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What to do after basic conditioning?

rickdalton

Level 1 Valued Member
Hello everyone,

I've been reading here for two years (a bit more). I am 39 years young and had open heart surgery two years ago. I was fitted with a mechanical heart valve and a pacemaker. I played soccer and a bit of tennis in my youth.

In the last two years I have been able to regain a good basic level of fitness by doing push ups, pull ups, burpees and kettlebell exercises.

My question to the experienced people among you:

What would you recommend I do to get strong and top condition?

I can do 20 clean push ups, 7 clean pull ups, 16 kg clean and jerk and 16 kg snatch.

My goal is to be able to handle 20 or even 24 kg well and to be in very good condition.

I look forward to your answers!

Rick
 
I'm guessing that people (like me) are (rightly) hesitant to give you solid answers given your medical history...

My general advice would be to build up time and reps w. the 16kg bells and when that becomes not much of challenge, then progress to the 20kg - nothing special about the approach. Of course, be sure anything you do is cleared by your MD.
 
I second Boris' input. Not knowing much about the heart surgery you had, I think the best advice we can give is for you to progress conservatively and work with your medical providers to make sure you are good to go. I can't see why you wouldn't be able to progress over time, since you are already doing calisthenics and some KB work. I am just hesistant to give specific advice.

Not knowing anything about open heart surgery or replacement parts to your heart, I (and most people here, I think) will be wary of giving you advice that might go awry. The best thing to do would be to find a physical therapist or personal trainer (preferrably a well-educated one) who is willing to communicate with your doctor(s). You might not even need to go to them regularly, but having some trained professionals give you clearance or any potential guidelines would be my first step.

If you have already been through all that with your doctor(s) and any trainers or PTs, then I suggest you let us know what you are cleared to do, and anything you know you need to be careful about. Once you know what you are clear to do, then we can give you better input about what you could do to progress.

Good work getting back in shape after that; I'm sure it was tough. And welcome to the forum.
 
rickdalton said:
Hello everyone,

I've been reading here for two years (a bit more). I am 39 years young and had open heart surgery two years ago. I was fitted with a mechanical heart valve and a pacemaker. I played soccer and a bit of tennis in my youth.

In the last two years I have been able to regain a good basic level of fitness by doing push ups, pull ups, burpees and kettlebell exercises.

My question to the experienced people among you:

What would you recommend I do to get strong and top condition?

I can do 20 clean push ups, 7 clean pull ups, 16 kg clean and jerk and 16 kg snatch.

My goal is to be able to handle 20 or even 24 kg well and to be in very good condition.

I look forward to your answers!

Rick
Click to expand...
How have you been training your snatch and clean and jerk? How have you been training your pull-ups and push ups? Are you training anything else?
 
Thank you very much for your answers, I'm really pleased.

I have a medical check-up every 6 months. I don't have any restrictions. As long as I don't go beyond my capacity. For example, I shouldn't keep running if I'm already exhausted.

Training with push ups, pull ups, burpees and kettlebells was the quickest, easiest and safest way for me to do something with my body. It feels really good for me.

I don't actually do much else. I go for a relaxed jog and walk the dog a lot.

I actually taught myself the exercises using mirrors and YouTube. At first I practiced clean and jerk with 10 kg. Just the execution. As I come from a tennis background, I'm no stranger to technical execution. It took me a long time to get better at it. But I have patience .

So TL;Dr:

No restrictions. Just calisthenics and kettlebells. In my opinion, these are simply the best methods for getting really fit and healthy.
 
rickdalton said:
Hello everyone,

I've been reading here for two years (a bit more). I am 39 years young and had open heart surgery two years ago. I was fitted with a mechanical heart valve and a pacemaker. I played soccer and a bit of tennis in my youth.

In the last two years I have been able to regain a good basic level of fitness by doing push ups, pull ups, burpees and kettlebell exercises.

My question to the experienced people among you:

What would you recommend I do to get strong and top condition?

I can do 20 clean push ups, 7 clean pull ups, 16 kg clean and jerk and 16 kg snatch.

My goal is to be able to handle 20 or even 24 kg well and to be in very good condition.

I look forward to your answers!

Rick
Click to expand...
I think you've already received some cautious and good answers + relevant questions.

What are your restrictions? Are you allowed to go to high HR and to spike your HR?

