Other/Mixed Thoughts on running

[Gaz]

I have had problems with running throughout my training career. I always believed it was necessary, I served 30 years in the UK police. However, it was always my least favourite form of training because I found it boring but mainly because I often got injured doing it: nothing serious just annoying muscle pulls or tendinitis. I’m 63, reasonably fit for my age, passed my SFG1 last year.

I started a running programme a few months ago after not having run for a few years, and before long had to stop with a pulled calf muscle. However, I have recently read a book called “Born to run” by Christopher McDougal, all about ultra marathons and running barefoot or in minimalist shoes. It suggested that the reason people get so many injuries through running is because of modern running shoes.

So I thought I would try to do some running in my minimalist shoes I wear for Kettlebell practice. Today was day 1 of a couch to 10k programme that I thought I would use to get into running in minimalist shoes. All it called for today was 6 sets of 4 minute brisk walk and 1 minute run. I thought 6 minutes of running was no big deal, however I seem to have aggravated my left Achilles’ tendon!

So my questions to you fine people are. How necessary do you think running is to overall fitness - can you be considered fit if you can’t run? Do I persevere or do I finally decide that running is just not for me?

I will be interested in your thought.

 

[Tom Watson]

1. What defines being fit? I would say you’re fit enough to pass SFG1. You are 63, retired from UK police force (even though I live in USA, thank you for your service), what are your overall goals with respect to training? This is what you should ask yourself.
I am 30 years old, currently a firefighter/EMT and my kettlebell training is geared towards supporting my abilities as a firefighter.
2. I don’t like to run either. Never did. Instead, I use ruck training with a 60lb adjustable vest. @Al Ciampa has some good articles on ruck training and it’s benefits. I would recommend checking out his articles.

 

[Gaz]

1. What defines being fit? I would say you’re fit enough to pass SFG1. You are 63, retired from UK police force (even though I live in USA, thank you for your service), what are your overall goals with respect to training? This is what you should ask yourself.
I am 30 years old, currently a firefighter/EMT and my kettlebell training is geared towards supporting my abilities as a firefighter.
2. I don’t like to run either. Never did. Instead, I use ruck training with a 60lb adjustable vest. @Al Ciampa has some good articles on ruck training and it’s benefits. I would recommend checking out his articles.

Many thanks Tom for being one of the good guys and for replying. You’re right, I really do need to remember that fitness takes many forms and to focus on my goals.

 

[Antti]

No, one does not need to run to be fit. No need to feel bad about it, at least if you don't like running.

Can running be great? Yes, it often is. Is it for everyone? No.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

I have had problems with running throughout my training career. I always believed it was necessary, I served 30 years in the UK police. However, it was always my least favourite form of training because I found it boring but mainly because I often got injured doing it: nothing serious just annoying muscle pulls or tendinitis. I’m 63, reasonably fit for my age, passed my SFG1 last year.

I started a running programme a few months ago after not having run for a few years, and before long had to stop with a pulled calf muscle. However, I have recently read a book called “Born to run” by Christopher McDougal, all about ultra marathons and running barefoot or in minimalist shoes. It suggested that the reason people get so many injuries through running is because of modern running shoes.

So I thought I would try to do some running in my minimalist shoes I wear for Kettlebell practice. Today was day 1 of a couch to 10k programme that I thought I would use to get into running in minimalist shoes. All it called for today was 6 sets of 4 minute brisk walk and 1 minute run. I thought 6 minutes of running was no big deal, however I seem to have aggravated my left Achilles’ tendon!

So my questions to you fine people are. How necessary do you think running is to overall fitness - can you be considered fit if you can’t run? Do I persevere or do I finally decide that running is just not for me?

I will be interested in your thought.

Do you know what the "drop" in mm on your regular shoes are?

Six minutes of running is too much to start off with particularity with a high drop to a low drop shoe.

 

[Bauer]

I have had problems with running throughout my training career. I always believed it was necessary, I served 30 years in the UK police. However, it was always my least favourite form of training because I found it boring but mainly because I often got injured doing it: nothing serious just annoying muscle pulls or tendinitis. I’m 63, reasonably fit for my age, passed my SFG1 last year.

I started a running programme a few months ago after not having run for a few years, and before long had to stop with a pulled calf muscle. However, I have recently read a book called “Born to run” by Christopher McDougal, all about ultra marathons and running barefoot or in minimalist shoes. It suggested that the reason people get so many injuries through running is because of modern running shoes.

So I thought I would try to do some running in my minimalist shoes I wear for Kettlebell practice. Today was day 1 of a couch to 10k programme that I thought I would use to get into running in minimalist shoes. All it called for today was 6 sets of 4 minute brisk walk and 1 minute run. I thought 6 minutes of running was no big deal, however I seem to have aggravated my left Achilles’ tendon!

So my questions to you fine people are. How necessary do you think running is to overall fitness - can you be considered fit if you can’t run? Do I persevere or do I finally decide that running is just not for me?

I will be interested in your thought.

