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Kettlebell Swings and Get-ups Form Check - trap & shoulder pain after doing them

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Shoulder packing and stay a little bit ahead of the bell as it comes back down.

For the shoulder packing bit, at my cert we laid on the floor and were instructed to keep our arm tight to the ribs. A partner then attempted to pick us up by the arm a la deadlift. That's how solid to the body you want your upper arm to be.

This becomes even more critical on the snatch. Make the upper arm(s) part of the torso. For the shoulder packing, think about the shoulder construction -the contact area of the ball to socket is very small. The surrounding muscles need to hold the ball tight to the socket, compensating for the lack of surface area.

You can do this with cues re the shoulder blade or just concentrate on keeping any slop out of the joint while still allowing it to move - both serve the same purpose.
 
Hello @Marius_Lefter,

One thing I noticed in the swing video is possible excessive knee snapping, this can have a sneaky way of causing a sort of ripple of force effect through the body, starting at the knees and ending at the shoulders during the kettlebell launch while coming out of the hole. It's hard to describe this effect and I haven't seen much on it, but I believe these forces are in play here.
To remedy this I have people think of standing up as quickly as possible while patterning standing up after the deadlift motion. When done correctly the bell flies almost uncontrollably out of the hole using leverage mechanics vs conscious hip and knee snapping.
I think people are led to believe through video that swing power is created by hip and knee snap alone, to me these are only after effects of the quick stand motion, where the real leverage and pendulum effect create massive amounts of momentum.
 
@Pavel Macek had a post or article (couldn't find it) that describes the swing as a 4 count movement, rather than 2 count. It greatly helped me to clear the timing and arm connection. Working the 4 count with dead-stop swings corrected a disconnection I had on my left side and caused neck pain.

Yeah, yeah, I remember that. Is a youtube video, this one:

I will definitely incorporate it, slower, then faster, before some sets of loaded swings. Naked swings, a good workout even when you are in pain :)).

I saw that Zar Horton also has a video about this on Strong First youtube channel, and the S&S book has a few paragraphs here and there, with 4 photos associated.
 
YES.

In my opinion, the towel swing is the best tool for coordinating the swing. You are wise to use it again.
Shoulder packing and stay a little bit ahead of the bell as it comes back down.

For the shoulder packing bit, at my cert we laid on the floor and were instructed to keep our arm tight to the ribs. A partner then attempted to pick us up by the arm a la deadlift. That's how solid to the body you want your upper arm to be.

This becomes even more critical on the snatch. Make the upper arm(s) part of the torso. For the shoulder packing, think about the shoulder construction -the contact area of the ball to socket is very small. The surrounding muscles need to hold the ball tight to the socket, compensating for the lack of surface area.

You can do this with cues re the shoulder blade or just concentrate on keeping any slop out of the joint while still allowing it to move - both serve the same purpose.

I saw that drill done in videos online, I know about it. Unfortunately, no training partner in sight :(. But I know for sure that my upper arm IS NOT that close and solid to the body. I will squeeze my armpits and knees hard in a plank, maybe I can copy that sensation in this manner.
 
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Yeah, yeah, I remember that. Is a youtube video, this one:

I will definitely incorporate it, slower, then faster, before some sets of loaded swings. Naked swings, a good workout even when you are in pain :)).

I saw that Zar Horton also has a video about this on Strong First youtube channel, and the S&S book has a few paragraphs here and there, with 4 photos associated.


According my teaching experience, this is one of the most important things to understand in the swing.
 
Hello @Marius_Lefter,

One thing I noticed in the swing video is possible excessive knee snapping, this can have a sneaky way of causing a sort of ripple of force effect through the body, starting at the knees and ending at the shoulders during the kettlebell launch while coming out of the hole. It's hard to describe this effect and I haven't seen much on it, but I believe these forces are in play here.
To remedy this I have people think of standing up as quickly as possible while patterning standing up after the deadlift motion. When done correctly the bell flies almost uncontrollably out of the hole using leverage mechanics vs conscious hip and knee snapping.
I think people are led to believe through video that swing power is created by hip and knee snap alone, to me these are only after effects of the quick stand motion, where the real leverage and pendulum effect create massive amounts of momentum.

Thank you for your feed-back. I try to make the kneecaps go up, not back, and to cramp the quads without trashing the knees, but I saw that I cannot really be a board unless my knees are lock-out. I am sure that is a way to lock out without snapping the knees, maybe a slow motion movement first will teach me the firing sequence.
 
I am sure that is a way to lock out without snapping the knees, maybe a slow motion movement first will teach me the firing sequence.
So maybe replace some of the swing sets with deadlifts. They also allow you to spend long time in the plank position. Farmer carries can also work well for that.
 
When teaching the kettlebell swing to a new student, the 'bench drill' (taught after hinge/deadlift), and towel swing are probably the two highest 'bang for the buck' tools I use.

People start to really understand what you're asking them to do after learning these movement and momentum management techniques. Then it comes down to more fine tuning.

@Marius_Lefter one personal cue for me is when standing in the plank I play a mental game, the plank is my 'turf' and the heavy kettlebell is trying to knock me out of it. I hold my turf (plank) for as much time as possible, when the bell and forearms hit my hips it knocks me off of my turf momentarily, then I say 'oh no you don't' and reclaim my plank by quickly standing straight back up into my plank, again holding it for as long as possible.
Everybody has their own preferred mental and physical strategies, just thought I'd share one of mine if it helps you.
 
@Bret S., thank you for sharing such a personal cue with us.

When I look @Pavel Macek swinging 48, 56, 68 kilo bells, I just stand with an open mouth, look at the screen and drool ... poetry in motion.

Is not a swing, is a dance, a flow...such power...those bells fly so high, float, they are like rockets. I have yet to see someone swing a kb their bodyweight one-handed in such a manner. The bar is so high, real model to follow.
 
When I look @Pavel Macek swinging 48, 56, 68 kilo bells, I just stand with an open mouth, look at the screen and drool ... poetry in motion.

Is not a swing, is a dance, a flow...such power...those bells fly so high, float, they are like rockets. I have yet to see someone swing a kb their bodyweight one-handed in such a manner. The bar is so high, real model to follow.
Agreed
 
In my experience, I do most of my swings one armed. 32 kg bell, no pain or problems.
Two arm swings, my traps will hurt for a couple days. I think I pull my shoulders back a little more than necessary, when launching out of the hole.

Al
 
In my experience, I do most of my swings one armed. 32 kg bell, no pain or problems.
Two arm swings, my traps will hurt for a couple days. I think I pull my shoulders back a little more than necessary, when launching out of the hole.

Al

Well, that is interesting, and once I do them I will register if this is true for me also. But I am sure two-hand swings should not hurt either. We all should be able to do both types without pain. At least, this is how I see the point of arrival for this ballistic exercises.
 
In my experience, I do most of my swings one armed. 32 kg bell, no pain or problems.
Two arm swings, my traps will hurt for a couple days. I think I pull my shoulders back a little more than necessary, when launching out of the hole.

Al
Interesting! Mark Reifkind said that one arm swings seem to be a better fit for people with achy backs (like himelf) or tall people - whereas 2H swings seem to be easier to learn for the rest of the population.
 
@Marius_Lefter
You might also get a feel for better upper arm connection doing a thumbs forward two hand pistol grip hold, one hand wrapped over the other.

Have to watch out for any issues with possible hyperextension of the elbow. With two hands the risk is pretty minimal as it gives the joint a bit more support due to elbow staying higher on the torso throughout.
 
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