is my 1RM at 75KG bodyweight. 110 KG are my working sets now at doubleoverhand. I have been adding 5KG every two now every three workouts. Reducing 15 percent when failing and repeating as per the manual. I have failed a cycle for both bench and DL twice but have been able to improve on the second try after reducing and building back up.

My goal is just to surpass my previous doublebodyweight 1RM lift at the end of March when I change my fitness focus to kettlebells/martial arts for fitness.
 
guardian7 said:
How do you decide whether to slow down a program and build form and grip or go mixed and keep the gains going?
Click to expand...

Don't slow down your deadlift progress for your grip. So you're having trouble gripping 242 lb (110KG) for a set of 5? Keep the challenge to your grip by double overhand grip for all of your sets up to your work sets at 110KG or whatever your weight is for the day, and use hook grip or mixed grip for that set. Chalk helps, too, especially for hook grip.

guardian7 said:
So far, I seem to be doing OK on the pull but the bar slides into my fingers and I lose the grip on the descent, which is not a big deal as some people just drop the bar on the negative.
Click to expand...

Are you trying to lower the bar more slowly than this (linked video)? If so, just practice the ability to "fall with the bar" a little quicker. I wouldn't recommend dropping it. Notice in that video I'm using a mixed grip, whereas in this one I'm using a hook grip. I can double-overhand without hook grip a set of 5 at about 275 lb but above that I start to lose the bar so have to use either hook or mixed. The main reason I used a mixed grip in that first one is that gym didn't have chalk. Hook grip works a lot better with some chalk on your thumb, fingers, and the area between the index finger and thumb. But overall I prefer hook grip and would recommend it if you haven't used it before. Try with a light warm-up set and see how it goes.

Final tip would be to get a little more grip challenge on days that your grip is strong by holding the bar in lockout for a few extra seconds, especially on your final rep of the day. I got that from @Steve Freides.
 
What's so special about double overhand Vs mixed or hook grip?

I don't like the idea of compromising my development because my grip fails. Getting better at the deadlift is important to me. I can't imagine why I would like to limit my overall strength on my grip. And it's not like the grip doesn't get worked with mixed or hook or even lifting grips. And one can also train the grip outside of the deadlift.

I would recommend to keep at double overhand as long as it works and then change it to something else when the weight demands it.

The main point I see is deadlift is trained to improve the deadlift. Getting a stronger grip is a secondary benefit of the deadlift training. If you want a stronger grip, best do specific grip training
 
+2 For the hook grip. I can double over hand 345 for a few singles, hook grip 450+ without straining as much as with the double over hand. Once you get used to it you will be fine, and chalk is your friend.
 
ShawnM said:
+2 For the hook grip. I can double over hand 345 for a few singles, hook grip 450+ without straining as much as with the double over hand. Once you get used to it you will be fine, and chalk is your friend.
Click to expand...

Wow! that much of a difference? I have to try it.
 
Antti said:
What's so special about double overhand Vs mixed or hook grip?

I don't like the idea of compromising my development because my grip fails. Getting better at the deadlift is important to me. I can't imagine why I would like to limit my overall strength on my grip. And it's not like the grip doesn't get worked with mixed or hook or even lifting grips. And one can also train the grip outside of the deadlift.

I would recommend to keep at double overhand as long as it works and then change it to something else when the weight demands it.

The main point I see is deadlift is trained to improve the deadlift. Getting a stronger grip is a secondary benefit of the deadlift training. If you want a stronger grip, best do specific grip training
Click to expand...

I want to train overall strength and work toward a PR which will be a mixed grip (maybe hook based on the comments here) at the end of March. 110 is the progression along a linear program, so I am not even close to working with what I could PR with a mixed grip. I am sticking to the plan and it is working. The form has improved (according to someone who noticed) compared to how I used to train heavier singles. Hence, I thought working on form and grip for another month would be an investment in a bigger PR later. I am almost 50 and lifting for general strength.
 
Anna C said:
Don't slow down your deadlift progress for your grip. So you're having trouble gripping 242 lb (110KG) for a set of 5? Keep the challenge to your grip by double overhand grip for all of your sets up to your work sets at 110KG or whatever your weight is for the day, and use hook grip or mixed grip for that set. Chalk helps, too, especially for hook grip.



Are you trying to lower the bar more slowly than this (linked video)? If so, just practice the ability to "fall with the bar" a little quicker. I wouldn't recommend dropping it. Notice in that video I'm using a mixed grip, whereas in this one I'm using a hook grip. I can double-overhand without hook grip a set of 5 at about 275 lb but above that I start to lose the bar so have to use either hook or mixed. The main reason I used a mixed grip in that first one is that gym didn't have chalk. Hook grip works a lot better with some chalk on your thumb, fingers, and the area between the index finger and thumb. But overall I prefer hook grip and would recommend it if you haven't used it before. Try with a light warm-up set and see how it goes.

Final tip would be to get a little more grip challenge on days that your grip is strong by holding the bar in lockout for a few extra seconds, especially on your final rep of the day. I got that from @Steve Freides.
Click to expand...

Not a slow descent. It is more like I am guiding it down with my fingers and losing the grip with my thumb when I put it down. It is not a powerlifting gym so chalk and dropping the weights are not an option.

What do people think of liquid chalk? I tried it and it seemed to work?

Working on grip by holding the lockout is a great idea. I will do that whenever the plan calls for reducing the weight and on the last rep of the day. I am avoiding specific grip work this month to focus on the deadlift. I will resume grip work after this DL program.
 
Ignore my comment. I just looked it up, when I did hook grip, I did it completely wrong. No wonder, it was so painful.
 
Form and grip? Don't you work on those with the heavier weight and a different grip?

I don't know the plan but it's typically a good idea to follow it through.

I like liquid chalk. Works great for me. The only downside I see is it can dry the hands a lot and I may have to occasionally moisture them.
 
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