Back in the day, when Born to Run came out, I tried minimalist running and was on the google forum. The transition is not easy and not for everyone. You need a different technique and your body is likely not prepared for it. Personally I prefer Zero Drop shoes but with some cushioning. But I also have a Greek foot (Morton's foot) and cannot run for longer times because my second metastarsal will take too much of the load.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

Back in the day, when Born to Run came out, I tried minimalist running and was on the google forum. The transition is not easy and not for everyone. You need a different technique and your body is likely not prepared for it. Personally I prefer Zero Drop shoes but with some cushioning. But I also have a Greek foot (Morton's foot) and cannot run for longer times because my second metastarsal will take too much of the load.

I started off with Nike Free's when they first came out, late 90's early 2000's ? Gradually built up with those then did same thing barefoot on a WoodWay treadmill. Then some jogging on grass, barefoot. I currently use Altra Solstice and Vanish XC for everything. I took my time and always had a good base. Someone just starting out will need to be smart about it.

 

[offwidth]

Like the others have said it really does depend upon ones definition of fitness. And related... fit for what? Full disclosure... I am a big proponent of running and have been a ‘runner’ for 4-1/2 decades; some of it quite serious. (Although I seem to have backed off a bit in favour of other aerobic modalities)

Have I had running injuries? You bet! For me anyway, the benefits have always far outweighed any risks.

I have never had any issues with ‘modern running shoes’ (except for a few years of really goofy designs...) (and... I am missing some toes due to a climbing accident)

I suppose I am in the camp that says if you don’t run (at least some) then you are missing a component of overall ‘fitness’. (But then again... I don’t deadlift and some folks could rightly argue I am missing out there...)

At the end of the day though... running is not for everyone...

 

[Anna C]

I have had problems with running throughout my training career. I always believed it was necessary, I served 30 years in the UK police. However, it was always my least favourite form of training because I found it boring but mainly because I often got injured doing it: nothing serious just annoying muscle pulls or tendinitis. I’m 63, reasonably fit for my age, passed my SFG1 last year.

I started a running programme a few months ago after not having run for a few years, and before long had to stop with a pulled calf muscle. However, I have recently read a book called “Born to run” by Christopher McDougal, all about ultra marathons and running barefoot or in minimalist shoes. It suggested that the reason people get so many injuries through running is because of modern running shoes.

So I thought I would try to do some running in my minimalist shoes I wear for Kettlebell practice. Today was day 1 of a couch to 10k programme that I thought I would use to get into running in minimalist shoes. All it called for today was 6 sets of 4 minute brisk walk and 1 minute run. I thought 6 minutes of running was no big deal, however I seem to have aggravated my left Achilles’ tendon!

So my questions to you fine people are. How necessary do you think running is to overall fitness - can you be considered fit if you can’t run? Do I persevere or do I finally decide that running is just not for me?

I will be interested in your thought.

I can sympathize. Used to be a decent runner, laid off for a few years, have been trying to start again this past 6 months or so, but the going is VERY slow.

My best advice is to be very, very patient and just keep after it, increasing volume and speed extremely gradually, especially if you do other types of training and you are trying to progress with those. Enjoy the process. I try to keep the HR low, but it's a struggle to even stay under MAF HR with any speed of jogging.

As for the shoes, I try to split the difference -- I walk in minimalist shoes (with occasional short jogs interspersed sometimes), and job/run in running shoes. I've recently started back with foam rolling the calves and that seems to be helpful.

I think you can be considered fit if you don't run, yes. I'm a decent cyclist and pretty strong. But the only way to be fit for running is to run, fit for hiking is to hike, fit for swimming is to swim... etc. As to whether to persevere, like many things, those who have will say yes, those who have fallen by the wayside will say no. You will have to decide for yourself! But the way I like to think about it is this: If I enjoy the time doing it and don't injure myself, it's time well spent, whether I get anywhere with it or not. So going slow is helpful for both of those things.

 

[WhatWouldHulkDo]

To my personal definition, yes, you need to be able to run (without getting hurt) in order to be fit. To me it's kind of a basic human movement.

But the real question is how far, how fast. I think this is where people get into trouble. If your definition of fit means a 20-minute 5k... well, simple truth is that I'll never be fit by that definition. To me, if you can run for 30 minutes continuously - I don't care what speed, but actually running, not power walking or shuffling your feet - and not get hurt (that is key!), then you're probably fit enough for the demands of average life. I suspect that most people who train regularly in some fashion can probably pull that off, even if they aren't regular runners.

So, I think it comes down to swallowing the old pride and coming to terms with "yeah, I'm slower than dirt, but I'm still going to get this done".

 

[offwidth]

Exactly this:

To me it's kind of a basic human movement.

 

[kiwipete]

Kia ora @Gaz!

I think you do need some running in your training if you want to be 'fit' according to my definition.

But I'm more curious to know...

- What does 'fit' mean to you specifically? Fit for what?

- And with running - what does 'running' mean to you, specifically?


