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Kettlebell Back soreness from swings

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Max Parish

Level 4 Valued Member
Certified Instructor
Hello,

I’m seeking some advice regarding some lower back discomfort.

I started S&S about 5 weeks ago, starting with a 24k bell for swings and TGUs. I had been using a 16k for months doing various things, waiting for my heavier bells to arrive. The 24k felt good. Both movements felt strong and not overly difficult. However, about 3 weeks ago, I started noticing some discomfort in my lower back. (Elsewhere on the forum, I said it was one week ago, but on reflection, it’s been longer.) I’m still confused about why. I’m fairly certain it’s not from breaking too early on the down-swing. When I get swinging again, I’ll post a video for a form check. Anyway, here are the details on my back.

When I first noticed the feeling, I paid extra close attention to try to maintain perfect form on every swing. But the tight sensation didn’t go away. So the following week (last week), I did 2H swings only. It didn’t go away. If anything, got a bit worse. So I’ve stopped swinging for now. I'm pretty sure it was the swings, since my GUs feel fine.

I wouldn’t call it pain. It feels like a sore or strained muscle – a small area on my lower back, only on the right side. When walking, standing, sitting, and most other exercises, I can sometimes feel it there, but no discomfort. I can do KB deadlifts with no negative sensation at all, and planks and military presses held with a tight core feel fine. I feel discomfort only when I bend toward my left side, which stretches that right back muscle. Even then, it doesn’t really hurt. It just feels like stretching a sore muscle.

First, do you think it’s best to take a break from all strength movements? This week I’ve been doing weighted pull-ups, KB military presses, and pistol squats on MWF (on T/TH just walking and crawls). None of these seem to affect my back, but they obviously still activate it. Is it better to lay off all strength work? I want to get back to S&S ASAP, and I know that means resting properly.

Second question: are there good resources out there on fixing this sort of back issue? Once it’s fixed, then I’ll need to fix my swing form, but one thing at a time.

I sit at a desk all day for work, but work from home so I can get up whenever I want, go hang from my pull-up bar, do some presses, etc. I typically train in the morning and walk for about an hour each evening after work.

Max
 
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Could still be a technique issue. And +1 to stretching. For me the learning really started once I started using the 24kg KB because I could get away with a lot of little oversights with the 16 and 20kg KB.
 
Not to disagree with any of the above, but I found the pullup bar hangs helped quite a bit with low back tightness.

Also, +1 to Nate's recommendation of Stuart McGill's work.
 
All - Many thanks for the responses!

@natewhite39 - Are there links to free information, or should I buy a book?

@Anna C - I do the QL straddle and 90/90 after every S&S session, and often in the evenings before bed (along with other stretches). I haven't noticed any significant differences in ROM, but possibly some decreased range in my leg angle in the straddle.

Here are my two hypotheses for what went wrong. First, I might have been rushing the first portion of the swing. I swung a 16k for a few months while waiting for my heavier bells. Eventually I started using my lats to accelerate the downswing, and use a very fast hipthrust to generate a quick upswing. That was the only way I felt it working my body. I might have gotten overly used to that rhythm. While I have not been accelerating the downswing with my 24k, I might be trying to accelerate the upswing at the wrong time. If I start too early, before the bell has started to reverse motion into the upswing, I might be using my lower back just a bit to accelerate it. I did notice that my back felt a bit better when I would slow things down and take a tad more time coming out of the bottom of the hip hinge, before sharply thrusting with the hips.

Here's my second, more recent hypothesis. My hamstrings have felt tight in the bottom of the hip hinge position, but I didn't notice until Anna C asked about stretching that my right hamstring is tighter than my left. Maybe my body is accomodating by bending slightly less on the right side, which would skew my tail slightly right, which would tighten up that right part of the lower back. This is consistent with something else I noticed. I thought at first that my right knee was caving a bit when doing 1H swings with my right hand. Pressing my knees out didn't seem to make much difference, so I moved on to other hypotheses. But maybe my knee was caving, but only as a symptom of a tight hamstring. Or, maybe it had the appearance of caving inward (to the left) because of my tail being skewed to the right.

