Kettlebell Training as we age

[KIWI5]

I base all my barbell lifting percentages on 90% of my 1RM or my 'training max'. I learned this from the outstanding 'Tactical Barbell' and Wendler's 5/3/1 has the same approach. So I will hit my 85%+ range once per month maximum- either singles across or sets of 3 across. I recover very well from squats/bench using this type of programming- but deadlifting takes its' toll! So I'm trialling the "Daily Dose Deadlift" technique now- but having trouble staying consistent. That's another story entirely. Also- it is fantastic that this thread has stayed on the 'main page' instead of being bumped deep into the 'Other' category/ 50+ zone.

 

[North Coast Miller]

I think I jinxed myself by posting about injuries. I have found that now I am more likely to get some random injury than when I was younger. Today, I was on my second set of pull-ups and BAM neck pain. Last month after a normal KB workout I had shoulder pain for ~4 days, and I still don't know what caused it. It seems like these small twinges or tweak happen way more often, and linger longer.

Last Summer doing swings in the back yard I felt/heard a "pop" in my hamstring - immediate serious pain. I stopped my session and made an appt to have it looked at. I'm thinking a couple months following surgery, but within days it felt 100% and I was back to training.

This sort of thing did happen when I was younger but was extremely infrequent. As I get older the reaction of disbelief is not there. My ability to accept it and whatever is needed to continue without stress is something I never could have foreseen. Having good health insurance is priceless...

--"Do not go gentle into that good night."--

 

[KIWI5]

Ah yes, half the 'fun' of growing older is discussing injuries and bowel movements. I will refrain from discussing bowel movements, but I've realized that I can no longer perform 2H swings. The pressure placed on my ribcage (by having both hands on the kettlebell) aggravates my historic costochondritis. No problem- I've switched to 1H swings. They are actually quite fun...as long as I do not aggravate my historic tennis elbow issues...but that's another story.

 

[Steve Freides]

no buffer, large buffer, etc

What does "buffer" mean in this context?

-S-

 

[Anna C]

One question I have for all you "masters" athletes is this - how often do you find you lift in the 85%+ range for lifts, how many reps do you do (eg no buffer, large buffer, etc) and do you find lifts closer to 1RM take longer/are harder to recover from?

I suspect I'm lifting in the 85%+ range now, on SS LP. The lifts are hard and I'm doing 5 sets of 3 (squat, press, power clean one session and squat, bench press, deadlift the next), but I'm still mostly recovering in 48 hrs and adding weight to the bar. (Training log)

 

[Nate]

Ive found that gua sha (or Graston/scraping) has been a total game changer for my recovery. My lumbar was locking up (not an acute pull though) and with scraping I was taking batting practice within 24 hours....
Anyone else?

 

[guardian7]

Great question. Yes, I discovered as well that there were lots of older people still doing impressive things on this site and it is motivating.

49 years old next week. Started training not just exercising as Anna put it well only in my 40s. Academic, sedentary job, but competitive soccer player in my youth up to college, so I had a foundation. Haphazard weight lifting in my 30s with little progress.

1. What changes have you noticed as you get older?

- Recovery is harder. Volume is lower, intensity is better as I get used to weight training. Higher frequency though over hard sessions. Longer rest periods even after pushup sets etc.
- I can't put off doing the mobility work anymore. It used to be a chore until I found Original Strength. I just couldn't commit to complicated mobility programs with a lot of floor space that I don't have. I roll around between sets of getups! And head nod after clearn and press. Those are good combinations.
- I appreciate just how important and beneficial my habits are as people I know are starting to get serious health conditions and DIE of totally preventable diseases.

2. How have you adapted your training?

- From dumbell bodybuilder sets to press ladders, more strength endurance focus.
- Added Muai Thai for fitness at 45 because I needed to move more and I read that power is the first skill to decline relatively as you age.
- I just did Plan Strong and will change everything except S&S!

3. Are you still getting stronger or focusing on maintaining strength?
- Just moved up a bell size on my ladders by only doing TGUs!
- Every winter for the past two years I do deadlifts three times a week to regain my double bodyweight Deadlift. This is a maintenance program as it is not a priority compared to martial arts.
- I have NO doubt that you can almost always keep improving if you train properly. Maybe not in something that you had an advanced level at when you are younger but you can try something new and get better at it. If you decide that your goal is just to maintain, I think you will lose motivation and actually decline. At least I would. Pick a new skill if you are getting discouraged that you can't do what you used to be able to do.

4. Has the emphasis of your training changed (e.g. strong endurance vs max strength, etc)

- Strength only rather than strength and hypertrophy. I like being leaner and eating less. I only realized it was possible while getting stronger a few years ago. Hypertrophy is a byproduct not a focus anymore. Strength-endurance (ladders). Martial arts and jumping rope for cardio with swings of course. I will add a hypertrophy focus back as age related muscle loss hits as I get older. It accelerates in your 70s I read.
- I actually train with goals for each season rather than just exercise year round.
- I do more grease the groove and bodyweight more than before. One set of pushups to technical failure before going to lunch. A set of pullups at the stadium on campus as I come back to my office after teaching. Taking the stairs at work every morning minimum. Little habits. bodyweight squats or calf raises waiting for the elevator when no one is around.
- I see the value of moderate exercise that I would have seen as a waste of time before. Walking to drain lymph and lubricate joints. The habits above.

