Soy and testosterone

Sean M

Level 6 Valued Member
Curious to know how much protein he was eating before. I would think a big increase from any source would have a positive effect.
 

Dekapon

Level 3 Valued Member
Doesn't say what else he changed. He should have done one month with "normal" food and training and then one month with the same amount of training and calories and protein intake, but with more soy. Just lifting weights 6 days a week for a month instead of 3 days a week, would probably raise testosteron levels the same amount. And I wonder if just being out in the sun more in april ups hormone levels compared to march. "Spring feelings" and such. So he should have locked himself in a room with no windows for one month, and then one more month, but eating soy.

Link to Huffington post article about hormone levels in different seasons:
Yes, The Change In Seasons Really Does Affect Your Mood

So this doesn't prove anything other than eating soy doesn't kill you.. in a month... for this guy... :rolleyes:
 

Jeremykots

Level 4 Valued Member
Doesn't say what else he changed. He should have done one month with "normal" food and training and then one month with the same amount of training and calories and protein intake, but with more soy. Just lifting weights 6 days a week for a month instead of 3 days a week, would probably raise testosteron levels the same amount. And I wonder if just being out in the sun more in april ups hormone levels compared to march. "Spring feelings" and such. So he should have locked himself in a room with no windows for one month, and then one more month, but eating soy.

Link to Huffington post article about hormone levels in different seasons:
Yes, The Change In Seasons Really Does Affect Your Mood

So this doesn't prove anything other than eating soy doesn't kill you.. in a month... for this guy... :rolleyes:
He has quite a few full day of eating videos up
 

HUNTER1313

Level 6 Valued Member
I'm by no means condoning or encouraging this. I'm a meat, milk, and eggs kind of guy. Just thought I'd post it for a little debate.
 

North Coast Miller

Level 7 Valued Member
Soy has never been reliably shown to reduce T levels, it has fewer estrogen compounds by volume than cow's milk, no added hormones and no antibiotics. Also no residual lymphocytes from udder infections etc.

Where is the raging debate about cow's milk lowering T levels? The dairy industry has better PR and milk has a long history of use in the European diet, that is the only reason.

Whey has been shown to be the best single source of protein for muscle synthesis, but once you get into isolates, whey, soy, pea are all about the same, just depends on what your gut best tolerates.
 

Anna C

Level 9 Valued Member
Elite Certified Instructor
I was wondering the same. I've never heard anyone claim that soy lowers testosterone. But I HAVE heard it claimed that it raises estrogen. Would have been interesting if he measured estrogen level after consuming all that soy.
 

North Coast Miller

Level 7 Valued Member
Dear Lord, looking into it, hoppy bears have more phytoestrogens than soy. In fact many alcoholic beverages have active estrogen mimicking substances. This topic just got too rich for my blood, I don't wanna know anymore:

As described in the previous section,the congeners of two types of alcoholic beverages, bourbon and red wine,produced detectable estrogenic effects in OVEX rats, thereby confirming the hypothesis that alcoholic beverages contain biologically active estrogenic substances.....Alcoholic beverage congeners exerted estrogenic effects both in an exper-imental animal model and in post-menopausal women. •The estrogenic effects of alcoholic beverage congeners were detectable using a variety of estrogenic markers,including the pituitary hormonesLH (in OVEX rats and postmeno-pausal women), FSH, and prolactin(in postmenopausal women); uterus weight (in OVEX rats); and the estrogen-responsive liver proteins HDL cholesterol and SHBG (in postmenopausal women).•In both the experimental animals and the postmenopausal women,the changes in the levels of all estro-genic markers were consistent with the presence of biologically active phytoestrogens in the congeners.•Red wine congeners and bourbon congeners produced similar estro-genic effects in experimental animals and in postmenopausal women.
 

Bret S.

Level 6 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
Dear Lord, looking into it, hoppy bears have more phytoestrogens than soy. In fact many alcoholic beverages have active estrogen mimicking substances. This topic just got too rich for my blood, I don't wanna know anymore:
If you change your mind.. 'The anti-estrogen Diet' by Ori Hofmekler is full of good info.. in case you haven't already read it. (y)

It may fall into the.. "oh crap, wish I hadn't read that" category though.
 
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Dekapon

Level 3 Valued Member
You guys know that estrogen is a vital hormone for the body to function in both male and females in all mammals?

Here is a overview of the metabolism of estrogen in humans. The one up on the right is Estradiol and is important for basic liver and brain function. I wouldn't wanna live without it.

Estradiol - Wikipedia

...
Testosterone = GOOD
Estrogen = BAD
:rolleyes:
 

Bret S.

Level 6 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
You guys know that estrogen is a vital hormone for the body to function in both male and females in all mammals?

Here is a overview of the metabolism of estrogen in humans. The one up on the right is Estradiol and is important for basic liver and brain function. I wouldn't wanna live without it.

Estradiol - Wikipedia

...
Testosterone = GOOD
Estrogen = BAD
:rolleyes:
The way I understand it is:
Phytoestrogen = good
Xenoestrogen = bad

Apparently, from what I've read, the xenoestrogens are much harder for the body to deal with, phytoestrogens or natural estrogens are no problem?
 

Dekapon

Level 3 Valued Member
@Bret S.
Yes, if by meaning:
Xenoestrogen = seepage from chemical industries and micro-plastic in our water
and
Phytoestrogen= naturally occurring organic compounds similar to estrogen found in soy, rye, sunflower seeds etc.

Drinking untreated run-off water from the local pesticide/paint/styrofoam-factory is probably bad for you and the environment. Eating some tofu on rye bread is probably not and wont turn you or your frogs gay.

Not sure what eating a lot of soy does to a vegan bodybuilders instagram-following though, more scientific research is needed.
 

North Coast Miller

Level 7 Valued Member
Personally I am much more concerned about exposure to manufactured chemicals than to any more or less naturally occurring substances.

I can tell how much soy, or milk, or IPA I'm ingesting and just spread the load around so I'm not al ways consuming the same stuff. Environmentally I have zero idea what my exposure is, although I know for certain I am being exposed to all sorts of endocrine disruptors, in detectable amounts and theoretically functional dosages.
 

Bret S.

Level 6 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
Personally I am much more concerned about exposure to manufactured chemicals than to any more or less naturally occurring substances.

I can tell how much soy, or milk, or IPA I'm ingesting and just spread the load around so I'm not al ways consuming the same stuff. Environmentally I have zero idea what my exposure is, although I know for certain I am being exposed to all sorts of endocrine disruptors, in detectable amounts and theoretically functional dosages.
Yes, In the end there's no telling what kind of junk we're exposed to daily. Even before knowing anything about this stuff I avoided the cloudy plastic water containers.. if it tastes like you're drinking liquid plastic residue, you probably are..
 
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