Without knowing more, I think that AXE type training (formerly known around here as A+A) would be a good fit for you. If you are worried about higher HR, you might omit phaes with "higher" reps per set. This type of training allows you to train stay away from too agressive conditions and to get a lot of quality reps in. (The book "AXE" covers the biochemical details.)

Personally, I would use this AXE type plan with the Clean & Jerk:
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The plan goes to 3 reps every 30 seconds. If you are worried about higher HR, I would stop at 2 reps every 30 seconds and just go longer than 30 minutes (40, 50 or even 60). This builds great strength and endurance.

This thread covers some ideas on how to vary this plan and people report great results:

"The Best All-Around Training Method EVER"- 6 months in, I'd say YES!!!!!

https://www.strongfirst.com/the-best-all-around-training-method-ever/? i wanted to report the last 6 months of training and ask the community for feedback and share the insights started following this program with very slight modifications 2 days a week, 1 day volume with reps, 1 day focused...
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What's more, it also allows you to do some strength training alongside it (pushups and pullups in your case).
 
Bauer said:
I think you've already received some cautious and good answers + relevant questions.

What are your restrictions? Are you allowed to go to high HR?
Click to expand...
Thanks for your answer, it helped a lot.

My Maximum heartrate is 160. When i do Snatches, it is around 120-140. Which is great for me. When i am Jogging it goes Up to 160.
 
rickdalton said:
Thanks for your answer, it helped a lot.

My Maximum heartrate is 160. When i do Snatches, it is around 120-140. Which is great for me. When i am Jogging it goes Up to 160.
Click to expand...
Sounds great!

Again, Clean & Jerk would be my recommendation, but following the protocol from AXE with snatches would also work well, IMO.
 
rickdalton said:
Thank you very much for your answers, I'm really pleased.

I have a medical check-up every 6 months. I don't have any restrictions. As long as I don't go beyond my capacity. For example, I shouldn't keep running if I'm already exhausted.

Training with push ups, pull ups, burpees and kettlebells was the quickest, easiest and safest way for me to do something with my body. It feels really good for me.

I don't actually do much else. I go for a relaxed jog and walk the dog a lot.

I actually taught myself the exercises using mirrors and YouTube. At first I practiced clean and jerk with 10 kg. Just the execution. As I come from a tennis background, I'm no stranger to technical execution. It took me a long time to get better at it. But I have patience .

So TL;Dr:

No restrictions. Just calisthenics and kettlebells. In my opinion, these are simply the best methods for getting really fit and healthy.
Click to expand...
I would still like clarification on what you are actually doing currently for snatch/clean and jerk. Sets of 1? Sets of 3? Sets of multiple minutes without rest?
 
John K said:
I would still like clarification on what you are actually doing currently for snatch/clean and jerk. Sets of 1? Sets of 3? Sets of multiple minutes without rest?
Click to expand...
I just do Something every day, without a plan. Snatch i do Intervalls. 10 x 1 Minute, with 1 minute pause. Sometimes i do 1,2,3 minutes, then down 3,2,1. Clean and Jerk i simply do 5 reps, walk a bit, then again 5 reps, and so on.

Every other day i do Calisthenics. In the morning, most days, i do Burpees.
 
rickdalton said:
I just do Something every day, without a plan. Snatch i do Intervalls. 10 x 1 Minute, with 1 minute pause. Sometimes i do 1,2,3 minutes, then down 3,2,1. Clean and Jerk i simply do 5 reps, walk a bit, then again 5 reps, and so on.

Every other day i do Calisthenics. In the morning, most days, i do Burpees.
Click to expand...
Are you looking at building timed sets similar to “Girevoy sport,” or are you looking at something more “hard style” with shorter heavier sets?
 
You are not very specific about what kind of movements you like to be doing.

In the summer and spring I like to run in stairs. Short and explosive, with 10 seconds on and 40-60 seconds break. 10-15 repetitions.
When it is hot outside I also sometimes like to do short intervals with swimming.
And finally zone 2 training is also low hanging fruit that is easy on the knees, easy on your adrenaline, easy on the brain, you feel that it is pure meditation. I like to do them in silence while staring into the wall.
 
You guys are great, really.

The Hardstyle method is, for me, the better Option i think. My goal is to bei as strong as possible at a low weight - with very very good conditioning. Because of my pacemaker i cannot be a Bodybuilder, that will Not function:).

