ROP support group

Discussion in 'Kettlebell' started by gibbertron, Nov 24, 2012.

  1. Steve Freides

    Steve Freides Forum Administrator Senior Certified Instructor

    I would not.

    ETK’s ROP is not S & S and is not ROTK. Every ROP Heavy day, do as much as you can in good form. If you chose your starting weight correctly, you should be able to progress each week. There isn’t much danger in repeating 3 x 1-2-3, but the volume is too high at the end of the program to extend. Reload explains this, BTW.

    -S-
     
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  2. Saša

    Saša Still New to StrongFirst Forum

    Hi all, just wanted to ask if anyone of you tried ROP training during the Hit the target diet? Currently i'm doing it with 28kg bell and I have to admit that the heavy day is 100% harder than it was before. Also, instead of pull up I'm doing kb row with the same kb weight.
    One more question my pause between rungs is at most 30 sec and 2 min between sets. Is it enough? too much?

    thnx in advance
     
  3. Adam R Mundorf

    Adam R Mundorf More than 500 posts

    As long as you can perform the next rung / ladder with perfect form, it's enough rest. Keep in mind though that the RoP is a strength building program and it's recommended to rest as long as needed, no rushing.

    Patience is key.
     
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  4. JamesPTA

    JamesPTA Triple-Digit Post Count

    For those who have gone through ROP: In ETK, Pavel states that you may replace a heavy day with a test day every 4-6 weeks I believe. How many have actually performed this, or did you simply advance the ladder scheme as instructed?
     
    Bauer likes this.
  5. Adam R Mundorf

    Adam R Mundorf More than 500 posts

    I've done it. One time I tested and was able to move up to the 24kg from the 20kg.
     
  6. Adam R Mundorf

    Adam R Mundorf More than 500 posts

    When I'm pressing the bell, I have a habit of looking at the bell on the way up and on the way down.

    Is this okay?
     
  7. Steve Freides

    Steve Freides Forum Administrator Senior Certified Instructor

    Yes, but many feel it's best to think of following the bell with your eyes rather than with your neck and head. Following it with your head will cause some people to lean excessively.

    -S-
     
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  8. Adam R Mundorf

    Adam R Mundorf More than 500 posts

    Opinions on replacing chin ups / pull ups with horizontal pull ups?

    I'm currently in a situation where reaching a decent pull up bar isn't viable. I do however have enough clearance in my apartment for a horizontal pull up bar.

    Thank you, Adam
     
    Bauer likes this.
  9. J Cox

    J Cox Double-Digit Post Count

    I know this is years behind the original post, but for anyone who is curious, I fashioned my own grips attached to the pullups bar. Just two pieces of 1 inch black pipe attached with paracord . They allow me to rotate through a full range of motion. I assume they are similar to the rings, but they work great.
     
    Glen likes this.
  10. J Cox

    J Cox Double-Digit Post Count

    I don't know how many times I read ETK before I even started it and have read it since starting. I learn more and more each read. Sometimes you need to do the work in the laboratory for the textbook to make more sense.
     
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  11. Marc

    Marc Quadruple-Digit Post Count

    You should be fine! In fact your shoulder girdle will probably thank you for the horizontal rowing. Experiment a bit with scapula position. Keeping the scaps retracted throughout the whole movement (as opposed to goint into protraction as you lower the weight) will really strengthen all those muscles around your scaps and therefore keep your shoulders happy.

    Maybe you could get yourself a pullupbar and do l-sit or tucked pullups.
    Another alternative is to do "door pullups". Anchor the door with a towel underneath it so it does not move. Hang onto the door and do pullups. This version is slightly easier than on a bar/rings.
    But as I said, noting wrong with replacing pullups with rows. Alternatively you could do some days pullups others rows.

    Now, one more thing:
    Personally I found it too taxing to do presses alternated with rows. I did presses first and then added some sets (3-5) of pullups after that. This really made my press stronger. It doesn't has to be the same way for others, but maybe something to consider.
     
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  12. J Cox

    J Cox Double-Digit Post Count

    OK.

    I got cocky.

    Last night, I started my ladders of 5 (1,2,3,4) and simply got cocky. I gave myself plenty of time between the ladders, but I went ahead and decided to climb all the rungs of each ladder (1L switch, 1R switch, 2L switch, 2R switch ...). Let me say this was the quickest way to make sure heavy day went down in flames.

    For anybody who doubts how important your rest is, even between rungs, just give yourself a break. For all the nonsense people face in their daily lives where they wish someone would just lay off trumpet practice for the evening, or wish their property taxes were lower, here's a way you can give yourself a break without sacrificing anything other than a few minutes. Take your breaks and enjoy them.