The game changer for me was a book by Dan John. He explained that FITNESS DOES NOT EQUAL HEALTH, meaning that the "cost of adaptation" may actually hurt your health long term in the broad sense of the "optimal function of the organs of your body." Performance is perhaps a better word. I know a former varsity football player whose hips and knees are shot and who has never learned to eat appropriately for his reduced mass and needs. That is former fitness at the cost of long-term health.

This book really had an effect on me. Then I discovered hardstlye and the pieces were in place. I try to do things I can see myself not getting hurt and doing for a long time with the greatest convenience. For example, double KB front squats or heavy goblet squats for higher reps instead of barbell squats. Grease the groove and daily sets of pushups instead of bench pressing. KB press instead of barbell press (5/3/1) program hurt my shoulders after a while due to lack of mobility. I have my deadlift for hormonal/bone density/confidence building etc. however. Although I will have to hang up my boxing gloves someday, I will transition to a traditional martial art like tai chi or Korean sword until I can't get out of bed. In other words, I think what can I do that will provide a foundation and sustain for my workouts in my 60s and beyond.

Sorry for the length of the reply. Been thinking about this lately as 50 looms.

 

[Bret S.]

I'm just about 29, and don't feel I have the age nor training time to comment on this thread. I absolutely love reading this stuff though as my day job is working with tons of older adults.

One question I have for all you "masters" athletes is this - how often do you find you lift in the 85%+ range for lifts, how many reps do you do (eg no buffer, large buffer, etc) and do you find lifts closer to 1RM take longer/are harder to recover from?

I'm mostly in the 70% range and GTG'ing. Occasionally I'll hit a RM or some 85%+ sets. If you mean 'buffer' as warm-up sets I do quite a bit to get the joints nice and ready. Heavier lifts cost more in recovery depending on volume. If I keep lifts over 70% to lesser volume I have no problems and feel stronger doing my usual percentages. However if I do more volume at heavier weight with too much density I pay a big recovery price, maybe 3-4 days. Lately I've been plugging in some heavier weight interspersed within the 70% sets and pay no real recovery price at all.

I also practice karate technique the same as I've always done. Every technique I throw is 100% after proper warm-up. This has preserved power and speed as I get older. I haven't broken boards lately as I self train now and have no holders. Maybe I've lost some speed, not much, but my power and focus are better than ever.

As Clint Eastwood said, 'A man's got to know his limitations'...

 

[wespom9]

What does "buffer" mean in this context?

-S-

I tend to use that term in terms of "what percent of RM, but how many reps"? So if you are doing a 3RM, no buffer would be 3 reps. Doing a 6RM but 3 reps would be a high buffer. Kind of that SF principle of "do half as many reps as you could do", so from the sounds of it using a consistently high buffer in my weird lingo

 

[Steve Freides]

I generally follow the guidance in the PlanStrong manual about rep counts in different ranges. I don't have the manual in front of me but, if memory serves, its roughly 50% of max so, e.g., you might do sets of 5 with your 10 rep max, or double/triples with your 5RM.

OTOH, I have lately been experimenting with max reps on my deadlift, and did 10 x 265 lbs this past week, and after few days later, 9 x 285 lbs. Those equate to 1RM maxes, according to most calculators, of about 355 and 365, respectively, and 365 is my all-time 1RM. 285 x 9 is a set I posted as a video here in the double bodyweight deadlift thread, and I could have cranked out another rep or two, I'm sure. So maybe I've gotten stronger, or maybe I'm one of those people for whom the 1RM calculators are skewed - I tend to think the latter, or at perhaps both things are true. In years past, I have pulled a weight for 5 reps and then not been able to pull that weight plus 10 additional pounds for even 1 rep.

-S-

 

[Carl]

Great thread! Lots of gold here already.

For me (44) some changes have been:

- trying to avoid doing anything foolish
- tightening up form on everything (see above)
- becoming more process than outcome focused
- trying to really earn any increases in weight/reps (not force them)
- stopping sets as speed slows (if not before) except when testing max
- reverting back to where I started my journey with mostly (90%) bodyweight only strength work
- reading more from people that are ahead of me in years but still training and in shape (Steve Maxwell, Clarence Bass) and trying to learn from some of their wisdom
- trying to “do no harm” - see below
- trying to avoid doing anything foolish (yes, it made the list twice!)

THis post was inspired by a conversation on a different thread. I've been noticing some changes in my training as I approach 50 this December. Most specifically, I can tell that my body takes much longer to warm up than it used to. When I do KB Strong with it's ten sets of Double Clean and Press, these days I notice that I don't really get going until the fourth set or so and not uncommonly my last sets are stronger than my first few. This effect seems to be getting more pronounced over time. I'm also starting to think that I need to think more actively about recovery between workouts as they take more out of me than they used to.

