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Other/Mixed Total Package for Operators

Other strength modalities (e.g., Clubs), mixed strength modalities (e.g., combined kettlebell and barbell), other goals (flexibility)
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kidchaos4

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I was reading the total weekly package template article (2+2 program) and in the comments someone was asking about changing it for Operators.

Whilst pavel Gave us an exercise selection: here's, swing, snatches, pull-ups, presses and pistols, the askers concern was with the endurance work; swimming, running and rucking.

I was wondering how people would go about programming that?

If guess for an operator, you would simply add in low level aerobic work on the off days or before the grinds and ballistics.so like jogging, but at low heart rates.

Another military application is selection prep.

Rucking and running would be added in the same way, but the high rep cals? Could you put that on the conditioning days due to their high reps?

Just something to get discussion going.

Cheers!
 
I know you are asking more about adding to it rather than changing the program, but this is great advice: When Changing a Program Is, and Isn't, OK

With that said, I think the way you would implement the conditioning would depend on your current weakness and what goals you have. If you want to just maintain some rucking ability, do it as written and add a 4-8 mile ruck on the weekend.

If rucking is a priority, this is not your program. This is...Military Deployment Prep: A Program for Hardening the Soldier - StrongFirst.

Of course remember "operator fitness" may be more than a few weeks workout. Being an "operator" would be a several year commitment. For selection you probably want to get really sport specific as your test approaches. After selection I would revert to a more "GPP" approach and work on weaknesses. Then as a deployment approaches, you might need to get more "sport specific" again.

A typical year for me would probably include a strength focused period where I would use Tactical Barbell and only ruck once a week or even less. I like to do Pavel's Force Recon workout for a few weeks out of the year. The majority of my training these days looks a lot like Al Ciampa's program I linked to above. The 2+2 Total Package would be great to incorporate at some point in an operator's career, but be careful to not try to change it into something that Pavel never intended for it to be.

I would love to have one "Ultimate Operator Workout" that I could follow year round and would keep me in super shape for all things at all times, but that is simply not reality. Like Dan John says Q2 is about managing compromises.

Hope that gives you some ideas. Just my thoughts from my experience in the USMC infantry, later in a sniper platoon, and now in the mechanized infantry. All three have had unique fitness requirements to adapt to.
 
Hi Dave, love hearing your input, very helpful as always :)

Yep the world isn't perfect so changing programs is necessary to suit needs.

I've been trying to come up with something for my unit, since in the army in Singapore, we basically follow a program with not much thought except for the fitness tests, with some ruck marches thrown in here and there, and an O course or two. Most of our PT sessions are endurance runs and intervals, with cals at the end.

Looking for ways that my guys can do well on their tests, yet be operationally ready for infantry operations and the training exercises we go through.

Sigh... Army tradition will more than likely win though.
 
Sigh... Army tradition will more than likely win though.

"Just because we've always done it this way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid..."

@kidchaos4, if you crack the code on the ultimate operator plan, please let me know. I'd like to hear how you integrated it all. What are your events?

@Dave0317, that is an awesome article from Mr. Ciampa, are you doing exactly that? What are you hike distances and weight? Have you done ROP?
 
Institutional inertia is huge. I've found that like marksmanship, someone has to want to improve and enjoy improving strength and fitness to dedicate the time necessary to do so. Especially true for reservists. I'm going to try hard not to rant for too long here...

The standard PFT is part of the problem in my opinion. They set a low bar to "pass" and junior soldiers have a hard time seeing how the test is relevant to their jobs.

The idea of a better test comes up every few years, and is usually shot down after a few months. The USMC has made a huge leap forward with the Combat Fitness Test. The US Army refuses to implement something similar for some reason. Ammo cans and sand to put in them are the only real equipment requirements. I'd love to see the TSC or "Operator Ugly" become a yearly test, but I also understand the equipment costs would be huge. As it stands now, the CFT may not be perfect, but it's the best thing going.

We can't change the Army, and the Army won't change the test, we will just have to start where we can. You mentioned coming up with a unit program...exactly the place to start. Changing a units fitness culture will be up to the team leaders, squad leaders, and platoon sergeants to encourage that mindset. I'm still working out how to best do this in my unit. I'll follow up on this soon...