What movements i want?

I experienced, that i feel best with Clean and Jerk, Snatch and all Calisthenics exercises. I had No injury in two years.
 
rickdalton said:
You guys are great, really.

The Hardstyle method is, for me, the better Option i think. My goal is to bei as strong as possible at a low weight - with very very good conditioning. Because of my pacemaker i cannot be a Bodybuilder, that will Not function:).

What movements i want?

I experienced, that i feel best with Clean and Jerk, Snatch and all Calisthenics exercises. I had No injury in two years.
Click to expand...
What is making you look for a change after two years?
 
John K said:
What is making you look for a change after two years?
Click to expand...
Very good question.

I've done everything freestyle so far. Without a plan, just according to how my body felt. Now I feel good so far and would like to continue with a clear plan. But your question is very good. Maybe there's no master plan and I should just get better at the exercises that I'm now quite good at.
 
rickdalton said:
Very good question.

I've done everything freestyle so far. Without a plan, just according to how my body felt. Now I feel good so far and would like to continue with a clear plan. But your question is very good. Maybe there's no master plan and I should just get better at the exercises that I'm now quite good at.
Click to expand...
I think there is a lot of value to training by how you feel, especially in light of you health challenges.

I can guarantee you that you are right, there is no master plan. There are many plans that MIGHT help, but you will have to use your own intuition while implementing and set up your guard rails.

A clean and jerk focused plan: The Best All-Around Training Method EVER | StrongFirst

A snatch-focused plan: The Snatch Walking Protocol for Ultra-Athletes | StrongFirst

You can easily do 2 days of C&J and 1 day of snatch walking per week, and have plenty of "room" in your schedule for fitting in your calisthenics. I would make sure you are getting in some form of squatting and some form of horizontal pulling as well, weighted or bodyweight.
 
John K said:
I think there is a lot of value to training by how you feel, especially in light of you health challenges.

I can guarantee you that you are right, there is no master plan. There are many plans that MIGHT help, but you will have to use your own intuition while implementing and set up your guard rails.

A clean and jerk focused plan: The Best All-Around Training Method EVER | StrongFirst

A snatch-focused plan: The Snatch Walking Protocol for Ultra-Athletes | StrongFirst

You can easily do 2 days of C&J and 1 day of snatch walking per week, and have plenty of "room" in your schedule for fitting in your calisthenics. I would make sure you are getting in some form of squatting and some form of horizontal pulling as well, weighted or bodyweight.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much.

I am anything but a training expert. But training according to how my body feels has helped me a lot. You get an incredible amount of information in this day and age. And it feels like everyone says something different. If you go by how your body feels, your ego gets in the way. You think you're not doing enough. You think you are doing something wrong. That can be very confusing.

Today I trained for 20 minutes with 5 snatches of EMOM. Then 5 sets of 15 push ups. It felt great.
 
rickdalton said:
Thank you very much.

I am anything but a training expert. But training according to how my body feels has helped me a lot. You get an incredible amount of information in this day and age. And it feels like everyone says something different. If you go by how your body feels, your ego gets in the way. You think you're not doing enough. You think you are doing something wrong. That can be very confusing.

Today I trained for 20 minutes with 5 snatches of EMOM. Then 5 sets of 15 push ups. It felt great.
Click to expand...
Honestly, it doesn't matter so long as you are being progressive in some way over time. More sets, more reps, less time, heavier weight, easier effort, etc. Not all at once, hopefully obviously. All ways to measure "progress."

Eventually your 20 sets of 5 and 5 sets of 15 turn into 20 sets of 10 and 5 sets of 30, yet it feels the same.
 
John K said:
Honestly, it doesn't matter so long as you are being progressive in some way over time. More sets, more reps, less time, heavier weight, easier effort, etc. Not all at once, hopefully obviously. All ways to measure "progress."

Eventually your 20 sets of 5 and 5 sets of 15 turn into 20 sets of 10 and 5 sets of 30, yet it feels the same.
Click to expand...
So i would do for the next 6 months:

A+A protocol with Snatch and CJ - 1-2 times per week, sometimes switch to the snatch Walking protocol

2-3 times a week Calisthenics without ego (Not going to hard, perfect execution, more sets with fewer Reps), some squats and jumps (i did these the last few weeks and felt great)
 
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