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Other/Mixed Stronglifts 5x5 + S&S

Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
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No.
5x5 is too demanding to do in combination with anything else. I mean of course you can do it, but that would most likely result in subpar progress on both.
Pick one and do just that.
Most people here would say do S&S until Simple, then go for 5x5.
But nothing wrong with 5x5 and S&S afterwards.

Want to do swings and TGUs for their benefits? You can get most of them (e.g. mobility, flexibility, increased movement quality etc.) with light swings and TGUs. You'd miss out on the strength benefits by not going heavy, but you'll be going heavy on the big barbell moves, so you're more than covered in the strength department.
Just include 40-60 light swings and 6-10 light TGUs in your warm-up and you're good.

And btw light means light. If you e.g. can do TGUs with the 32, doing them with 24Kg isn't light, 12-16Kg is.
 
@StanStan You would have to be doing evrything outside the gym right. I could work until you start hitting the upper ranges of your lifts

I would do getups on Overhead Press day and Swings on Bench day before your Barbell work. On off days you could do Easy S&S practice depending how you feel.

Problem with do both is you will most likely do both poorly. Try it but start conservative on both programs.
 
Go with Starting Strength over Strong Lifts if you would like to also do S&S. Starting Strength is a 3x5 reps program instead of a 5x5 program. You'll greatly reduce volume and allow for S&S. You may want to keep S&S to 6 sets of swings to make sure the volume isn't to high, increase as you see fit.
 
Thanks for the feedback all. I thought S&S was designed to be done alongside any other training program (on different days maybe).

I might try Starting Strength then, as I could not live without S&S!
 
StanStan said:
Thanks for the feedback all. I thought S&S was designed to be done alongside any other training program (on different days maybe).

I might try Starting Strength then, as I could not live without S&S!
Click to expand...
If you try this, keep a good log and let us know how it goes please!
 
StanStan said:
Thanks for the feedback all. I thought S&S was designed to be done alongside any other training program (on different days maybe).

I might try Starting Strength then, as I could not live without S&S!
Click to expand...
First of all the following is not just aimed at you, but basically everyone who has the same kind of question and second I don't want to be a di.. here, just trying to help.

S&S was designed as a standalone routine, period.
Pavel says it can be done alongside another stength routine, but the intention was to create a standalone GPP routine that leaves room for things outside the gym (e.g. your sport or martial art).
When he says that you can reduce it to 2-3 days per week to combine it with another strength routine he probably thought about other routines than a beginner linear progression like 5x5 or Starting Strength.
Don't be fooled by SSs 3x5 scheme compared to 5x5. It's every bit as demanding IF you do it right.

You can combine S&S with something like 5/3/1 or Tactical Barbell.
Why?
Because with routines like that you'll be lifting submaximal weights and they are designed to be done with additional assistance exercises. Reduce the assistance exercises or cut them completely and then you can use S&S instead.
There's a reason why the linear progressions don't have assistance exercises.
There's simply no room for that. A lot of people fail at doing Starting Strength alone, because they don't follow the rules (e.g. don't want to gain some fat while doing it, therefore not eating enough).
What do you think happens if you want to add something to a routine like that?

During SS after only maybe 2-3 weeks you'll be basically lifting your true 5RM for 3 sets, not just 5 reps for 3 sets, but your true 5RM. Let that sink in. You're lifting your 5RM for 3 sets!
Then only 2 days later you'll be lifting that 5RM for sets again, but this time with an additional 5lbs on the bar. Another 2 days later the same again, but now there's 10lbs more on the bar and so on.

I have the experience of 2 failed attempts at SS (yes I added a couple of pounds to my lifts, but still consider it a failure) and one successful experience with Greyskull LP.
And back then I was quite fit and still in my early 20s.
Believe me you don't successfully do something like SS plus something else. The only way you do that is by using "under the counter"-supplements or being that 1-out-of-10000 genetic freak.
 
Kettlebelephant said:
First of all the following is not just aimed at you, but basically everyone who has the same kind of question and second I don't want to be a di.. here, just trying to help.

S&S was designed as a standalone routine, period.
Pavel says it can be done alongside another stength routine, but the intention was to create a standalone GPP routine that leaves room for things outside the gym (e.g. your sport or martial art).
When he says that you can reduce it to 2-3 days per week to combine it with another strength routine he probably thought about other routines than a beginner linear progression like 5x5 or Starting Strength.
Don't be fooled by SSs 3x5 scheme compared to 5x5. It's every bit as demanding IF you do it right.

You can combine S&S with something like 5/3/1 or Tactical Barbell.
Why?
Because with routines like that you'll be lifting submaximal weights and they are designed to be done with additional assistance exercises. Reduce the assistance exercises or cut them completely and then you can use S&S instead.
There's a reason why the linear progressions don't have assistance exercises.
There's simply no room for that. A lot of people fail at doing Starting Strength alone, because they don't follow the rules (e.g. don't want to gain some fat while doing it, therefore not eating enough).
What do you think happens if you want to add something to a routine like that?

