After Hypertrophy, Next Program?

Discussion in 'Kettlebell' started by MarkSch, Nov 14, 2017.

  1. MarkSch

    MarkSch Triple-Digit Post Count

    Hi everyone. I'm finishing up 12 weeks of Geoff Neupert's 'Kettlebell Muscle'(KM), and need to pick a new program. I'm hoping for some advice, and I have a few questions for the forum:

    1)-Geoff recommends a taking a week off, while still eating as per the program. Does this mean only recovery type activities, ( windmills, Fast and Loose, S&S stretches, walking, etc) or could S&S be used here?

    2)-Going forward, what's a good next program? I'm sure I will get suggestions for ROP, and while it's a great program, it tends to beat me up a lot, and its not a personal favorite.

    3)-Is a fat loss/conditioning program like 10,000 swings or 300/daily a good followup for KM? I don't want to impede any muscle gains, but I am feeling kinda tubby , and could stand to lose some fat.

    I'd be interested in anything y'all have to say.
    Thanks in advance.
  2. Shawn90

    Shawn90 Triple-Digit Post Count

    #3 Swing challenges work like a charm for fat loss in my experience. But take a "light" bell.
    MarkSch likes this.
  3. MikeTheBear

    MikeTheBear Strong Member of the Forum

    #1 Off means off, although you could take some walks if you want.

    #3 A good choice. Most who have done the 10,000 swings program have reported fat loss along with muscle gain. If you do Dan John's version of the 10,000 swings, which includes doing strength moves in between sets of swings, you should have no problem keeping your gains.
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  4. Kettlebelephant

    Kettlebelephant Strong, Powerful Member of the Forum

    Another option would be KB Strong so the next time you go for KB Muscle you can use a heavier pair of bells.
  5. Marc

    Marc Helping Make Others Stronger

    KB Strong would be my suggestion, too.
    There is strength, hypertrophy and conditioning option included within and how to combine it.

    As for off activities: walking and stretches will do you good if you feel like doing it. If you do not, don't bother
  6. Mark Limbaga

    Mark Limbaga Strong Member of the Forum Certified Instructor

    First question... what is your goal?
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  7. J Petersen

    J Petersen SFG1/SFB Certified Instructor

    While I respect that it is not a program that you particularly care for, I'm curious as to why the RoP is more punishing for you than (in my view) the more intensive 12-week KB Muscle programming? Have you already achieved a strict half bodyweight clean and press? A classic piece of simplistic advice from the Chief is that if a man cannot do this, then the RoP is our hypertrophy plan.

    If you already have a strong foundation with swings (in the past, my benchmark with students was when men could demonstrate the ability to perform 300 hardstyle two-armed swings with a 24k in 15 minutes or less any and every day of the week and feel 100% recovered by the next session), I am a big believer in Coach Dan John's 10k challenge. Over the course of the month, you'll have plenty of time to figure out the way forward--it's only a four or five week commitment, after all. When it's over and done with, you'll be in a great position to take on whatever plan of attack you will have devised.
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  8. MarkSch

    MarkSch Triple-Digit Post Count

    Nice feedback, thanks to everyone.
    I'll answer in order:

    For 'light', would you say 24K fits the bill? I've achieved Simple, and am running KB with 2 20K bells (very challenging, BTW!)

    OK, Off=off. I'll try not to feel guilty, and enjoy the change of pace.

    I don't own KB Strong, but will look into it. Is it more like ROP, pure strength as opposed to muscle building?

    @Mark Limbaga
    Heh, succinct. I think it would be fat loss. For KB Muscle, I tried to eat clean, and added protein powder to my usual diet, but I look and feel chubbier than I would like. That was the case prior to starting KB Muscle ,BTW. I certainly don't want to lose my modest hypertrophy gains, but most people here have assured me that's not so much an issue.

