all posts post new thread

Old Forum S&S Aftrer Larbum Repair Surgery

Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)

CamGump86

First Post
I have been rehabbing from a shoulder injury, and the subsequent Labrum Repair Operation (SLAP lesion, superior and anterior) for the last two years. Since I was under 28, the surgeon chose to anchor the Labrum, and preserve it's original structure instead of making the cut at the biceps tendon, which is more common. The difference is major between these operations, and the recovery time is much longer with the method my surgeon chose for the repair.

I am a trainer and before my surgery, I was always one of the strongest in my gym, but now I have been having a tough time lifting weight. The main problem has been severe pain in my shoulder, which limits my lifts, and poor mobility. For the last month I have been on the S&S program. I had to modify the getup weight at first because of my lack of shoulder mobility on my right side.

I am now using the 24kg for 2 hand swings, 100 in around 4:30 sec, and 16kg for getups 10 in 10:00. The workout is getting easier and I have been trying to progress to the one hand swing, but my shoulder feels very unstable handling the weight, and I feel the pressure on the anchors on my labrum. I am only able to handle one set of 10 on my right side with 24kg. I have tried the one arm swing with 16kg but it just feels like I am not activating my glutes and abs because the weight is light.  My PT is furious with me for using kettlebells at all and says the swing and getup will destroy my shoulder. I disagree because I have all ready noticed improvements in mobility, stability and strength. Do you believe it is safe for me to progress to the 24kg for one hand swings, or am I risking tearing my labrum again? I really can't afford another surgery, and the frustration that comes with it. Thank you.
 
im guessing people will say you need to work with a PT or doctor to figure out what you can do and not do.  if you dont trust your PT, try and find a PT that uses the FMS, dry needling, and/or powerlifts.

in general though, dont do what hurts, do what feels good and makes you feel like a better athlete.
 
Thank you for your response Daniel. I am FMS Certified as well and I have been applying many FMS concepts in my rehabilitation. I think you are right that I need a new PT! Unfortunately, money is an issue and my Kaiser insurance does not provide me with too many options. My PT thinks that lack of mobility will protect my shoulder. I argue based on Gray Cook's findings, that it will actually endanger my shoulder. Cook as you know stresses Mobility before Stability.  Since doing TGU's my mobility has increased as well as stability. I know it's hard to comment on something like this, but I am just curious for any info on TGU and One Arm Swing, for post Labrum Slap repairs in general. Thank you so much, and I hope to be able to continue the S&S program. I am huge fan of Pavel and his concepts.
 
you're a trainer so i think you have to find some cash and pay a top level trainer or PT to help you out; it is an investment that can pay itself off and leave you with better health.

if a trainer is all you need, i know Brett Jones posts here and may be able to work with you through skype.  he was great helping me train with a serious injury history and make me a better athlete. http://appliedstrength.blogspot.com/

as far as finding a PT goes, goodluck.  it is super hard to find a good one.  i've been to about two dozen myself.  and on wednesday i'm gonna make my 5 hour drive to see a PT i know to work with me.  :)
 
Thank you Daniel

Cameron - your Dr. may be being conservative for a reason - how you treat the shoulder may determine how "long" you get out of this repair.

Sounds like they were pretty aggressive in the work done but a PT that works with throwing athletes might be a good second opinion on your rehab etc...

Swings I think will be fine - shoulder level etc...

Partial TGUs to the elbow or hand - depends on your current ROM

any recommendations here are not to counteract any advice from your Dr. and PT - you are under their care

Have you had a detailed conversation about their perspective and demonstrated the Kb work so they can see what you doing?
 
Cameron, this is an interesting thread for me to read. I have a tear in my left shoulder’s labrum that I elected not to have repaired. (So far, I’m doing OK – here’s a link to my MRI report, which I typed in and then started to annotate - http://www.kbnj.com/ShoulderMRI.htm)

I want to speak to one point you made, “Cook as you know stresses Mobility before Stability. ” We have Brett Jones in this conversation and I certainly don’t mean to speak for either Brett or Gray, but “mobility before stability” is still a general guideline. Focus on what you need, especially in light of your injury, and not the general principle here.

When you say, “my shoulder feels very unstable handling the weight,” that suggest to me that you ought to, like anyone with or without an injury history, stick with a weight that provides an appropriate level of challenge – if that’s a light weight for a long time or forever, so be it.

My left shoulder gives me grief when it’s on the bottom of a getup, not the top, and I don’t do more than about a 12 kg getups on that side and I stay away from heavy getups on the other side, too. There are always other exercises, other paths one can take, and with an injury history like yours, you need to be open to having an exercise program that offers you achievable challenges without undue risk of further injury to the already damaged parts of your anatomy. Be open to that, and don’t be afraid to be creative in your exercise selection as your situation warrants.

Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.
 
Beleive it or not I'm going to encourage everythign Brett said, but with a little story.

At our facility we see several (upwards of 100/year ) post op shoulder patients.  WE work directly with the physicians that do the surgery and are involved from before the surgery actually happens. (This is a huge point - we and our physicians are on the exact same page.)  Swings, get ups, carry's, and various other KB drills classified as "problematic" by several are the staple of what we do.  Over the past 5 years, I can't recall one person who we have broken or ruined with this approach.  Our overhead atheltes are back to their sport in the 6-9 month range depending on several factors. 

Mobility before Stability isn't just a generalization - it is a cornerstone of how we develop movement and later strength. That would be a giant red flag for me if I'm paying someone to fix me who doesn't understand this.

The most important part of Brett post was the part about you being under the care of your MD and PT.  I would have a frank conversation with them.  If you don't like what the PT is doing or recommending, find a new one - I would guess your insurance gives you at least a few options as far as who they will allow you to see.  You may have to jump through hoops, but until you have been given the final release by your Dr. you need to do what they recommend. 

 

 
 
Brett, thank you for the response, I had a detailed talk with my PT, but he was not very receptive to what I showed him. As you know, people who haven't done swings before look at them as heavy front raises and think that you are using shoulders to get the weight up, when in fact it is mostly glutes and core. I think I am okay doing the get ups, I really feel my lats activating on both sides under the kb, and I took the lift from 8lbs to 16kgs in about 2 months.  I understand the importance of working under my doctor and PT, but I also really like the idea of seeing a throwing PT, of overhead specialist. I will be sure to do that. It seems like I am just not quite ready for a 24kg one arm swing. Am I better off doing one arms with 16kg or 2 hands with 24kgs? I feel like 2 handed 24kgs is a way better workout for me because of the glute activation I get.

Steve thank you as well, I hope that you are being careful because I would hate to see you in a situation like me. There are clear benefits to not having surgery, and if I could do it over I would have looked deeper into other options. I agree that creativity in programming is a must.

Brandon your facility sounds incredible! There is nothing better than having everyone on the same page. Gray cook also stresses that on his sports teams, and it demands better results. I am happy to hear that you have had good results with these exercises for post-op patients. What I am getting overall here is that I need to seek out more opinions. I am on my 3rd PT as it is, but I will keep looking and keep working out smart. Thanks
 
Status
Closed Thread. (Continue Discussion of This Topic by Starting a New Thread.)
Back
Top Bottom