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Kettlebell Sumo is cheating

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Adachi

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Well, color me conflicted.

Today I had another 5 series Q&D day on the docket, and I discovered last week that moving to a wider stance in the snatch did 2 things for me, it helps avoid the bell touching my inner thigh, and also - apparently helps the bell feel like it's flying higher and lighter. now, I say that, but I have some competing thoughts.

is this a lower range of motion, maybe my arm straight up and straight down is the same change in altitude, but am I not limiting the range of motion in the knees and hips? changing several angular relationships, and ultimately changing what range of muscle activation is available at the crucial moment in time?

I am reminded by my memory, that Chase Lindley had pressed 405lbs overhead, at his meet (at 242lbs body weight). Mark Rippetoe could not help but remark about how many complaints he was brought about how much layback was a part of the movement used to get the weight up. But he got it up - not the commentators. So, that's mostly how I feel about that. He did it. Not me.

Now, I have an example - for myself to experience and think about, that my feet sprawled out somewhere just beyond shoulder width quite clearly makes my snatches faster and more powerful.
  • the time of each set decreased.
  • over-speed reps were more accessible.
  • the grip and bicep were challenged more than usual because they were so much easier
  • the shoulder involvement at the top decreased.
  • the mere change in stance seems to have made today's 5 series day manageable
    • vis a vis intra-series/set/recovery
I am not quite sure what to think.
Did I get stronger? maybe
Did it feel like cheating? maybe
 
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...Isn't that how we're supposed to do it? Am I a cheater?
so, my legs are a little shorter than some others.
my Torso is a bit longer and my shoulders are a bit broad.
This (I guess) torso size probably has a lot to do with my relative success & ability as a tuba player; bigger torso->bigger lungs.(probably)
So, honestly, the angle of attack feels like it might look quite wide with my feet spread out.
and the toe angle approaching a more solid 90 degrees of deflection.
Knee's didn't take any notice, so I was guessing right about toe angle, I think.

(I should add a video when I get back home, I don't have a place to prop up my phone at a clear angle at the office.)
 
Was it legal and was it safe? If “yes” to both, you’re good to go.

-S-
I felt in control, the whole time; which - with snatches can momentarily come into question as I get heavier.
the first 32kg snatch I ever did was a test of strength and a leap of faith all rolled into one.

My impression from my proprioception was that the reps were both legal, and safe.
I think a posted video will likely cement my relief from any concerns I may have.
 
and the toe angle approaching a more solid 90 degrees of deflection.
Does that mean that if looking straight ahead is North the right big to points East to and left big toe points West ? That is only just possible for me and no way could I do a snatch with feet in that position - does that indicate some sort of mobility deficiency ? My knees feel a bit twisted and tense in that position.

O r maybe it means LH toes point NW and RH toes point NE with long axis of feet forming a 90 degree angle ?

Or something else ?
 
Everyone has different anatomy. Perhaps yours is better suited for a wider stance. When I was at my SFG I there was a guy that had a much wider stance than I would have thought possible and he had very short legs.
 
Having not seen any video, a wider stance (within reason, which it sounds to be) is not all bad--and it is definitely not cheating. The external rotation of your hips will make a stronger hip extension easier to achieve by adding in more muscle mass. If you go **too** wide however, you will find yourself too stretched out to get any meaningful contraction from your adductors.

To answer your initial two questions:

Did you get stronger? Probably not, but are getting more glute and adductor muscle activation to help, making it a more total body exercise
Was it cheating? Not in any rule that I have read--which is ultimately "the thing."

In Strength Lifting meets (as you mentioned with Chase), lean back is allowed as long as the knees don't bend, and the bar never stalls in the ascent. I have seen Chase press 405 before in training. Whether you agree with the technique style or not, it is within the rules--just like a wider stance when snatching. (y)
 
Put yourself in an actual sumo position and try to snatch the bell then decide if its easier.

I don't think I could do a KB snatch if I use the actual full sumo stance I use on sumo DLs (barbell or KB).

On a power bar, my feet are placed under the power lifting knurl marks.
 
If my foot angle is right, it feels right.
If my foot angle is wrong, my knees let me know.
Hip anatomy / angle dictates it.
 
Put yourself in an actual sumo position and try to snatch the bell then decide if its easier.
High school weight lifting class... did a bodyweight clean with zero instruction on how to do it.

Very much a sumo clean variation. Would not recommend.

Glad that 17 year old me was able to bounce back easily.
 
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