I'm thinking it might be best to take some time off all strength exercises and focus on walking, stretching, bar hangs, crawls, and whatever Dr. McGill recommends.
 
Max Parish said:
@Anna C - I do the QL straddle and 90/90 after every S&S session, and often in the evenings before bed (along with other stretches). I haven't noticed any significant differences in ROM, but possibly some decreased range in my leg angle in the straddle.
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That sounds good!

An unlikely culprit, but just in case on the "too much" side -- don't try to be too aggressive with the stretches.

On the "maybe not enough" side, try giving yourself an extra 10 minutes with the stretches every few days to gently wait out the tension, especially in the QL straddle If you are patient, you may find a point several minutes in where all of a sudden the tension reduces and you find another few inches of lateral bend. Maybe something to do while reading or watching TV.
 
Max Parish said:
Thanks to both of you!
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This is probably not the issue but I thought certain things were causing me discomfort but it all seems to come back to how I SLEPT. Got some issue with my neck/left shoulder/middle back. Could be from a slipped disc I had a while ago but I’m not sure. All I know is if I wake up on my stomach or my side my day is gonna be rough.
 
All great advice .

I would also take a look at your swing technique... That will also give clues
 
I'm in the same boat, I've been doing the swings for a few weeks and decided to move from 16kg to 24kg. The first day I did my 10 sets replacing two with the 24kg and was fine, yesterday I started getting lower back tightness but finished the sets. Today it was getting really tight again so I stopped at 8 sets because I don't want to injure myself. I'm pretty sure it's my form... it seems like you can get away with a lot more at 16kg. Going to rest for a day or two and work on my form, but I also just want to say thanks to the people for the resources posted here.
 
DanOlson said:
I'm in the same boat, I've been doing the swings for a few weeks and decided to move from 16kg to 24kg. The first day I did my 10 sets replacing two with the 24kg and was fine, yesterday I started getting lower back tightness but finished the sets. Today it was getting really tight again so I stopped at 8 sets because I don't want to injure myself. I'm pretty sure it's my form... it seems like you can get away with a lot more at 16kg. Going to rest for a day or two and work on my form, but I also just want to say thanks to the people for the resources posted here.
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Yeah, you can "muscle through" the lighter weights (true for any weight training, really) with poor form, but as the weight goes up, the form has to be dialed in.

One thing I would suggest for the swings at the heavier weight. Go back to the beginning. What I mean is, after your first two sets with the 16, do the beginning drills again with the 24 (the hike and stop, the deadlifts, etc) to help you feel the technique with the heavier bell.
 
Thanks to those who have tuned in here. I'm swinging again, but only 2H so far. I still feel some tightness in my back, but it has diminished. I recently started the three main exercises Dr. Stu McGill recommends in his "Back Mechanic". Those feel good. Also some very light windmills, which feel like they precisely target that part of my back.

I'll post a form check video soon of my swings.
 
Hello -

I have some updates on my back condition, and I have a few questions. First, the questions.

Before much longer, I’d like some virtual coaching sessions with an instructor to dial in my swing (my current goal is achieving simple with S&S). What’s the best way to inquire about cost and schedule some coaching sessions? I prefer someone with plenty of experience.

Before I do some coaching, I need to correct some imbalances in my body. I’m interested in movement/program recommendations that help with that. Here’s some background.

