Kettlebell S&S: few notes from my training diary

[Pavel Macek]

I have spent last few months under the bar (PTTP!), summer was all about teaching and traveling (= easy DLs when the bar was available, swings, get-ups, pull-ups), September means back on track - and back to S&S (easy entry point: 24-28 in swings, 24-32 in get-ups).

Few notes from my own experience. Feel free to add your own.

• Swings done first - excellent "wake-up!" call. Lazy you (ok, lazy me) says: OK, skip the practice today. The other you (ok, me) says: OK, let's do just some swings. And after swings you do your get-ups, of course, and finish happy.
• Standards - I have 2 tricks to make sure each and every rep fullfils the standards: first, when I swing, I look forward on the top of the swing, and I want the bell to hit exactly the same height. Second, the building has to shake. Not high enough, no earthquake - no count, no heavier weight.
• My left hand is strong, the right one is stronger. I am looking forward to see the improvement in my deads when my left hand gets stronger as well. DL is a GSP exercise for me, I rarely pull mixed grip, and don't feel comfortable with the hook grip (yet), so grip strength counts.
• Swinging most of the time close to 1/2 of my bodyweight - 4 kg jumps work better for me.
• Get-ups done after swings - serves as "calm down" for me.
• 100% technique and "owning the get-up", each and every stage = very easy to jump weight. Whenever I wasn't happy with any of the stages, I picked up a lighter weight and have practiced the selected part until it got perfect. When I smile to myself and enjoy the movement, I know it is to grab something heavier. Moving well > moving strong.
• 8 kg jumps work better for me. Roll to elbow, you know the story of the unwanted Bruce Lee kick. Think of the centre of gravity of the bell and where it wants to be when you roll to elbow.
• I am curious to see the transfer from get-ups to benchpress - the transfer to heavy military press is already confirmed both from my own experience and experience of my students (5x5 heavy get-ups sandwiched with 5x5 heavy cleans, plus easy GTG military press = heavy military press, always.)
• Left hook and right cross feel kind of solid...

And how about YOU and your S&S practice?

 

[Tarzan]

I'm just trying to get my head around the second point you made Pavel.

"Not high enough, no earthquake - no count"

Is that your way of saying you require perfection with that weight for the swing before you progress to a heavier weight ?

& I don't bench press but any get ups over 24 kg really seem to translate to a solid hook or press.

 

[beephsupreme]

I have completed two sessions of 10 x 5 2h swings (24kg) and 1 GTU (16kg each side). Swings felt ok but without as much snap in the hips as I've seen in video. I don't think I'm turning into much of a board, either. I'll work on that. This morning I woke up feeling tight and a little sore from my lats to my hamstrings. Abs, shoulders & forearms not as much. Nothing really going on in the biceps or chest region.

 

[jrosto]

I am doing S&S 5 times/week. 3 on/1 off/2 on/1 off and this is working very well for me. I do body weight on my off days to work towards a couple bw goals that I have.

I really look forward to my S&S routine and can't wait to get started. I do one set of the warm up exercises. PGS with 16 kg, Hip Bridges, and 16 kg Halos. I only do the one set because I'm impatient to start swinging.

Should I temper my impatience and perform 3 sets of the warm ups as stated in the program?

I am currently swinging 20 kg. 1T - 1R - 1L -2T, or 1T - 1R - 1L - 1T - 1R - 1L - 1T. I strung my first perfect (at least felt perfect) set of 2-hand swings together yesterday. KB floating weightless the last 20% or so of the swing, packed shoulders, tight glutes and back, knee caps pulled up and hip hinge feeling like a pendulum. I know I'm still a little light for an "Average Strength Man", but will get to the 24 kg's very soon.

My TGU's are now at 16 kg. The first get up is not always the best, I get the floppy leg syndrom. Glaring at, and really focusing on the 'bell really helps with that. It seems I get stronger with each rep. It took awhile to be able to keep my elbow locked throughout the movement, but that has gotten much better with practice.

I can easily do the 90/90 stretch after the workout, the QL Straddle is very difficult for me though. I am working on it. I finish up with some hollow body dead hangs and continue on with my day.

I am going to slowly start integrating the 24 kg kettlebell into my swings starting next week.

My kettlebell log is here if you are interested in seeing how I've progressed.

 

[Pavel Macek]

I'm just trying to get my head around the second point you made Pavel.

"Not high enough, no earthquake - no count"

Is that your way of saying you require perfection with that weight for the swing before you progress to a heavier weight ?

Yes, exactly - perfection means both technique and maximal explosive power, every single rep. Every single swing is a KO punch.

 

[Anna C]

Pavel M, thank you for the notes, those are good. My thoughts from S&S practice this week: working on grip for swings, using hooked fingers and very little of the palm. On the get-up, focused on employing a trick we learned at SFG cert for military press: seat the handle of the kettlebell across your palm so it puts pressure on the bottom of your palm opposite the thumb - this helps activate the triceps.

I don't think I'm turning into much of a board, either. I'll work on that.