From my perspective I'm happy with jogging at a slow pace most of the time in training (think 12-14 min miles).

However, because I'm sensible about where & when I 'spend' my fitness I can still smash the obstacle course at work (police) and do a semi- reasonable 5km time.

I'm clearly no olympic athlete and my genetics for sport are nothing special - but without some form of running (and strength training of course) there's NO way I'd have the physical options that I do.

No amount of rowing / cycling / cross trainer is going to give me that capability.

Now if you said, "I hate running, what can I do instead?" I'd look at what @pet' has mentioned.

Hiking with a pack + sprints each week. Obviously working within your current abilities and building from there is probably the next best option.

 

[Gaz]

Do you know what the "drop" in mm on your regular shoes are?

Six minutes of running is too much to start off with particularity with a high drop to a low drop shoe.

The normal running shoes are about 40mm at the heel narrowing down to about 20mm towards the toe. The minimalist as are Vivo Barefoot and are about 5mm throughout.

 

[Gaz]

Kia ora @Gaz!

I think you do need some running in your training if you want to be 'fit' according to my definition.

But I'm more curious to know...

- What does 'fit' mean to you specifically? Fit for what?

- And with running - what does 'running' mean to you, specifically?


From my perspective I'm happy with jogging at a slow pace most of the time in training (think 12-14 min miles).

However, because I'm sensible about where & when I 'spend' my fitness I can still smash the obstacle course at work (police) and do a semi- reasonable 5km time.

I'm clearly no olympic athlete and my genetics for sport are nothing special - but without some form of running (and strength training of course) there's NO way I'd have the physical options that I do.

No amount of rowing / cycling / cross trainer is going to give me that capability.

Now if you said, "I hate running, what can I do instead?" I'd look at what @pet' has mentioned.

Hiking with a pack + sprints each week. Obviously working within your current abilities and building from there is probably the next best option.

As I’m getting old I want to be able to keep increasing strength, keep mobile and as pain free as possible and be able to continue for as long as possible with an active life. I like to walk a lot, I have two dogs, and until the Covid 19 crisis struck I did HEMA twice a week. I want to be able to resume HEMA as soon as it re starts but also want a bit in reserve to deal with emergencies should they arise.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

The normal running shoes are about 40mm at the heel narrowing down to about 20mm towards the toe. The minimalist as are Vivo Barefoot and are about 5mm throughout.

20mm drop to a zero drop, big difference. Pay attention to lower leg and ankle flexibility, roll bottoms of feet with a lacrosse ball. Take short walks or do errands in your Vivo's if you aren't already. Once you can consistently walk your dogs in your zero drops without achilles or other issues try waving in a few jogs during your walks when your are plenty warmed up.

 

[ShawnM]

I don't run do to knee issues but I do walk quite a bit. I switched Altra trail running shoes. There's near zero drop but there is a ton of padding and while I don't have a ton of natural padding in my knees, I don't have a ton of pain after a 5-6 mile walk.

 

[Don Fairbanks]

I don't run do to knee issues but I do walk quite a bit. I switched Altra trail running shoes. There's near zero drop but there is a ton of padding and while I don't have a ton of natural padding in my knees, I don't have a ton of pain after a 5-6 mile walk.

I dig the Altra's, all are zero drop with a wide toe box and they have 3 levels of cushion depending on your preference.

 

[John K]

There are always exceptions but in general running isn’t bad... but how you run might be. Just like squatting or swinging. There’s been good comments so far, and I’ll just reiterate that “barefoot” running needs to be Slowly worked in to. Start with just walking and short short runs. Work on running form. For me calf tightness is normal with my barefoot running so I’ve learned to become very comfy in a deep squat to stretch the calves out.

To answer your other question - yes I think running is a requirement for General fitness. It is a basic human skill like squatting or walking. Folks can come up with work arounds, and to each their own. You don’t HAVE to run to lead a happy and healthy life... I was a decent runner, got a bad injury, didn’t run For years. I’m odd and truly love running and even tho I’m slow as molasses I love it and miss it when I take time off.

 

[offwidth]

There are always exceptions but in general running isn’t bad... but how you run might be. Just like squatting or swinging. There’s been good comments so far, and I’ll just reiterate that “barefoot” running needs to be Slowly worked in to. Start with just walking and short short runs. Work on running form. For me calf tightness is normal with my barefoot running so I’ve learned to become very comfy in a deep squat to stretch the calves out.

To answer your other question - yes I think running is a requirement for General fitness. It is a basic human skill like squatting or walking. Folks can come up with work arounds, and to each their own. You don’t HAVE to run to lead a happy and healthy life... I was a decent runner, got a bad injury, didn’t run For years. I’m odd and truly love running and even tho I’m slow as molasses I love it and miss it when I take time off.

We have a saying in climbing... “It doesn’t have to be fun to be fun”

 

[Gaz]

Thanks for all the advice and opinions. You have all given me food for thought. I’ll re-appraise the situation while my Achilles’ tendons heal. At least I can still train with my trusty Kettlebells.