During SS after only maybe 2-3 weeks you'll be basically lifting your true 5RM for 3 sets, not just 5 reps for 3 sets, but your true 5RM. Let that sink in. You're lifting your 5RM for 3 sets!
Then only 2 days later you'll be lifting that 5RM for sets again, but this time with an additional 5lbs on the bar. Another 2 days later the same again, but now there's 10lbs more on the bar and so on.

I have the experience of 2 failed attempts at SS (yes I added a couple of pounds to my lifts, but still consider it a failure) and one successful experience with Greyskull LP.
And back then I was quite fit and still in my early 20s.
Believe me you don't successfully do something like SS plus something else. The only way you do that is by using "under the counter"-supplements or being that 1-out-of-10000 genetic freak.
Click to expand...
To further this excellent point, in the Practical Programming book, Rippetoe discusses how this linear progression is the best model, but clearly says this for people who have not already experienced the beginner gains that are so great because of the weekly, rapid progress. Once you've done that, you can't always keep adding 5-10# or we'd all be breaking records. (thus why SS is frequently followed by his Texas Method) So figure out where you are... are you new enough that you can keep adding weight each week (excellent if you can, because this is your best progress of life), or have you already done that & need a more complicated, and slower progression. 5/3/1 + S&S I could imagine doing. So I agree, not so sure about SS or Stronglifts without each seriously compromising each other... Or just suck it up, do S&S until simple is owned, then move to the barbell & let 'er rip.
 
I’ve tried this. Even at lower levels it won’t last. S&S is fine combined with cardio, martial arts, some physical work, etc. but resistance training? Nah. You’re going to spend a lot of time getting better at multiple things half as fast and efficiently as you would focusing on them directly. If you absolutely have to, do one for a week and then the other the next. Repeat. It’s far from ideal but can work. Just realize that the more you focus in one targeted direction without distraction the more likely you are to get there “quickly” and safely. Don’t be afraid to change it up or swap off but do be concerned about mixing everything together and expecting it to work. Unless you’re a genetic stud with an amazing diet and amazing recovery your results won’t be what they could be.
 
Stronglifts 5x5 was the first program I ever followed. I followed it strictly for about a year and then came back to it later and followed it for another year before discovering Stuart Mcrobert

The Stronglifts 5x5 starts out quite light if you are doing it by the book (basically the bar), but soon you will be racing to keep up with the Squat volume and will not dream of doing S and S on your offdays

that being said I think goblet squats with a light KB are a great way to warm up for stronglifts before you do the squatting. I wish I had known about goblet squats when I ran it back then.

also please don't be afraid to cut the volume on the 5x5 squats to 3x5 when your progress starts to halt. or simple do the program twice a week instead of 3x.

I would not even suggest adding pullups and dips to your workout, like the program says you can. the program is quite full and you can spend years just working those 5 lifts
 
If you pick 5 x 5 and want to work kettlebells in, do some "practicing" on your days off. Similar to the Rite of Passage variety days.

If you really, want to do both and it seems you do because you're looking for the ok...

You can use S+S as a finisher program after a workout. I've done it, and didn't find doing some goblet squats, 10 getups and 100 swings is too taxing or overtraining. I used it for the conditioning.

The only downside is you might not progress as quickly.
 
Nate said:
To further this excellent point, in the Practical Programming book, Rippetoe discusses how this linear progression is the best model, but clearly says this for people who have not already experienced the beginner gains that are so great because of the weekly, rapid progress. Once you've done that, you can't always keep adding 5-10# or we'd all be breaking records. (thus why SS is frequently followed by his Texas Method) So figure out where you are... are you new enough that you can keep adding weight each week (excellent if you can, because this is your best progress of life), or have you already done that & need a more complicated, and slower progression. 5/3/1 + S&S I could imagine doing. So I agree, not so sure about SS or Stronglifts without each seriously compromising each other... Or just suck it up, do S&S until simple is owned, then move to the barbell & let 'er rip.
Click to expand...


For what it is worth I've done KBs with 5/3/1 and it worked with High School Athletes, and 100 swings via the Simple model is very doable.
 
531 Forever uses kbs in the Krypteia option and as general active recovery on of days. Just have to device how you want to spend your limited "training dollars".
 
Lost of good feedback. The bottom line is: it works for some.

For the time being, my training dollars (great expression BTW) are to be spent on S&S, at least 4 times a week, until it gets stale. The other programs seem be too taxing to do in addition to S&S. Also, I have zero experience with barbells, so the learning curve is going to be pretty steep.

Thanks again - will revisit the idea after the 40kg KB is fully owned.
 
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