To answer your question Miguel, I don't follow that program word for word,rep for rep, but the general template and exercise selections I do. Which is really his intent I think, it is a template with some ideas for rep schemes that will change slightly depending on ones needs and available resources. For example he says the crawling, get ups, swings, and rucking is critical; the pull ups, presses, and DLs are great to add if you can.
I often only have time for one ruck a week. If I can only ruck once that week, I'll aim for 6 miles with 35 pounds. Very do-able and repeatable every week for me. I feel that without a specific goal in mind that one ruck is enough to maintain a decent level of fitness with that. The swings and get ups I do almost daily. Crawls are my warm up and cool down. I press and pull up more often than I deadlift. I feel the swings do a lot to maintain my DL strength, so I don't worry about DLs too much. I don't really do the typical 2-3 mile run/jog at all. I get a great PFT run time just by doing the ruck and sprints, which is exactly what Al Ciampa recommends.
Eventually I will want to focus more on strength again, and I'll switch to Tactical Barbell for 6-12 weeks. I will score between 280-300 on the APFT depending on how focused on all this I have been. 280 is more likely following this type of program to be honest. If I want a 300, I do have to do a little more focused work on push ups and sit ups.
I have tried the ROP before. I got to where I felt I "owned" the 24kg, but still could not press the 32kg (half body weight for me) once, so I moved on hoping to build some strength with other programs and come back to it some day. I can do 10 TGU with the 32kg and can press my body weight overhead on a barbell, but that half body weight KB just won't go up. I do love the ROP though. I may have to make that a goal for the summer.
 
Dave,

Sounds like a good, personalized program, with good results. I like the one hike per week as well.

As far as institutional inertia, I think a lot of it comes from disbelief. Look at Recon, Delta, SEALS, and PJs. All populated with guys "in pretty damn good shape". You know the sayings, nothing worth having is easy, if it was easy everyone would do it, etc. But what stops folks from even attempting or trying out? I feel like it's a disbelief in your body's ability to hike/swim/shoot like that, that stops people cold. "I got a bum knee/never been a good runner/can't swim/etc". And the senior leaders say things like, well, those guys are just freaks/mutants/whathaveyou and that's why they are in those units. Pish posh. They just worked harder.

I think if we can get our armed forces to believe in their abilities, we can make huge steps towards excellence. You said it, Dave, they have to want to improve, but with that desire I believe is coupled the belief that the skill is attainable.
 
Hey,

I currently have a training program, based on strict pull ups (5 x max reps) , hanging leg raises (5 x max reps), push ups (5 x max reps), squats (5 x max reps) and swings (max in five minutes). I use this program for several months but I'd like to change.

Then, on a GTG base, I'm working out OA chin ups. I also do some C&P, snatches and TGU.

I would like to change my progra, but I hesistate with two options (a short-term one and a long-term one)

Short-term: Dan John's 10000 swings workout. Does somebone have an opinion about it ?

Long-term (replace my current program by the following one). Is-it a good "general prep" (full body, strength, cardio) (more or less inspired from the weekly challenge)

Monday:
Weighted pull ups 3 x (1,2,3)
Pistol squats 3 x (1,2,3)
TGU 3 x (1,2,3)
OAOL push ups 3 x (1,2,3)

Tuesday:
my "swing challenge" (max reps in 15 minutes)
my "burpee challenge" (max reps in 5 minutes)

Wednesday: off

Thursday = monday
Friday = tuesday

Saturday, sunday = off

I am looking for any opinion you may have.

Thank you,

Kind regards,

Pet'
 
Hey,

I currently have a training program, based on strict pull ups (5 x max reps) , hanging leg raises (5 x max reps), push ups (5 x max reps), squats (5 x max reps) and swings (max in five minutes). I use this program for several months but I'd like to change.

Then, on a GTG base, I'm working out OA chin ups. I also do some C&P, snatches and TGU.

I would like to change my progra, but I hesistate with two options (a short-term one and a long-term one)

Short-term: Dan John's 10000 swings workout. Does somebone have an opinion about it ?

Long-term (replace my current program by the following one). Is-it a good "general prep" (full body, strength, cardio) (more or less inspired from the weekly challenge)
Pet,
What goals are you aiming for? Do you want to change your program because you're bored or because there is something more sport specific coming up? That would be the first thing I would be deciding if I were in your shoes. As far as your "short term" and "long term": the 10,000 swing workout is great and may present itself as a challenge to many but you should decide what you want to achieve from doing 10,000 swings. Also, the same for your "long term" plan: what do you want to get out of it at the end?
Just my $.02
-WF
 
Hey,

I have not any particular goal. I am only looking for a good "general preparation". I want to change my program because I am bored with the current one.

Long term means that I am looking for something which is sustainable:
=> don't be obliged to train everyday,
=> short (or relatively short) training sessions (because I train in the morning before going to work) so I don't have to wake up "3 hours earlier",
=> has to be a full-body training (I don't want to have too many weak points),
=> has to train both strength and cardio.

Kind regards,

Pet'
 
@pet', having some specific goals will help you be less bored - preparation, but for what? Easy Strength fits all your criteria - you can miss a day, you can vary the lifts but don't do that too often, choose full-body lifts, including swings. Look on Dan John's web site for articles about Easy Strength.

-S-
 
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