    I'm going to give myself at least a minute and a half between rungs (and that will likely expand) next heavy day to see how I feel. By this I mean between around the third and fourth rungs. I'll expand time for the first and second rungs to around a touch under a minute, maybe 45 seconds. It may seem excessive, but I'll trim where I can because it wasn't that I missed reps, it was that they were sloppy. Just begging for an injury in that work zone.

    What's idiotic about the whole thing is that I haven't tried to compress the individual rungs on a heavy day up to this point. As I said, I got cocky.

    Not going to make that mistake again.

    And this time, I mean it.
     
  13. Nacho

    Nacho Triple-Digit Post Count

    Out of curiosity, 16 to 24 seems like a big jump on press and snatch. Is 20kg kettlebell more or less mandatory for rop, assuming 24kg is too heavy to start with?
     
  14. JamesPTA

    JamesPTA Triple-Digit Post Count

    The recommendation calls for a bell that you can clean and press 5-8 times. When I went through ROP, I kept the snatch weight the same as my press weight. The end all goals are 1/2 body weight press as well as 200 snatches in 10 minutes with a 24 kg bell. For some people, these goals may take several rounds to complete.
     
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  15. Sean M

    Sean M Quadruple-Digit Post Count

    @Nacho I did 20kg between 16kg and 24kg, but if 24kg is your 2-3RM I would actually recommend Soju & Tuba to get it to 4-5RM so you can start RoP with the heavier bell.

    Don't forget - you don't have to do the entire 13-week progression from 3 x 1,2,3 --> 5 x 1,2,3,4,5 (heavy day ladders). If you happen to have a 20kg you could see what you get for your first heavy day and progress from there. Say you get 2 x 1,2,3,4 and aren't sure about the 4th rung of the third ladder - no problem, just do 2 more 1,2,3 ladders (3 total) and then 5 x 1,2,3 and 5 x 1,2 the next two sessions and progress from there.
     
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  16. Steve Freides

    Steve Freides Forum Administrator Senior Certified Instructor

    IMHO, many men can go directly from 16 to 24 kg. But many men can also get to pressing the 24 kg without the ROP.

    -S-
     
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  17. Stu

    Stu Double-Digit Post Count

    I'm 6 weeks in to my first round of ROP. I am using the 24kg for C+P and alternating with pullups or kettlebell rows depending on whether I'm at home or in the gym and using the 20kg for snatches and 28 or 32 for swings.. I have to say, I am loving this program, I can really feel my pressing strength increasing week on week and I get to 'play' a little bit on variety days.

    Today, I decided to do my first 'test' day and to my surprise, I managed 5 reps both left and right with my 28kg. The book mentions if you get 5 reps, you can use this as your new ROP pressing weight. Whats the format for this? Do you go back to the beginning and start again with the lower volume. Or would I be better completing the full 5 x (1,2,3,4,5) with my 24kg first? I'm currently only up to 5 x (1,2,3,4) on heavy days.

    Snatch test was hard!! I've never pushed my snatches before and it was a real eye opener as to how much the cardio systems and grip are challenged. I opted to only do the 5 min test and used my 20kg which I have been practicing with. I thought I managed the 100 reps when I was doing it but looking back at my video I think I miscounted a couple of reps. Anyway, happy with my progress. Ill aim for 150 in 7 mins 30 next and then on to the 200 in 10 mins before attempting with a 24kg.

    Here are vids of both tests if anyone is interested, happy to hear any feedback on form too.

    Clean and Press - 28kg test



    Snatch Test - 20kg (5min version)



    Stu
     
  18. Sean M

    Sean M Quadruple-Digit Post Count

    @Stu Well done!

    You can continue working up the 24kg thru 5 x (1,2,3,4,5). You may get a few for reps on your next 28kg test day.

    I myself responded better with bumping up the weight; e.g. starting back at 3-5 ladders of 1,2,3 (heavy day) with 28kg.
     
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  19. JamesPTA

    JamesPTA Triple-Digit Post Count

    I can second this. Finish 5x5 ladders and start again heavier with 3 ladders to 3
     
    Stu likes this.
  20. Stu

    Stu Double-Digit Post Count

    Thanks @Sean M

    Thanks @JamesPTA

    I think I will continue working with my 24 through the 5 x (1,2,3,4,5). One of my goals is hypertrophy and while ROP is not a hypertrophy focussed program, I imagine the higher rep ladders are going to induce more of a hypertrophy response compared to more strength focussed lower rep work.

    Stu
     
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