... lol. I know what you mean. It definitely takes practice. But this something you can practice anytime, throughout the day. Just activate that standing plank anytime you think of it, and you will get better at it.

jrosto, I usually do the 3 rounds of the warmups, but I vary how quickly I do it depending on how I feel. Maybe allow yourself to run through it fast if you don't feel much like you need it. On one of the 5 reps of each, really get the good out of it... i.e. 5 goblet squats, but on that last one, pry the hips apart, sink deeper into it, etc.; on the halos, do one very slow and the others quickly. Seems to me it gets to be more important as you move up in weight... I definitely need a certain amount of movement prep before I start swinging 24kg or more for 10 1H swings.

 

[Harald Motz]

My S&S coming back was two weeks ago. Had a pause of it for almost half a year. I made a commitment for myself to use 47k for my swings and 50k for my get ups (my 50k has a thicker handle, thus harder to grip, but has greater space between handle and bell that makes a better touching on my forearms doing get ups). Nine sessions again so far. How long I will stay I do not really know yet, but until the end of the year seems to be a nice time frame, knowing that s&s has great gifts to offer, the longer staying at it.

After many influencing posts about the heart rate I make extensive use of the monitor. My starting hr is between 90 and 100bpm. Currently I perform swings in 2hand - 1handleft- 1handright alternations, that makes 4 sets of twohand, 3 sets of onehand for each hand. For now it gives me the best of both worlds of 2hand versus 1hand swinging.

The 2hand shadow swings (weighing around 92k the 47k is a bit more than 50%, it is not the recommended 30% weight for doing that, but this is my fault) have some impact on the abdominals. They make a wall out of ripled bricks. I have the lats heavily engaged and the bell comes not very high. A set of ten of them is almost 2 seconds faster than the 1hand.
The 1hand the bell comes to shoulder height, tensing up in the lockout. The grip on my left feels tighter than two weeks before.

The swings give my hr a spike of around 50 bpm. When I terminated a set, it happens especially in later sets, that the hr is rising still 30-40 sec. after. I nose breathe deeply and a little bit of shaking for recovery. my hr is in the 140 - 150 range in its peaks. Swinging takes 20 - 30 min.

The get ups take about 20min spiking hr roughly 40bpm and do not have that great delayed hr spiking like the swings (4-8sec.), and hr comes down faster (while I am laying when rest breathing helps in this regard). They take 20min give or take 3mins.

By now I have to elaborate my frequency. Almost every day is to much, every other day feels better for me, although after the sessions I feel very fine, but to much frequency with the heavy weight adds up. Maybe I will be giving Pavel's suggestion to Ann C. a shot to do 5r x 20sets or 7r x 14sets.

The theme for me now is to make my s&s approach repeatable to be consistent for the next weeks (months) with the BeAsT. While doing so, I am convinced that the goblets, halos, swings and get ups will be giving me something back again.

 

[jrosto]

...jrosto, I usually do the 3 rounds of the warmups, but I vary how quickly I do it depending on how I feel. Maybe allow yourself to run through it fast if you don't feel much like you need it. On one of the 5 reps of each, really get the good out of it... i.e. 5 goblet squats, but on that last one, pry the hips apart, sink deeper into it, etc.; on the halos, do one very slow and the others quickly. Seems to me it gets to be more important as you move up in weight... I definitely need a certain amount of movement prep before I start swinging 24kg or more for 10 1H swings.

Thank you Anna, I will go back to doing three rounds of the warmups. I do spend a lot of time at the bottom of the GS, prying around and opening the hips.

 

[krg]

Harald - What weight do you do your goblet squats with? I have always used the same weight I swing with (32 kg currently). They feel great for my knees, but at 32 kg for 3 sets of 5 they are starting to feel pretty heavy and I only pry for one of the reps in the first set - after that I feel pretty loosened up. I think I saw Steve F advising not to pry once the weight got heavy on an older discussion.

You're also inspiring me to give the shadow swings a try.

In my own practice I monitor my heart rate - 10 swings with 32kg spike me about 30 bpm to start with and then 40-45 after 5-6 sets. However that is improving over time and time taken to get hr down is compressing. Amazingly the active rest (just shaking my arms about and walking around) helps it drop much, much quicker.

I have to confess I almost never stretch after swings - I have never really had the patience for it, but I will try and at least get the 90/90 stretch incorporated into the routine.

On get-ups (32 kg) my first rep usually feels a little awkward, reps 2-8 feel good and then on the last couple I have to fight the non planted leg floating up. This seems to track with strength development for me - when I first go up a weight I had to fight leg twitch (as I call it) for every rep.

Currently just doing the S+S twice a week on the variety days of the RoP with a few bottom-up presses thrown in. Pleased to see that the get-ups dont seem to be getting weaker.

Enjoying the thread, I really get a lot out of the SF community - thank you all.

 

[Harald Motz]

krg, for the goblets I use my 50k, so it is my working bell. I personally do not pry with the bell (I think Steve Freides is right in his advice. But I enjoy prying when I want to loose myself up a bit going down atg without a weight). Flexibility / mobility is not that of an issue for me, as I can get atg with an erect and straight back comfortably. I try to grab the bell hard and flex my lats really tight (elbows squeezing down). I go down, stay a few seconds there, take a breath, tighten all up again, exploding through my heels back up.

And good from you mentioning the stretches. I have neglected them, too. Another aspect I did only I think two or three times is the all out set.