Frankly, I was feeling a little discouraged by these observations until I noticed that some of the more active and knowledgable members of this forum are somewhat (or considerably) older than I am and still training with grit.

So, I'm love to know...
What changes have you noticed as you get older?
How have you adapted your training?
Are you still getting stronger or focusing on maintaining strength?
Has the emphasis of your training changed (e.g. strong endurance vs max strength, etc)

 

[KIWI5]

Great thread- reviewing the posts I've realized that with my wood chopping all but done for the year- I need more 'power' training. I don't think kettlebell cleans will provide enough 'power training' (they might?) so I will program in ball slams, power skips, power march and box jumps. I wish I could get away with just focusing on KB cleans and eventually long cycle clean/jerks, but I think I need more.

 

[offwidth]

Great thread- reviewing the posts I've realized that with my wood chopping all but done for the year- I need more 'power' training. I don't think kettlebell cleans will provide enough 'power training' (they might?) so I will program in ball slams, power skips, power march and box jumps. I wish I could get away with just focusing on KB cleans and eventually long cycle clean/jerks, but I think I need more.

Yeah, box jumps will do the trick...
Hill sprints work wonders too.
Prowlers, if you have access to one.

 

[KIWI5]

I am aware of the legendary Prowler (but no access to one) so I found a large 4WD tyre and drag it (filled with paving stones) using a strap and old weight belt- I suppose I would need to sprint drag to train power? I usually move at a deliberate walking pace with varied weights- but this would be strength training primarily?

 

[offwidth]

Yes, I think you would need to sprint for the power, but the slow speed dragging is great training nonetheless...

 

[guardian7]

Great thread- reviewing the posts I've realized that with my wood chopping all but done for the year- I need more 'power' training. I don't think kettlebell cleans will provide enough 'power training' (they might?) so I will program in ball slams, power skips, power march and box jumps. I wish I could get away with just focusing on KB cleans and eventually long cycle clean/jerks, but I think I need more.

I learned a lot from muai thai for fitness on the role of the hip in generating power. There is positive transfer to weight training. I suggest martial arts for power practice and training. Just get a heavy bag for a home gym if you can.
The bonus is just moving more. Weights are fun but we have to move more and do mobility as we age.

 

[vlam]

What is the best way to deal with the mental aspect with coming to terms with having to use lower kettlebell weights as one gets older? Should one attempt to give the heavier weight you were able to lift years ago another try, or is the possibility for injury just not worth it?

 

[Bunn]

What is the best way to deal with the mental aspect with coming to terms with having to use lower kettlebell weights as one gets older? Should one attempt to give the heavier weight you were able to lift years ago another try, or is the possibility for injury just not worth it?

Though I am not very old (47), I am also not that young anymore, I have started to think about my fitness in the long term and plan for it. I know that as I continue to age I will reach a point where I simply cannot do what I used to. In the moment that might give me a reminder of our mortality, and a flashback to days past. However, am I still strong, can I perform the tasks of daily living with relative ease with enough left over to handle the unexpected need, if the answer is yes, we are doing well. When I hit my 70's I don't think I will lament too much about having to use my 24kg for getups vice the good days of the 40kg, compared to my peers, I will still be the "fit" one.

I would offer that someone could work towards using the weights of their youth, but would certainly not recommend that be the starting point. Start where you are and work forward, listen to your body and adjust as needed. You might be surprised what patience and dedication can reward you with in terms of skill and the ability to move iron. It is certainly more of a marathon mentality and not a sprint.

 

[GeoffreyLevens]

What is the best way to deal with the mental aspect with coming to terms with having to use lower kettlebell weights as one gets older? Should one attempt to give the heavier weight you were able to lift years ago another try, or is the possibility for injury just not worth it?

At nearly 70 I've found my goals have changed considerably. So yes, not worth the injury. I don't compete in anything, haven't been in a fight since 8th grade (1963).... My goals are to stay fully mobile, active, and healthy until it all falls apart at the end. I train accordingly and funny thing, find I have been getting stronger, not getting injured (more than a tweak here and there), and not overtraining or getting burned out.

 

[Anna C]

What is the best way to deal with the mental aspect with coming to terms with having to use lower kettlebell weights as one gets older? Should one attempt to give the heavier weight you were able to lift years ago another try, or is the possibility for injury just not worth it?

It doesn't matter what kettlebell you use, or what weight you train with, as long as it's appropriate for where you are, and you are training to get stronger. It's just a well-selected tool to accomplish your training.

"appropriate for where you are" = you can do the selected movement correctly and competently, for the programmed reps/sets, and it creates a stress for your body that you then recover from, and get stronger.

"training to get stronger" = training consistently, resting and fueling appropriately between training sessions, and your training has progression; intelligently programmed increases of weight, reps, sets, etc.... so that your body then attains a new weight that is "appropriate for where you are".

Age isn't really a factor in all that, in my mind. I'm 51 and I'm intending to get stronger than I've ever been as I recover from the recent surgery.