    @J Petersen
    Personally, ROP is punishing in a quite different way. KB Muscle was fairly easy with 2 16K bells last year, after achieving Simple. This year, with 2 20K bells, it's a real challenge: serious fatigue, serious breathing challenge, and the volume/rest time changes increase the hurt even more . However, the routines are fairly short and constrained, so it feels manageable in an "enjoy the pain" way, to me at least.
    ROP, especially at full rungs, just goes on. and. on. I usually try to do shorter rest periods, with an eye to hypertrophy, but maybe I need more rest to maximize pure strength gains. That then becomes a time issue: I'd liek a shorter, but effective practice.
    A 1/2 BW for me would be 40K and no, I haven't done that yet. I last ran ROP with 32K, and was doing well until hand wound issues made me quit: no sense ripping myself up every two days, so I changed to S&S to regroup, which is always effective but not damaging for me.
    I think I have your desired base for swings, though I haven't done that particular test yet. Thanks for the 10000 swing information.
  9. Shawn90

    Shawn90 Triple-Digit Post Count

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  10. Stefan Olsson

    Stefan Olsson Triple-Digit Post Count

    Maybe continue with @Geoff Neupert program and do a round of Kettlebell Burn 2.0? If you feel a bit tubby this might be a good routine for the next 16 weeks.
  11. Kettlebelephant

    Kettlebelephant Strong, Powerful Member of the Forum

    For me and a lot of other people on this forum it has by far the best instruction for the double KB drills out there, only surpassed by personal coaching by an SFG.
    The routine consists of three phases. Phase 1 is pure strength. Phase 2 is hypertrophy and you can choose from two different versions (one short, one long). Phase 3 is conditioning.
    The phases are designed to be done in succession, meaning you start the strength phase with a weight that you struggle to do 5 reps with and by the time you finish the phase you should be able to crank out enough reps with that weight to use it for the hypertrophy phase and after that the conditioning phase.
    Even though the phases build on each other you can decide to do only one of them. Just pick an apropriate weight and you can just jump right into the hypertrophy routine without doing the strength phase first. Or if pure strength is your goal do the strength phase and at the end instead of transitioning into the hypertrophy part just start the strength phase again but this time with a heavier pair of KBs.
    All of the 3 phases are designed to be done with grinds (mainly press, C&P, front squat). For ballistics (swings, snatches, cleans) there's an additional conditioning routine in the book which is called ONE. You can do that on its own or combine it with either the strength or one of the hypertrophy phases.
    So whether you want to work strength, hypertrophy, conditioning, strength & conditioning or hypertrophy & conditioning is totally up to you. KB Strong has a version for every of those goals.
  12. conor78

    conor78 Helping Make Others Stronger

    The One program is fantastic, a real gut check..bring a bucket if you run with it in your Strong Routine
  13. Stefan Olsson

    Stefan Olsson Triple-Digit Post Count

    Reminds me of my goal .. when I reach Simple, I will buy STRONG!
  14. Abdul Rasheed

    Abdul Rasheed Strong Member of the Forum

    Thanks for the write up. I hope to do this one day. There was a sale a couple of years back (gold, platinum), I bought it and STRONG was not part of it. I wish there is a sale for it this Thanksgiving ;)
  15. MarkSch

    MarkSch Triple-Digit Post Count

  16. Mark Limbaga

    Mark Limbaga Strong Member of the Forum Certified Instructor

    Kb burn or atos1.0 from KB workout snacks by Hector Gutierrez Jr. Sr SFG
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  17. MarkSch

    MarkSch Triple-Digit Post Count

    @Mark Limbaga
    Thanks: both programs you mention are free, to my astonishment. (Although Geoff Neupert's KB Burn 2.0 has bonus videos section that at $20 looks like a real bargain).

    I've added links to both, since these seem like great resources.
    KB Burn:
    Home | Kettlebell Burn | Best Kettlebell Workouts And Workout Routines
    KB Workout Snacks -(Great name, I have not seen this instructor before.)
    Hardsyle KBJJ

    I'll review them, but it seems programs like this will fit my schedule better than 10000 swings, at least until the new year. I'd still like to try it sometime, just to have completed it.

    I'd like to give a general thanks to everyone who offered advice. This is absolutely the friendliest and most helpful place on the Internet --would that every site was like this one.
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