After a few months of doing swings, I started developing some soreness in lower back, only on the right side. Details are in the thread above. My back wasn’t improving, even though I shifted only to 2H swings. So I’ve stopped swinging for the past week or so, incorporating some of Dr. McGill's movements. I’ve been trying to analyze myself closely. Here’s what I’ve observed.
  1. After a pointer from @Anna C , I’ve been paying close attention to my QL stretch. I’m not sure if I just didn’t notice my asymmetry as much before, or if it’s gotten worse. In any case, I can go much further bending to the right (which is stretching my lower right back) than to the left. Stretching cold, its probably 3-5 inch difference; a bit less stretching warm. I think it’s a combination of differential flexibility both in my lower back and hip.
  2. After a recommendation by @Brett Jones , I tried the “fingers to the back drill” with a band. I whammed into that band on the first swing, and kept founding it difficult to avoid touching the band. Clearly, I’m overextending at the top of my swing. I’ve found one reason why. When I tried locking into the standing plank, and then stretching out my arms (unweighted) as though in the top of the swing, being careful not to shift my body angle at all, I was startled at how much my weight shifted to my toes. I realized that in an attempt to pack my shoulders, I’ve been pulling my whole upper body back. This centers the weight over my feet, but also causes my lower back to go into extension. Because of the muscle memories I’ve built, standing perfectly straight with my arms extended, it almost feels like I’m bent forward at the hips. I’m going to have to work on wearing some new grooves, focusing on counterbalancing the forward motion of the bell by bending slightly from the ankles, not the lower back.
  3. It feels like my glutes are shutting off at the bottom of the hip hinge. I can get a strong contraction in the standing plank position, but in the bottom, it’s very hard to feel them activate.
  4. I’ve been experimenting with foot positioning, trying more of a parallel foot stance the past month or so. However, I recently read Brett Jones’s article on the Lock and Rock, and found not only that my feet naturally angle out a fair bit, but my left angles out more than my right. The left is almost 45 degrees. The right is less, maybe closer to 30 degrees. I haven’t measured exactly. Probably the more parallel stance has been bad for me.
  5. I recently did a 1H KB squat, with the bell in the racked position. I was startled at how different it felt from my right to left side. After several sets, it feels like they’ve mostly evened out. However, I know I have imbalances in my squat movement (it’s easier to do pistol squats on the left than the right).
  6. My right hamstring has been noticeably tighter than the left. I’ve been working on it, and it’s improved. But I worry that’s causing me to skew a bit at the bottom of the hip hinge.
To give my back a break for a few weeks, I’m temporarily joining my wife doing Zonin’s Simple Strength program. I’m using 1H KB squats, KB MPs, pull-ups, and then suitcase carries and crawling most days. (I’ve stopped swinging for about two weeks and the soreness is nearly gone now, which is nice.)

But I suspect there are better ways to correct imbalances. Should I be working on light windmills? Those hit the sore area in my back. It occurs to me that renegade rows might be good for the core and back in building back up to the 1H KB swing. Are there other movements that are known for effectively correcting imbalances?

Thanks for any advice.

Max
 
Anna C said:
An unlikely culprit, but just in case on the "too much" side -- don't try to be too aggressive with the stretches
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I do want to add, there was a long period of discomfort on my left side of my lower back while I was working up to the 24kg bell. And one of the things that helped was favoring a strong neutral back during the 90-90 stretch. I would catch myself collapsing the form and allowing the lower back to compromise during the stretch, and reset with a steady strong back. When I treated it more strictly as though my upper body was hinging at the hip joint I get a different stretching sensation, which positively affected my lower back.
Max Parish said:
Are there other movements that are known for effectively correcting imbalances?
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Also, in my case, favoring the 2H swing in my practice helped ameliorated some of the discomfort. And in my opinion managing my programming allowed me to get some symmetry built up in the posterior chain. And now that I'm stronger that back pain problem has become infinitesimally small. It's still there ; but only just.
I think that when I was performing the 2H swing more like 3/4 sessions, it seemed to help over time allow the weaker side catch up.
 
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I had a similar issue with lower back. These really helped me - I do them daily:

1. Butterfly dances before Flower (10 reps): Pavel Macek on Instagram: ““Get up, my friend. Enough sleep.” “What time is it?” The boy clung to his blankets. “Very late. It’ll be dawn in an hour. This is the best…”

2. Brettzel stretch - 30 seconds each side

3. Sitting shoulder extension (Original Strength) - 30 seconds: How to Restore Your Posture - YouTube

4. Sitting spine rotation (Original Strength) - 30 seconds each side: Keeping a Healthy Spine - YouTube

5. Deep squat (bottom position of goblet squat, no weight/kb) - hold for 30 seconds.
 
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